Matt's 5000ltr Display

[d3hree]

Hi Dave
The 45 degree angle is for quietness really. The water level inside the weir will sit halfway up the bulkheads so the lip angles down to that point. Rather than having the water go over the weir and fall vertically downwards it will cascade at an angle into the weir, much much quieter.

I quite like the weir comb teeth, I have always used them, I find it easy to remove them ( the aqua medic ones) and give them a good clean.

 

[GRP UK]

I'd be inclined to drill the holes in the timber PRIOR to the grp work.

All the holes are glassed over completely then at a certain stage of the grp curing we cut the grp away at the holes.

The ABS fittings can be added once the grp has cured sufficiently, say after 24 hours. Please do not fit the elbows before we do the grp work. Although grp bonds better to ABS than it does pvc you'll use the gaskets either side of the timber to brace the seal up. A polyurethane silicone is optional dependant on the flexibility of the gaskets used.

I hope that helps.

I personally like the angle of the water return. Less noisy, potentially less splashing and less evaporation from such?

 

[dave.m]

ABS is not rated for potable water, just waste water. Most peeople use Schedule 40 or 80 PVC.

Dave.M

 

[GRP UK]

ABS is not rated for potable water, just waste water. Most peeople use Schedule 40 or 80 PVC.

Dave.M

The schematics Matt has done looks like ABS plastic to me due to the grey colouring hence what I posted Dave.

If any kind of pvc was to be glassed over, say to bond a pipe in place then there is a product we use to increase the bond as it etches the pvc. One should not rely on just scratching it to give a key. The liquid we use actually gets the two materials to bond. With ABS there is no need to do this.

Regards from the UK.

Matt

 

[d3hree]

All the pipe work is pvc. Whilst I dont know the term for it here in the UK I believe it is what you guys call schedule 80, grey pvc.
Regarding ABS plastic, several months ago I spoke to a representative from the governing body of plastic pipe regulation in the UK ( I really do need to get a life!) What transpired over my conversation with him was the fact that ABS pipe would be ok to use in an aquatic environment. In order to be classified as suitable for potable water pipe manufacturers have to maintain certain kite marks which involve various inspections throughout the year at the expense of the manufacturer. Because potable water or aquatic environments are such a tiny % of what ABS pipe would be used for most if not all ABS manufacturers dont bother with the expense of maintaining said kite marks etc. In short ABS pipe is ok to use in a marine environment but you wont see many manufacturers stating as such.
All of that is irrelevant due to my pipe being pvc.

 

[d3hree]

...double post...

 

[d3hree]

I'd be inclined to drill the holes in the timber PRIOR to the grp work.

Thanks Matt, thats pretty much the answer I was hoping for.

What is the difference between Polyurethane and Epoxy resins? Most of the "plywood" builds I have read use Epoxy resin just poured onto the interior surfaces and dont use fibreglass.

 

[GRP UK]

The difference between the two? Wow, that's some question to answer!

There are resources far more knowledgeable about epoxies than I'll ever know about. What you'll read about online is the ability for polyesters to absorb water more quickly in a polyester system than one of epoxy.

This ability to absorb water would typically take such a long time to occur when the grp system is applied correctly using the right amount of catalyst (hardener) and a flowcoat that we'll probably both be deceased by the time it happens so plenty of time to relax about it happening.

GRP has been used in many many thousands of aquatic applications, gaining popularity since the 80's and we aren't seeing faild polyester systems through osmosis yet. You'll read lads about osmosis in boats but that's another story......

Done right a polyester system has a life expectancy of 20 years +. Done right I don't know the life expectancy of epoxies as I do not work with this material.

Have you any links to the other ply builds please.

Matt

 

[GRP UK]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKvwKMF-gRI

Quick video of how we seal a return pipe and cut away at the 'green' stage of the cure.

Timing to do this cutting is critical. Leave it too long as it's only a diamond tipped cutter that will get through the 3mm thick fibreglass, or the other way........... but I don't want to give too many hints away now.........

 

[launchnukes]

That thing is massive. What a build! I'll be following closely.

 

[d3hree]

Another day off work sees a little more progress to the tank, front and top framing, but before I could make a start on that i had to cut the plywood that would form the inner front face of the tank ( what the glass will press up against) and put that inside. Once the top and front framing is done there will be no way of getting that plywood in the tank!

I simply cut the ply and leaned it against the backwall

The rear of the top frame is fixed to the brick with heavyweight anchor bolts. The center bracebar is fixed to the rear top frame via 2 x 6" coach bolts.

The upper front frame is constructed from 2 pieces of timber. The first is 3"x2" and will form the upper bracing for the glass to push against. The 2nd is 6"x2" and is fastened to the first peice to form a sort of rotated "L" cross-section. The centre brace is fixed from the rear frame to the 6x2 timber.

Underside shot of the front top bracing. You can see the "L" shape plus the centre brace coming in from the right.

In this pic you can see the gorilla glue expanding out of the joints. I used the glue on all joints coupled with screws.

My 4 year old daughter struggling to reach the top of the tank

The lower front bracing consists of two 2"x3" peices of timber, screwed, glued and doweled together with 2"x6" noggins.

