Learning/rebuilding from my epic fail

Nice video buddy!
I hope some of them will be lucky enough and make it!
A friend of mine had the same thing and after two months he found three of them alive and grown in the sump:)
That was a very nice surprise.
Till this day we never discovered what they were eating all this time!
Hope that happens to you too:beer:
 
You have a really nice tank Matt.
What camera are you using to take the pics and lens?
I miss using halides, it just got too hot using 3 400 watt radiums, the colors were best when I used them. All your acros seem healthy and have great PE.
I have a pair of yellow watchman gobies that spawn frequently and I notice that some of my acros, and acans will occasionally catch the fry.
 
Thanks, everybody.. Unfortunately, I haven't seen any of the little guys in the past week.. I can only assume they are all gone but it was cool to see them
Zooming around for a while..


You have a really nice tank Matt.
What camera are you using to take the pics and lens?
I miss using halides, it just got too hot using 3 400 watt radiums, the colors were best when I used them. All your acros seem healthy and have great PE.
I have a pair of yellow watchman gobies that spawn frequently and I notice that some of my acros, and acans will occasionally catch the fry.

Thanks, Hung. I'm using a canon 70d with 100 mm macro L for the close ups. I have a viewing box to shoot down into the tank but my lights are pretty low so I can't quite get in all the way..
I used to have a million aptasia- up until about a week ago and I think they feasted on the babies.. The 40 or so peppermint shrimp have eradicated the aptasia, now..

So, since I got caught up in the BFC , I added a few new fish which in turn pushed my nutrients up! Thanks Andrew!! That's the last time I jump off a bridge JUST BECAUSE you said it was a good idea!! :)
I'm currently at 6-8ppm N and .12 P.
Corals are happy but I have a good amount of green cyano all over the place and my bryopsis is making a comeback. I guess I didn't keep the magnesium high enough for long enough..
So, mag is going back up to 1700-1800 for a few weeks. The cyano, I will not do anything about right now.. I have turned up my aio pellets a touch so I'll see if this makes the cyano better or worse..

Now, a little issue to get feedback on..

I currently have 3x150w DE Radiums along with my t5s.. I'm feeling that I am not quite getting the colour intensity I could get out of some of my more light loving corals..
I think I'm going to upgrade the two outside 150s to 250s.. I have 250w de sockets sitting around and could take an hour and swap out the 150w de sockets for 250w de sockets but doing this will preclude my ability to use radiums!!!!
My other option is to buy new mogul 250w cayman sun reflectors so that I can use the 250w radiums...
So.... The conundrum is this.. Pay $250 for new reflectors so that I can continue to use Radiums or spend the hour, swap out the sockets and go with XM 20 k (which I think is the next best thing to Radiums...?)
Thoughts?
 
Matt, my apologies...I rarely just look around in Reef Central, since I have quite a few threads subscribed to already. I tend to just check in on threads as they hit my email inbox. Imagine my surprise when I went onto the SPS forum today and found your thread near the top...It appears that at some point I accidentally unsubscribed:facepalm: I wasn't ignoring your thread on purpose!

My condolences on the passing of your father, Its something I will probably be dealing with in the not too distant future. Im happy for you that you were able to be with him.

I'm very happy for the turn for the better that your tank has taken, wowza! the corals are looking fantastic and i love that the FTS are filling in now. You have some real stunners in there. Im also glad to see that the pellets are pretty dialed in now. Ill second what Joe said about getting nitrate closer to 5 rather than 1 - I see zero negatives from keeping the value higher.

As for the lights, I would bite the bullet and switch out to mogul sockets so you can run Radiums. No matter how well the tank does under a substitute, it will nag at you whether it can be even better with Radiums. If you end up switching later, you will just be paying for the setup twice. Can you get away with 2 250 watt bulbs? I would think that 2 250s will put out much more light than 3 150s, and you can fill in for coverage with the T5s.

I can't recall- are the Mitras still in the mix somewhere?


Anyhow, keep up the good work and thanks for all the awesome Acro pics!
 
What was you said? "Preaching to the Choir?" You know what you need/want to do, so get on with it! Biggles will NEVER let you live it down if you go with XM's and you'll be ****ed when you see me burning 250R's :) What fish did you add?
 
Matt, my apologies...I rarely just look around in Reef Central, since I have quite a few threads subscribed to already. I tend to just check in on threads as they hit my email inbox. Imagine my surprise when I went onto the SPS forum today and found your thread near the top...It appears that at some point I accidentally unsubscribed:facepalm: I wasn't ignoring your thread on purpose!

