life after ich

[Sleepy22]

So im pretty upset today.....all but 1 fish died within a matter of 8hrs

All that is left is 1 of the phantom clowns from the pair....i did a freshwater dip 2 all fish in the same temperature range and did a 20gal water change in a 40gal

Should i continue water changes(5gal a day) after stirring the substrate for the rest of the week?......any suggestions on how 2 get past this tragedy?

 

[bullitr]

life after ich

Ick doesnt kill that fast
Its mostly a velvet
Also i been in battle with ick for over ten years and ick can be control or can be eliminated if you are patient

Sorry for loss

 

[Sleepy22]

seen it on them last Wednesday and I have been doing water changes...I even dropped the salinity 1.016 and it seemed to help a lot but they all finally gave in 2day....jus 1 phantom left...hopefully it makes it

 

[greenhead]

Sleepy22, I have to agree with bullitr, ich usually doesn't have that high of a mortality rate. Unless of course the fish got really stressed. One thing to remember is fresh water dips do absolutely nothing to the ich on the fish. Hypo salinity in the tank helps a lot but you have to drop it very slowly and it is very stressful to the fish and coral won't survive. With ich you will usually see it start out slowly and even notice at points your fish will appear to get better. This is the tromont stage where the ich falls of the fish and goes down to your sand bed to hatch. This is usually when you notice from 1 fish having it to many fish having it since for one fish to infect another the tromont has to fall to the substrate and hatch in to a free swimming parasite and then can now look for other hosts. Tank bred clowns have been found to be fairly resilient to ich. Do you know if these photons were tank bred? Did they encounter any wild caught Clowns recently? Brooklynella is often also confused with ich. But everything you stated above points me towards marine velvet. It's an indiscriminate killer usually taking 90% + of the fish in a tank. And once you actually see it it's usually too late.

Either way you pretty much have 2 options now. Either way you will have to move the survivor to another system. A qt tank preferably. And either run your system fallow for 8 to 10 weeks since a new line of ich has been found to be able to lay dormant for 8 weeks. Velvet takes about 4 to 6 weeks to die off without a host. Now remember if you go fallow that nothing with gills can be in the tank. You can continue to grow and have coral without issues. But most people if they don't have coral and inverts in the tank prefer to pull everything and restart. Most bleaching the rock and using new sand. They even bleach the tank and all equipment. In this method you could theoretically be adding fish back in about a month. Clowns or chromis a little sooner. Just don't put the photon back in until he has been fully treated. I recommend a course of prazi and copper. Maybe even a furan dip or 2. But he needs to be observed for minimum 30 days.

 

[Sleepy22]

I will definitley look more into it and see how my little guy is doing.....im gonna be buying some sand sifters and a couple of conchs and then jus letting my corals/clams be by themselves 4 a while since water quality is near perfect 4 them anyway.....i still wonder how it came about since i havent added anything new(livstock or equip) 2 the tank in months other than the new RW pumps

 

[loup]

If you haven't added anything in 2 months its most likely ICH. By dropping salinity down to 1.016 might have killed off some bacteria which might cause a mini-cycle and a small ammonia spike which stress your fish out and allow ICH to finish the job.

 

[SammyJ916]

Sorry to hear about your loss. I am still amazed at how many introduce fish into their systems with absolutely no QT at all. A decent QT set up is so easy and assures the safety of all your other fish when done properly. Like stated above your best bet is to run your system fallow now to starve and kill whats inside your tank. Def sounds more like velvet or possibly brooklynella with it killing so many fish so fast. Hopefully more will take your experience and jump aboard and establish a proper QT method before introducing new inhabitants.

 

[Sleepy22]

I moved all the fish to a 10gal setup because i have some sps, clams, and lps in the display.....no rock or sand jus the tank and filter with carbon...1gal used water and jus under 8gallons and new mixed water with low salt.....i will definitley have a qt setup for the future from now on

Im still going to do alot of water changes in the 40 display jus 2 make sure this doesnt happen again once i introduce some new fish again......im going to start with 1 damsel a week in about a month

 

[robert s b.]