The bottom of the tank will be 12" from the bottom of the glass. This will make cleaning the glass easier ( no sand to get in the way ) and also allows for an in-tank DSB.

Here is how is stands now. You can see the hole for the glass and how the tank expands away from the viewer to each corner. I hope that the hidden areas prove to make the tank feel bigger than it is as fish can swim in and out from view. Plus they will be invaluable at hiding pipework.

 

[dave.m]

Matt, will you go with an acrylic or glass pane? I am thinking that, with the pane raised up off the bottom for safety as you noted, you could afford to go with the lesser weight and greater optical clarity of the acrylic.

Also, while the outward water pressure will easily keep the pane pressed against the frame horizontally, I am thinking you will still want some sort of water-proof bracing underneath the pane to maintain it vertically.

Dave.M

 

[d3hree]

Hi Dave

I will go with glass. 3 x 12mm low iron (starphire) sheets laminated together.
Although low iron glass scratches easier than normal float glass I prefer it over the thought of acrylic.
Once the inner front face of the plywood has been fixed and the hole cut there will be a 44mm deep frame internally that the glass will fit into. The 44 mm will allow for a 4mm gasket of silicone, then the 36mm of glass and finally a further 4 mm bead of silcone.

The spacing of the silicone is done via 4 mm tile spacers to ensure that the weight of the glass doesnt squeeze out all the silicone ensuring an even distribution and a good depth.

 

[manhorsedog]

May I ask why you prefer glass over acrylic? I was of the thought on most big tanks it is a good idea to go with acrylic due to glass cracks or even the possibility of shattering by accidentally hitting a sweet spot with a rock or coral.

 

[d3hree]

May I ask why you prefer glass over acrylic? I was of the thought on most big tanks it is a good idea to go with acrylic due to glass cracks or even the possibility of shattering by accidentally hitting a sweet spot with a rock or coral.

Hi,

Glass will only shatter if you use tempered glass. Whilst tempered glass is a little stronger, like you say it can shatter into tiny fragments. To the best of my knowledge tempered glass is only usually found on the base of some tanks.

I prefer glass over acrylic for this particular tank for a couple of reasons.
The first is that whilst scratches in acrylic can be buffered out the idea of draining the tank to rid it of scratches isnt one that I relish. I would prefer to cut down on the chances of getting the scratch in the first place.
This tank will be with me for some considerable time, no chance of an upgrade unless I get a bigger house! so even with the best will in the world I would scratch an acrylic front pane and in 5 years it would need buffering.

The 2nd significant factor is price. If opting for acylic I was quoted £1700. The glass option is £500.

I dont think there is a massive difference in clarity when you cant see any edges of the glass or acrylic.

HTH

 

[Grubes]

Matt,

A fantastic effort; what a great display of planning and workmanship. As I look at your pictures I'm curious about how much space you've left between the top of the tank and the ceiling to allow your accessing the tank bottom?

Keep up the wonderful work,
Grubesl

 

[d3hree]

Hi Grubes.
I am flattered that you chose my thread for your first post, thankyou.
There is approx 2ft between the top of the tank and the ceiling. Not a lot I will admit.
Due to the tank being fibreglass I will be able to lie on it, not something I would ever do on a glass or acrylic tank. The plan is that I will be able to lie on scaffolding boards across the tank and with the aid of 4ft tools will be able to reach everywhere in the tank.

I wanted the water level and glass level of the tank to be higher than my eyeline so that I wouldnt have to stoop to look into the tank and I would also have more of the feeling of being emersed and surrounded by the reef. My work commitments mean I dont dive as much as I would like anymore so this to me was the 2nd best option.
Due to this and only having 8 ft ceilings has meant that I have sacrificed a little in ease of maintenance. I think that clever stocking and long tools will mean that this wont be too much of an issue.

 

[8220]

Wauv. Now that's what I call a man with a plan.

I'm super impressed with all the preperation and thought you put into this setup.
Just 1 question, why did you chose wood as the "frame".

I'm really looking forward to seeing the tank it self.

Are you a coral or fish man?

Good luck with it all

 

[d3hree]

Hi 8220, thanks for stopping by.

Just 1 question, why did you chose wood as the "frame".

Do you mean the stand? If so I chose wood for ease really. I looked into having a steel stand made and it would have been done off site and in sections as i couldnt have got it in the house otherwise. I also looked into brick supports with I beams but felt that a wooden stand helped tie in the whole structure.
If it was to be free standing then I think that the I beams would have been better but as it is I like the idea of the whole tank fastened together as one from floor to ceiling.
My Dad is a builder but I have no personal construction knowledge, it just felt right and I think that wood is often underestimated in terms of its strength.

 

[d3hree]

Are you a coral or fish man?

whoops sorry, missed this one.
Personally I am a coral guy, I think most reefers are. Even a tank this size will soon become stocked with fish but in years to come I will still be adding corals.
My wife however is more into fish and soft corals. I have told her that I dont want to be harvesting soft corals as they rampage through the tank but i think she ignored me!..I forsee some arguments down the line.
One of the reasons for me being allowed such a large tank is my wife's love of regal tangs.