metal halide accident...
- Thread starter Pico1
- Start date
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
Yeah, Jordan, maybe this can help you with that bulb problem...
http://members.fortunecity.com/paulerik/id62.htm
http://members.fortunecity.com/paulerik/id62.htm
Why are people being negative towards hahnmeister's post? We're all glad that Jordan is alright and hope he has a speedy recovery. We can all post these "huggie feel good" response - but this thread would be content poor. I find some of hahnmeister's posts the most thought provocative and informational post in this thread. I don't necessarily agree with everything he said - but none-the-less, they are thought provoking. Then again - there's a reason why I am not a counselor at work...
Minh
MrMikeB
New member
Ha! Only reef geeks, and I use that term in the highest regard, would delve into the mechanics of potentially killing oneself with a MH bulb. Kind of like debating whether or not the blunt force of the guillotine actually kills you first or is it the severing of the carotid arteries? Hmm... perhaps another thread? 
At any rate, Jordan I am glad you are ok, and that is the most important piece.
At any rate, Jordan I am glad you are ok, and that is the most important piece.
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
Perhaps MrMikeB is correct... "you know you are a reefgeek when..."
Nu2SW
New member
LMAO :lol: Cant forget that.....
Glad your OK....
WTH WERE YOU THINKING.... Next time I see you remind me to see how many braincells you got... LOL
Sorry its the father in me coming out. LOL
Ive been zapped by a car battery and a spark plug, that was interesting. I am in no hurry to find out how your ride was.
Glad your OK....
WTH WERE YOU THINKING.... Next time I see you remind me to see how many braincells you got... LOL
Sorry its the father in me coming out. LOL
Ive been zapped by a car battery and a spark plug, that was interesting. I am in no hurry to find out how your ride was.
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
I dont know... at that age if I would have done that... that might have been the end of my reef keeping career. I would have been forever distrusted with anything electrical unless it was completely packaged in a protective box (like a computer). The idea of engineering school would have made them fear for my life...lol. Guilting THEM into buying me stuff... oh, no... thats just not the way it works. I would be getting guilted by them for what I did to myself until I quit the hobby or something. Its one thing to support someone's hobbies and interests, but when it almost kills you... could be a sign...
Seriously... T5s man... do it for your parents before they take away your halides...:lol:
Seriously... T5s man... do it for your parents before they take away your halides...:lol:
melev
Well-known member
First of all Jordan, I'm glad you're okay. Thanks for documenting all the important details. Pictures of the gurney rolling you away drives the point home.
I've been shocked a few times myself. Once because of my wife. I was trying to fix my TV, which made this weird clicking noise. I pulled off the housing on the back and looked at it. I plugged it in and using my eyes and ears zoned in on the particular spot where the sound was emanating. There was this tiny blue flame shooting power about 1/2". I told my wife that I found the problem, and she she asked "Where?". I pointed to the general area, and she didn't see it. Again "where?" and I tried to explain the spot. Again she asked and out of exasperation, I pointed right to the exact spot getting my finger a tad too close. The power that hit me sent me flying across the room into the sofa.
I divorced that woman.
Oh, and fixed the problem with a nice bead of silicone on that area. All these years later, I'm still using that same TV.
Another time I was working on the house wiring. I had to reroute it as I was installing a new door. The power was cut to the circuit before I started. As I was twisting the wires together, I felt a sudden vibration and freaked out. My assistant nearby looked up at me in surprise when I reacted like I just got shocked. Turns out my pager had just vibrated at that precise moment with me holding the two bare wires, and I misinterpreted the signals.
:lol:
When it comes to working with metal halides, the rule is not to touch the bulb, and never when the power is on. When I have to take the bulbs out for cleaning, I wait until they've been off for a while so the glass is no longer hot. Once cleaned with vinegar and water, I wrap the bulb in a clean dry paper towel or slip a sock over it. Now I can screw it in safely.
MH don't always start up as soon as you turn on the power. Some take a while to warm up, while others at least show a glimmer of power in the core as it builds up to fire the bulb.
We should always be careful around electricity, and have a healthy respect for it.
I've been shocked a few times myself. Once because of my wife. I was trying to fix my TV, which made this weird clicking noise. I pulled off the housing on the back and looked at it. I plugged it in and using my eyes and ears zoned in on the particular spot where the sound was emanating. There was this tiny blue flame shooting power about 1/2". I told my wife that I found the problem, and she she asked "Where?". I pointed to the general area, and she didn't see it. Again "where?" and I tried to explain the spot. Again she asked and out of exasperation, I pointed right to the exact spot getting my finger a tad too close. The power that hit me sent me flying across the room into the sofa.
I divorced that woman.
Oh, and fixed the problem with a nice bead of silicone on that area. All these years later, I'm still using that same TV.
Another time I was working on the house wiring. I had to reroute it as I was installing a new door. The power was cut to the circuit before I started. As I was twisting the wires together, I felt a sudden vibration and freaked out. My assistant nearby looked up at me in surprise when I reacted like I just got shocked. Turns out my pager had just vibrated at that precise moment with me holding the two bare wires, and I misinterpreted the signals.
:lol:When it comes to working with metal halides, the rule is not to touch the bulb, and never when the power is on. When I have to take the bulbs out for cleaning, I wait until they've been off for a while so the glass is no longer hot. Once cleaned with vinegar and water, I wrap the bulb in a clean dry paper towel or slip a sock over it. Now I can screw it in safely.
