Matrix (and siporax) questions, to keep from derailing Sahin's thread.....
- Thread starter pstank1
- Start date
I'm currently running zeovit on my 250 and not really happy with the results thus far. Thinking I may make the switch in a few months if zeovit doesn't work out.
My understanding is that siporax essentially acts like live rock which is very porous with vast amount of surface area for the bacteria to grow. Does the siporax need to be cleaned often like the zeoliths zeovit uses?
I have the 4L avast zeolith shaker, is it possible to use the siporax in the avast reactor which can shake/clean the siporax often?
What is the recommended amount of siporax for a 250 gallon tank with about 20 fishes?
Thanks in advance!
My understanding is that siporax essentially acts like live rock which is very porous with vast amount of surface area for the bacteria to grow. Does the siporax need to be cleaned often like the zeoliths zeovit uses?
I have the 4L avast zeolith shaker, is it possible to use the siporax in the avast reactor which can shake/clean the siporax often?
What is the recommended amount of siporax for a 250 gallon tank with about 20 fishes?
Thanks in advance!
tripdad
Frustrated Stick Gardener
Siporax is nothing more than a medium to grow bacteria on/in. It does not add a carbon source or aid in bacteria growth except as a place to grow. I have mine in a reactor and simply rinse it every couple months or so if it shows detritus collecting, otherwise I don't touch it. Zeovit stones, if I understand correctly, are a carbon source so there is no direct comparison here.
Zeovit stones aren't a carbon source. Just a specific type of stone that acts as a place for bacteria to grow and adsorbs a few things as well. No carbon input or output though. Zeostart is the carbon source you add
Wrangy,
I browsed thru your thread and if I remember correctly, you were also running zeovit. Are you now running siporax to control nutrients?
Reefvet
New member
Matrix is sintered glass. It's sprayed into a cooling sand bed when it's manufactured. Siporax is molded.
The glass products that Seachem is referring to are the JBJ, Fluval and Eheim ceramic rings. Similar materials but not the same manufacturing process and not very porous.
All of these are designed to support denitrifying bacteria in the pores. Aerobic bacteria colonize on the surface and anaerobic in the pores.
Wrangy
Acrotrooper
I was running zeovit on the tank and did enjoy it but trying new things and I'll be using matrix to help out. At the moment I've got nothing but carbon and skimmer in the tank
tripdad
Frustrated Stick Gardener
Zeovit stones aren't a carbon source. Just a specific type of stone that acts as a place for bacteria to grow and adsorbs a few things as well. No carbon input or output though. Zeostart is the carbon source you add
Thanks for the correction Wrangy, much appreciated
I think that matrix is a natural produced stone.....pumice! Selected and packaged as seachem product. The following answer from official seachem support forum , IMHO just confirm that
http://www.seachem.com/support/forums/showthread.php?t=7609
Where do you have your information that matrix is sintered glass?
slavetonet
New member
Reefvet,
Out of matrix and siporax - which is better at reducing no3?
Out of matrix and siporax - which is better at reducing no3?
Reefvet
New member
The first 2 sentences on Seachem's site describing Matrix read:
"Matrixâ„¢ is a high porosity biomedia that provides efficient biofiltration for the removal of nitrogenous waste. Matrixâ„¢ is a porous inorganic solid about 10 mm in diameter."
Inorganic does not equal stone, stating the obvious, and Matrix ranges in size so the 10mm reference is not accurate either.
The link posted above would seem to allude to it being a natural, inert stone.
Information regarding recommended flow rates is also no longer included which might indicate a change in the media or simply that the marketing guys have had their hands on it :uhoh3:
It's quite possible that what was introduced as Matrix was replaced by a naturally sourced stone. One of the most popular pond media from Japan was originally a manufactured product and is now a natural stone, yet the product name remains the same.
Which will do a better job of denitrification depends on all the variables in that equation. The availability of carbon and nitrate in the water and the velocity of the water over the media. Siporax is much more capable given the right set up.