My condolences on the passing of your father, Its something I will probably be dealing with in the not too distant future. Im happy for you that you were able to be with him.

I'm very happy for the turn for the better that your tank has taken, wowza! the corals are looking fantastic and i love that the FTS are filling in now. You have some real stunners in there. Im also glad to see that the pellets are pretty dialed in now. Ill second what Joe said about getting nitrate closer to 5 rather than 1 - I see zero negatives from keeping the value higher.

As for the lights, I would bite the bullet and switch out to mogul sockets so you can run Radiums. No matter how well the tank does under a substitute, it will nag at you whether it can be even better with Radiums. If you end up switching later, you will just be paying for the setup twice. Can you get away with 2 250 watt bulbs? I would think that 2 250s will put out much more light than 3 150s, and you can fill in for coverage with the T5s.

I can't recall- are the Mitras still in the mix somewhere?


Anyhow, keep up the good work and thanks for all the awesome Acro pics!

No worries, Matt!
Thanks for the kind words.. If you know it's coming, make sure to say what you want to say before you can't say it anymore. It's a surreal and sad thing... Just takes time.. Like everything..

Yeah, things are looking pretty good, corals are pretty happy.. My n is back up and so is my p... Pellets are almost at full flow right now. I'm about to leave on vacation so I'm not going to chang much right now.
With new fish and magnesium up (which I assume is stunting the growth of my cheato) to kill of my returning bryopsis, the nutrients are high. With me gone, my mom won't be adding as much food, so I'll let it be for now.

I was actually thinking of keeping the 150 in the middle and put the two 250s on either side.
My mitras are now completely out of the picture...
 
What was you said? "Preaching to the Choir?" You know what you need/want to do, so get on with it! Biggles will NEVER let you live it down if you go with XM's and you'll be ****ed when you see me burning 250R's :) What fish did you add?

Yep.. You guys are soooo right! I'll switch to mogul and go 250 radium...
I have no idea why I was even considering anything else!
I added a copper band butterfly, yellow tang and a kole tang.. I wanted more algae eaters and an aptasia control but the peppermint shrimp have finished them off..
 
Yep.. You guys are soooo right! I'll switch to mogul and go 250 radium...
I have no idea why I was even considering anything else!
I added a copper band butterfly, yellow tang and a kole tang.. I wanted more algae eaters and an aptasia control but the peppermint shrimp have finished them off..

Not really a big number of fish, the CP eats like a bird so really just the yellow and the kole adding more waste to the water. Intersting to read how thins look after the vay-K. Have a good one!
 
Oh.. Also added a pretty large pyramid butterfly..
I'm interested to see things when I get home as well!
 
Oh.. Also added a pretty large pyramid butterfly..
I'm interested to see things when I get home as well!

You told me that fish was for your client's tank! Shame on you, Matt!

Tank looks great. Can't wait to see you get an explosion of growth. I expect to see your tank on the front page at some point!
 
Hey Chris.. Yeah your pyramid was for a client.. I got one from Raja a few weeks ago. He's the one in my tank.

Thanks! Still getting bits of growth here and there.. No explosion, yet.. Maybe that's just as well.. Super high growth tanks fill up so fast, you don't have time to buy a kajillion frags to see which ones will turn into beauts!
 
Hey Chris.. Yeah your pyramid was for a client.. I got one from Raja a few weeks ago. He's the one in my tank.

Thanks! Still getting bits of growth here and there.. No explosion, yet.. Maybe that's just as well.. Super high growth tanks fill up so fast, you don't have time to buy a kajillion frags to see which ones will turn into beauts!

Oh, I thought from your last post, you'd put in the one you got from me as well.

I have a question for you. How frequently do you test Ca/Alk/Mg? Obviously as you dose Mg for the briopsis you'd keep a better eye on it, but when you're not doing that? I know you use a Calcium reactor and add PurpleUp, but are you testing frequently, or relying on gut instinct for having the right levels of dosage.
 
Purple up only goes in my ro water, just to re mineralize it..
I test cal/alk n/p twice a week- or I have been for the past 8 months.
I test mag a few times a day, at the moment.
When everything is running smoothly, once a week is my usual routine..
Running smoothly, however hasn't quite happened yet...
If I can deal with this bryopsis once and for all and get p down, I'll be happy..
For better or worse, I stopped relying on gut instinct when I started this tank up 3 years ago

When I get back from vacation, I'll see how things look and if nutrients are still up and the cyano is still rampant, I will begin playing with some bacterial additives...
 