As we know there are 4 stages in the Ich life cycle

1- Trophont-this is the parasitic stage on the fish 3-7 days

2- Protomont-this is where the parasite leaves the fish to encyst on the substrate to reproduce. 24 hours

3-Tomont- This is the reproductive and longest lived stage 60+ days
This is the stage when people think they got rid of ich, and it pops up 2 months later.

4-Theront- Free swimming looking for a host. Will die within 24 hours without a host.

I advise not to put any fish in the display tank for the next 90 days to insure the ich has ran its life cycle and die off. QT all new fish, even damsels.

 

[psykobowler]

life after ich

Ozone for the masses....... I don't quarantine and try to kill my new purchases with chemicals. Buy and dump it in the display. It is more barbaric to chemically treat the tank and fish than to ozone the system to oblivion. If you think I am wrong come to my house and see for yourself.

Chemicals are not needed. Stop killing fish that way please.

 

[fishnerd]

Glenn,

Is it barbaeric when you get an infection, you take "chemicals" (aka medication)?
QT'ing is an observation and/or treatment place.

If ozone is so effective at erradicating disease, why is it not in every household? Or even commercial systems?

I think ozone has its uses but not for the blanket statement saying that it eliminates the diseases that infect our fish friends.

 

[loup]

Must be very lucky to not have velvet or brook wipe majority of your stock before ozone gathers 100% of the free floating disease to kill it. Lucky indeed. To each their own.

 

[psykobowler]

Guys, I am not totally against using chemicals as a means to an end. What I am saying is that people are misusing the chemicals and overdosing. I use coral revive to dip corals. But treating fish with chemicals is harse. I've had brook, marine velvet and other exoparasites. Yes, I had lost a whole fish system with one of these prior to ozone. I also lost another system to biopellets. I am not using a blanket statement. If the exoparasite has a free floating stage it will get sterilized. The ozone prevents outbreaks more than anything else.

Commercial systems do use ozone, even koi ponds have ozone equipment now.

People should use ozone. If it doesn't work why am I the only not complaining about losing fish? At the least use an appropriate size uv for your system.

 

[fishnerd]

Guys, I am not totally against using chemicals as a means to an end. What I am saying is that people are misusing the chemicals and overdosing. I use coral revive to dip corals. But treating fish with chemicals is harse. I've had brook, marine velvet and other exoparasites. Yes, I had lost a whole fish system with one of these prior to ozone. I also lost another system to biopellets. I am not using a blanket statement. If the exoparasite has a free floating stage it will get sterilized. The ozone prevents outbreaks more than anything else.

Commercial systems do use ozone, even koi ponds have ozone equipment now.

People should use ozone. If it doesn't work why am I the only not complaining about losing fish? At the least use an appropriate size uv for your system.

If commercial systems do use ozone then by your logic the ozone would have eliminated the parasites from traveling to the retail customers. Yes ozone is used in pools/koi ponds etc...but not for eliminating all diseases. Like I said previously, ozone has its uses, when used correctly.

You are saying use ozone and it will stop your fish from being infected. Buy fish and dump them straight in your tank when you have ozone. I feel that is a blanket statement. In fact you are recommended people to do the same because it is what works for you.

You are saying when people misuse chemicals/medications, it kills fish. The same holds true for ozone or anything for that matter. When used properly medication is not harsh. Much of the same medication we use is the same formulation for fish.

This can go on and on as we have a regular discussion about this matter with a friend of mine. The thing that bothers me most is that you can recommend fetting ozone to someone and tell them in the same breath you dont need to medicate/QT if you use ozone. Your system works well for you Glenn and have had the pleasure of seeing your crazy fish system, but cannot condone asking someone not to QT or medicate in lieu of ozone.