Availability of the media is also an obvious limitation here. Siporax has been on the market nearly 20 years. While you could walk into Walmart and buy it a decade ago it's no longer sold in the U.S.. You can source it from ebay through small retailers but that's at a premium price. Matrix is readily available.
"Matrixâ„¢ is a high porosity biomedia that provides efficient biofiltration for the removal of nitrogenous waste. Matrixâ„¢ is a porous inorganic solid about 10 mm in diameter."
Inorganic does not equal stone, stating the obvious, and Matrix ranges in size so the 10mm reference is not accurate either.
The link posted above would seem to allude to it being a natural, inert stone.
Information regarding recommended flow rates is also no longer included which might indicate a change in the media or simply that the marketing guys have had their hands on it :uhoh3:
It's quite possible that what was introduced as Matrix was replaced by a naturally sourced stone. One of the most popular pond media from Japan was originally a manufactured product and is now a natural stone, yet the product name remains the same.
Which will do a better job of denitrification depends on all the variables in that equation. The availability of carbon and nitrate in the water and the velocity of the water over the media. Siporax is much more capable given the right set up.
Availability of the media is also an obvious limitation here. Siporax has been on the market nearly 20 years. While you could walk into Walmart and buy it a decade ago it's no longer sold in the U.S.. You can source it from ebay through small retailers but that's at a premium price. Matrix is readily available.
I source "matrix" from here http://www.lava.gr/en/products/holystone/
12lt/2€!
I think seachem doing the same
12lt/2€!
I think seachem doing the same
Acromaniac
Member
Question for Reefvet, you have done all the studies on siporax and matrix etc. Just wondering if you have ever done a study on the capacity of zeolites?
Thanks
Thanks
Reefvet
New member
Do you mean the 46 naturally occurring Zeolites or KZ's ?
Acromaniac
Member
KZ's and Aquaforests please if you've done the tests
Reefvet
New member
I don't want to take us off topic again. This thread started because of questions that ensued when I posted in Sahin's tank thread about his use of Siporax. After a few too many off topic posts I suggested we get back to Sahin's tank.
What I will say it's an entirely different approach and you should do some searches on the topic here. It's an effective method that KZ has largely driven and now AF has picked up in the last 5 years.
If you're going to go the Zeolite route I'd suggest AF as more affordable and a better system overall. Zeolites are naturally occurring and there's no good reason to pay KZ's prices, IMO.
What I will say it's an entirely different approach and you should do some searches on the topic here. It's an effective method that KZ has largely driven and now AF has picked up in the last 5 years.
If you're going to go the Zeolite route I'd suggest AF as more affordable and a better system overall. Zeolites are naturally occurring and there's no good reason to pay KZ's prices, IMO.
Acromaniac
Member
Sorry mate, I was just interested in the bacteria holding capabilities of the material themselves as a comparison between Siporax and Matrix. Not the effectiveness of any other benefits they may include.
potatocouch
Member
Pyuuuuuh .. I've completed the read of 17 pages; so much information! what a great thread !!!
So, I just bought 2 x 1L of Siporax 15 mm Professional and my question is around the circled in red below:
What is Sera Bio Nitrivec ???
Is Sera Bio Nitrivec the same as the filter biostart (50ml) which is usually included in the Siporax itself?
Doesn't look the same though, but why include thing that not needed in Siporax installation?
Why is the biostart meant to freshwater? LOL ...... what's happening here?!
Do you guys inoculate Siporax with anything before putting it in the filter net bag and dumping it sump?
It doesn't even mention anything about rinsing it in RODI water...
So, I just bought 2 x 1L of Siporax 15 mm Professional and my question is around the circled in red below:
What is Sera Bio Nitrivec ???
Is Sera Bio Nitrivec the same as the filter biostart (50ml) which is usually included in the Siporax itself?
Doesn't look the same though, but why include thing that not needed in Siporax installation?
Why is the biostart meant to freshwater? LOL ...... what's happening here?!
Do you guys inoculate Siporax with anything before putting it in the filter net bag and dumping it sump?
It doesn't even mention anything about rinsing it in RODI water...
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