Purple up only goes in my ro water, just to re mineralize it..
I test cal/alk n/p twice a week- or I have been for the past 8 months.
I test mag a few times a day, at the moment.
When everything is running smoothly, once a week is my usual routine..
Running smoothly, however hasn't quite happened yet...
If I can deal with this bryopsis once and for all and get p down, I'll be happy..
For better or worse, I stopped relying on gut instinct when I started this tank up 3 years ago

When I get back from vacation, I'll see how things look and if nutrients are still up and the cyano is still rampant, I will begin playing with some bacterial additives...
Matt, I suggest you re-read the first page of this thread. I did, and a couple of things struck me:
1) Your previous tank was friggin stunning - and you state that it went downhill when you started chasing numbers. Perhaps there is a lesson in that;)
2) You said that you had about forty fish in there. I counted fish in the one picture and saw 27 in view! Perhaps it was way more than 40 - if so your BFC was probably quite respectable. Fish poo, man. You said all you added was fish food and that reef was the result.


All I am trying to say is let the reef do its thing, try not to stress about getting the numbers to some standard. The corals will look great without that much tweaking....
 
Hey Matt.. You make a good point, absolutely...
Here's where I'm at on philosophy.. And one clarification.

The pics of the tank at the beginning of this thread were indeed my old tank- it was a 500 gallon system with a Deltec ap 1004 skimmer which was rated at like 2000 gallons or something.. I had a 50 gal sump with a 250w mh over it growing cheato like it was a weed on steroids...
I never tested anything but alk on it and fed rediculous amounts of food. Probably had about 40 fish.. Yes maybe more..
I tore this tank down after about two ish years to do renovations. I'm not sure where it would have been in another year without any testing...

I believe this tank thrived on pure dumb luck. I set up a large enough system with overly large support and it coasted blindly along until I tore it down.

With the first version of my current system, which is smaller in every way, I chased numbers into the ground. But more importantly, I tried to change and tweak something every week as things got worse and worse. Each change I made, I hoped would miraculously fix the tank but each change only made things worse..

When I re started this tank- along with starting this thread, I promised myself to be more patient and prudent.
I believe that there is such thing as beneficial tweaking, it just has to be done with patience and observation.
Last month, I had been stable and healthy with an n of 5 and p of around .12. Things were fine..
However, I don't believe this to be optimal conditions.. Yes I could have left it like that but I wanted to do some 'beneficial tweaking'. I upped the flow a bit on my aio pellet reactor and upped my n additions a bit to compensate.. This adjustment lowered n to about 2 and p to about .07- which is closer to where I want to be- maybe n a bit higher- and maybe p a bit lower.. And really, not a huge change...
This brought an immediate green (not red) cyano outbreak and then I added more fish which raised my n and p back to where they were before..
All in all not a huge change in husbandry, but for some reason a huge impact on the system..
My goal is to get numbers into a range that is both balanced and closer to accepted norms- for me, n in the 5ppm range and p below .07
I have to say (sorry Andrew!) I'm not entirely on board with the bfc unless you are starting from a point of low nutrients. If you are having trouble controlling nutrients already, adding more fish isn't going to help, imo..
Yes, stability is key, no question. And changes should be done incrementally..
I do believe that changes can be positive.
Maybe I'm wrong on this one, but I think that stability at lower nutrient levels is better than stability at higher nutrients.. And I'm sure this point could be debated..
So, somewhere around tweaking my aio reactor, I messed with the balance and threw things off a bit but I don't think it was catastrophic.. I guess we'll see when I get home on Sunday.

The lesson in chasing numbers, imo, is that it needs to be done methodically- not that it shouldn't be done at all.. Perhaps another good debate.. :)
This hobby is full of potential debate, that's what makes it so addictive.. So many right ways of doing it... And so many ways to screw up!!
I will be testing everything when I get home, having a good hard look at the corals and then I will decide to act or just watch things.. But if I do act in some way, it won't be a drastic move, that's for sure..
 
I do believe that changes can be positive.
Maybe I'm wrong on this one, but I think that stability at lower nutrient levels is better than stability at higher nutrients.. And I'm sure this point could be debated..

I agree with you entirely on this one Matt, i also think the lower your nutrients the harder it is to maintain that stability. In other words, the lower you run your nutrients the 'twitchier' your water is and the less forgiving your system will be to sudden changes such as the good old reef goof we all fall victim to at one time or another. :)
 
Couldn't agree more with you guys!
But what's your opinion regarding the best way to have higher nutrients?
Just have many fish and feed them generously or something else/more?
 
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