more tang arguments

[muppet]

TankStud - You're knee deep in a hole, man. Quit digging.

JHemdal - ::facepalm::

 

[bertoni]

Jay, that description of our work is completely wrong and more than a bit disingenuous. Our choices were based on watching animals and experience with them, which is completely the opposite of just doing whatever "feels good".

 

[JHemdal]

Bertoni,

Wow - For once I am utterly speechless!

J

 

[Sk8r]

I believe we have a bit of contextotomy going on...slice and dice quotation, and imho it's not helping polite and rational debate. Can we get back to context? This is not a game of scoring points. It's supposed to be about the fish. Thanks.

 

[jkeim1974]

This is why I try and stay away from reef central. Everyone elses way of doing things is always the wrong way. My 17 year old Hippo is still doing great in my 75 and I've never quarantined any of my fish I just buy from a local store after they've been there for over a month. Just my way of not setting up an additional tank.

 

[thecichlidpleco]

J,
You should just link to your article from 2 years ago, I think there would be a character limit for just copying and pasting.

Also, I like your new disclaimer

 

[scapes]

i am so confused. think i'll call it a day...err night

 

[Toddrtrex]

Bertoni,

Wow - For once I am utterly speechless!

J



Last edited by JHemdal; Yesterday at 06:28 PM. Reason: laughing too hard while I typed

Not so speechless that you have to leave your "edit" comment, right? Is it possible for you to make a post without being so curt? To be honest, I am finding it very annoying, and is making it hard for me to take anything you say seriously.

 

[bertoni]

Well, I suppose if you run out of polite or thoughtful things to say...

 

[bitts]

I agree with Jeff. The reasons are:

A bit more information so you can put what we said into perspective. The life cycle of this parasite is interesting and is important to understand when evaluating a treatment. The stage where the parasite is attached to a fish is called a trophont. The trophont will spend three to seven days (depending on temperature) feeding on the fish and that is what you see symptomatically when you see "salt sprinkled on the fish". After that, the trophont leaves the fish and becomes what is called a protomont. This protomont travels to the substrate and begins to crawl around for usually two to eight hours, but it could go for as long as eighteen hours after it leaves it's fish host. Once the protomont attaches to a surface, it begins to encyst and is now called a tomont. Division inside the cyst into hundreds of daughter parasites, called tomites, begins shortly thereafter. This noninfectious stage can last anywhere from three to twenty-eight days. During this extended period, the parasite cyst is lying in wait for a host. After this period, the tomites hatch and begin swimming around, looking for a fish host. At this point, they are called theronts, and they must find a host within twenty-four hours or die. They prefer to seek out the skin and gill tissue, then transform into trophonts, and begin the process all over again. What this means is that when your tank is infected, you can actually see symptom during a very small part of the life cycle, and it why your tank is infected even though your fish are resistent. it will also explain why symptoms come and go.

Many hobbyists are fooled into believing they have cured their fish of the parasites, only to find Ich present again on fish a few weeks later; a reason why following through with a full treatment protocol is so important. Don't make this mistake and be lulled into a false sense of security. The parasites may be in a stage where they are merely regrouping and multiplying for their "next offensive." In the wild, this sort of massive reproductive phase ensures that a few will find a suitable host to continue on the cycle. In the close confines of our aquariums, though, it means comparatively massive infection rates.

This disease is usually associated with several environmental triggers. Changes in water temperature, exposure to high levels of ammonia, nitrite, or nitrate, low pH levels, low dissolved oxygen often associated with overcrowding, are all factors contributing to the onset of the disease. You could lump all of these in a general category of "stress", but it is more appropriate to think of all of these as "unnatural conditions". In fact, Cryptocaryon irritans is rare in the wild even more unlikely to be lethal. Ich is truly a disease that exploits the conditions of captivity to reproduce and easily find suitable hosts.

By the way, trophonts are under the skin so cleaner wrasses and cleaner shrimp have no real effect on reducing this parasite.

The hyposalinity treatment is 1.009 but that will only treat the fish, it will NOT remove cryptocaryon from you tank completely unless you keep it for 8 weeks as Jeff says above.

is indeed a great post, thank you.

Edit: sorry forgot to link it. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1891289&highlight=ick

 

[mthomp]

Not so speechless that you have to leave your "edit" comment, right? Is it possible for you to make a post without being so curt? To be honest, I am finding it very annoying, and is making it hard for me to take anything you say seriously.

Todd I been noticing the same trend with you lately. In fact it is almost like you are baiting people flat out defend them selves against you and then send them a pm warning them you will have them banned if they dare. In fact I have found a good many of your post as of late have had nothing to do with the topic and everything to do with a indivisual in the thread.

 

[Toddrtrex]

Todd I been noticing the same trend with you lately. In fact it is almost like you are baiting people flat out defend them selves against you and then send them a pm warning them you will have them banned if they dare. In fact I have found a good many of your post as of late have had nothing to do with the topic and everything to do with a indivisual in the thread.

Given all the things that you have said to me -- including insults and threats--both in PM and in your edited posts I find this humorous.

 

[mthomp]

I dont think i have ever threatend you.. quite the oppisate if you ask me. And that does not excuse the fact that what i said is none the less true.

 

[bertoni]

Okay, we're no longer discussing fish behavior.