MH don't always start up as soon as you turn on the power. Some take a while to warm up, while others at least show a glimmer of power in the core as it builds up to fire the bulb.
We should always be careful around electricity, and have a healthy respect for it.
Last edited:
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
Boy, was I wrong. Well, I was right about the initial voltage, but I suppose that is quickly changed as the bulb starts. Here's what Paul Erik wrote me:
"The starting voltage will vary by the ballast type (ANSI Standard). HQI, Pulse Start and Electronic ballasts will have a high voltage starting pulse present along with the Open Circuit Voltage (OCV). The voltage varies by the standard they were manufactured to (typically 600 to 5000 volts).
The high voltages present with HID ballasts are only used to ignite an initial arc. Which lasts a very short amount of time. Once a high current / low voltage situation can take place the initial high voltage drops and the ballast will provide the correct amount of current (secondary current), which can be many times higher than the operating current of the lamp. The amount of current will greatly vary by the design spec. This high amount of current allows the high voltage arc to transform to a high current low voltage arc (called glow phase) which allows the warm up phase to take place.
If you were to get shocked by a HID ballast it can be highly deadly. I’ve only once been shocked due to carelessness when performing tests and I ended up losing all feeling on the right side of my body. Thankfully I recovered completely from it. It was 1000 times more painful than getting shocked from a single phase 120V source."
Youch. Well, I posted the above to let you know Jordan... shocking yourself with a halide ballast places you in some pretty good company!
"The starting voltage will vary by the ballast type (ANSI Standard). HQI, Pulse Start and Electronic ballasts will have a high voltage starting pulse present along with the Open Circuit Voltage (OCV). The voltage varies by the standard they were manufactured to (typically 600 to 5000 volts).
The high voltages present with HID ballasts are only used to ignite an initial arc. Which lasts a very short amount of time. Once a high current / low voltage situation can take place the initial high voltage drops and the ballast will provide the correct amount of current (secondary current), which can be many times higher than the operating current of the lamp. The amount of current will greatly vary by the design spec. This high amount of current allows the high voltage arc to transform to a high current low voltage arc (called glow phase) which allows the warm up phase to take place.
If you were to get shocked by a HID ballast it can be highly deadly. I’ve only once been shocked due to carelessness when performing tests and I ended up losing all feeling on the right side of my body. Thankfully I recovered completely from it. It was 1000 times more painful than getting shocked from a single phase 120V source."
Youch. Well, I posted the above to let you know Jordan... shocking yourself with a halide ballast places you in some pretty good company!
as a licensed eletrcian for over a decade (retired and moved on to 'puters now), I have been around everything from 13.8 KV power lines up to 50V DC. Comparing home current to what is coming off of the load side of an HQI ballast/transformer is like comparing your garden hose to s fire engines water nozzle 
Jordan, I am glad that you are OK... I would hate to think that our last meeting last weekend would have been it. Cheers bro and lesson learned . One thing that is usually true is the saying that "whatever doesn't kill you only makes you stronger" or at least wiser
As for my own personal experiences with electricity.. I have been knocked off of an 8 ft ladder, unconscious, by electricty (which those that know me are now nodding quietly thinking to themselves "that explains alot...") I have, over the years, had to bury 2 friends that I worked with in the electrical trade.. one I actually witnessed the event (and every day wished I hadn't), eletricity is no laughing matter (unless you can walk away from it and no one is serious injured, and even then it isn't really all that "funny" for many years)
Again.. I am really glad to hear that you are OK Jordan. If you were a bit older I would offer to buy you a round to toast your good fortune.. but for now just put it on my tab and remind me when you turn 21.
That aside, Dots comments were pretty humorous. :
did the bulb light up?
How did it look? Too blue.....too yellow?
and Gresh, it is usually a copper taste, not a tin taste.. at least from my experience.. and hte harder the bite/higher the amperage, the stronger and longer the taste stays with you. In my experience it tastes like you just chewed on a penny. *yuck*
Jordan, I am glad that you are OK... I would hate to think that our last meeting last weekend would have been it
. Cheers bro and lesson learned . One thing that is usually true is the saying that "whatever doesn't kill you only makes you stronger" or at least wiser As for my own personal experiences with electricity.. I have been knocked off of an 8 ft ladder, unconscious, by electricty (which those that know me are now nodding quietly thinking to themselves "that explains alot...") I have, over the years, had to bury 2 friends that I worked with in the electrical trade.. one I actually witnessed the event (and every day wished I hadn't), eletricity is no laughing matter (unless you can walk away from it and no one is serious injured, and even then it isn't really all that "funny" for many years)
Again.. I am really glad to hear that you are OK Jordan. If you were a bit older I would offer to buy you a round to toast your good fortune.. but for now just put it on my tab and remind me when you turn 21
.That aside, Dots comments were pretty humorous. :
did the bulb light up?
How did it look? Too blue.....too yellow?
and Gresh, it is usually a copper taste, not a tin taste.. at least from my experience.. and hte harder the bite/higher the amperage, the stronger and longer the taste stays with you. In my experience it tastes like you just chewed on a penny. *yuck*
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
I knew someone in HS from the stix that decided it would be cool to climb a high-tension wire and see what would happen if he grabbed one. His jacket melted to his body, and his insides were cooked in an instant. He fell, and was still alive for about 5 more minutes... but that was it. Darwin award for that one...
miracles38
Active member
Hey Jordan - just saw this thread. Dang! I'm glad you are okay! Take care!