 

[JoshuaG]

Ozone for the masses....... I don't quarantine and try to kill my new purchases with chemicals. Buy and dump it in the display. It is more barbaric to chemically treat the tank and fish than to ozone the system to oblivion. If you think I am wrong come to my house and see for yourself.

Chemicals are not needed. Stop killing fish that way please.

This is just flat out terrible advice, I don't even know where to start.

 

[bullitr]

life after ich

I am the only pro ozone in the fish crazy group but even i observe, medicate and qt my fish because ozone do not cure all but they really helps control outbreak but wont and will never ever eliminate ick on reef tank but with that said fish will be better with ozone than without.

To OP you dont that much fish now take it out and start over. Go fallow for a while then qt your fish properly. I dont have that luxury to start over with fish.

Fresh water dip wont do anything for ick but definitely works good with flukes specially on large angels, tangs and butterfly. fresh water with prazipro works wonders but dont do it with fairy wrasse or other wrasses .

 

[drdoolittle]

This is getting good... Got my drink and popcorn ready..

 

[loup]

Hey now, I am pro ozone too. It makes my water crystal clear and save from monthly carbon change :spin3:

I am the only pro ozone in the fish crazy group but even i observe, medicate and qt my fish because ozone do not cure all but they really helps control outbreak but wont and will never ever eliminate ick on reef tank but with that said fish will be better with ozone than without.

To OP you dont that much fish now take it out and start over. Go fallow for a while then qt your fish properly. I dont have that luxury to start over with fish.

Fresh water dip wont do anything for ick but definitely works good with flukes specially on large angels, tangs and butterfly. fresh water with prazipro works wonders but dont do it with fairy wrasse or other wrasses .

 

[JoshuaG]

Bottom line ozone is simply nothing more than a preventative, just like UV. It can only kill what passes thru it in the water. Fish come in with any number of problems from worms to ich to velvet to brook to flukes to bacterial infections to fungal infections etc etc and ozone does ZERO to cure those problems and get the fish back to full health.

And no, you can't always tell visually what problems a fish has. Some of the diseases listed above a fish can look and act completely normal when you first get it and not show signs of disease for days or weeks later.

Anyone offering the advice to just buy fish from the LFS and dump in display either hasn't had their fish list get wiped out yet or didn't learn their lesson the first time.

 

[robert s b.]

I have always had ich in my tank and have done everything I could do to try to eradicate it. I do QT all of my fish for at least 3-4 weeks before it goes in my display. Even then they get infected. So what I did around March I took all my fishes out and put them all in quarantine for 4 weeks. Treated and waited.. Put them all back in and all was well. I bought a Regal, QT for 3 weeks, all look well until bam, infected, after 1 week in the main tank, caught him and QT'd again, but didn't go well and it died. So I said the hell with it, I bought Ozone Reactor, from Glen, one he had lying around and a generator from Sam. Got tired of Glen preaching in my ear, about Ozone, I was like :hmm5:. but I tried everything else, aside from breaking it down and starting all over. My verdict, I love it! Been running for close to 2 months. The true test was when I bought a Achilles Tang from Aqua Life, and we all know Tangs are VERY prone to Ich, and you know what, I didn't quarantine, I just acclimated and threw him in, he scuffled with my purple Tang for a few days, couple of war wounds..but never got infected with Ich (knock on wood), also bought Toms's Gold Flake and Melanurus wrasse was in QT while I was setting up the Ozone, maybe a few days before I put them in the DT, Leopard Wrasse from exotic I bought 3 weeks ago, was not QT'd either. I don't know, maybe I got lucky with these fishes, but I know the Tang was not luck, everytime I buy a Tang, I would QT, but they would always get Ich once in the DT. I would always roll the dice with Tangs and I would feed heavily in hopes they would generate immunity and get fat. Worked 80% of the time. I still do recommend QTing a fish, from Damsels to Angels, but this Ozone thing has giving me a peace of mind, for now... since I have not had a outbreak.