Mostly Apogon margaritophorus woes...

[mwp]

Well, a sad note today, my time trying to breed Apogon margaritophorus has come to a close, at least for now. I found the female dead this evening on the overflow. Apparently she died from being eggbound; as she was definitely having problems over the last month with passing her eggs.

Anyone interested in 2 known male Apogon margaritophorus? On the upside, getting these cardinals out may help with the brooding problems facing my Pterapogon kaudernii.

FWIW,

Matt

 

[mwp]

Well, as I still haven't broken out my Bangaii's to their own thread, I might as well keep adding on here to note that somewhere between 1:00 PM and 3:30 PM on 8-16-06 the Bangaii pair spawned...basically 1 spawn a month seems to be the norm for this pair. Since 3 of the cardninalfish are out of the picture I'm going to simply leave the male in the tank to see if he'll hold this batch now that there's less "cardinalfish" to interact with; perhaps we'll figure out whether the holding issue is a tankmate issue or not with this trial.

Matt

 

[mwp]

Once again, the Bangaii's have let us all down, consuming or dropping the egg mass sometime between Friday afternoon and Sunday Evening this time around. Obviously the A. margaritophorus's presence is not the issue, as they're no longer present. At this point I see only 4 likely sources.

1. External disturbances - unfortunately no one was around this tank for the last 2 days when the eggs disappeared, so I'm ruling it out for now.

2. The presence of the Apogon leptacanthus group - this is still plausible in so much as they Bangaii's are always chasing the leptacanthus around when the Bangaii's are getting hot and heavy (and in the first couple days afterwards).

3. Diet - For now I'm ruling this out because they are getting a top-notch diet in line with what other breeders feed, and they are fed to saturation several times per week.

4. Genetics - there IS a possibility that these bangaiis are Siblings as they came from captive bred juvies. Inbreeding could be the issue here.

I'm ruling out pretty much all disease/fungus due to the fact that there's a good sized UV on their tank.

ANY OTHER THOUGHTS?

Matt

 

[mwp]

Well, the margaritophorus thread has always been the bangaii thread...someday I'll comb it and separate out the Bangaiis

The news this evening - 9-15-06, the BAngaii's have spawned again. I'm thinking of trying to catch the male and tumble the eggs or separate him in a net breeder.

HMM.

Matt

 

[mwp]

Well, it's now 9-17-06 and another bangaii spawn bites the dust. What a waste...a pair of fish that breed routinely every month but won't hold their eggs for more than 48 hours!

Oh well...I have 167 mandarin larvae to deal with anyway...my hands are full!

Matt

 

[mwp]

GRR. OK, 10-5, 3:45 PM, the bangaii's have spawned again. By 10-8, the spawn has once again disappeared from the male's mouth. I may be moving the leptacanthus or the bangaii's soon..I think the leptacanthus are just too much of a disturbance for the bangaii's in this smaller tank.

FWIW,

Matt

 

[mwp]

10-12, 1:00 AM, OK, there's an odd chance that our male bangaii is still holding something...he isn't eating and his throat still appears a bit distended. Either he's SICK or he still has eggs!

FWIW,

Matt

 

[mwp]

10-20-06, and our male bangaii is still not feeding. I think he FINALLY got the hint and is HOLDING THE EGGS for a change! I think we have about another week to go - at that point I may pull him out and get him to release the larvae, or I may just let things go naturally (which in the current tank means I'll never get to the babies before the tankmates do!)

Matt

 

[mwp]

10-28-06, 1:15 AM - I captured the male bangaii who has been sneaking food here and there but is NOT coming out for the big feast of prepared foods when they're added to the tank (figured he was still holding). Turns out there was NOTHING in his mouth which means he's gone off feed for at least a couple weeks now, or is "sneaking" food in back where he usually hangs out. In some respects I'm not surprised, but I think this is going to dictate some massive water changes and ongoing doses of Marine Max (the tank had a breakout of Ich 5 days ago due to the UV not running properly and some other factors)

Back to being very frustrated with my pair of Bangaii's.

Matt

 

[mwp]

12-29-06 - just a couple updates on the Bangaii situation. I started another thread chronicaling our issues with the male - http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=8849798#post8849798

Also - 12-27-06 - we had another Bangaii SPAWNING. As of 12-29, there are no eggs in his mouth as far as I can tell.

I really think at this point the situation warrants removal of the Bangaii pair (or other boisterous tankmates) in order to have any success, as well as possibly swapping out our male for a different one. Looks like I'm just getting burned on Bangaii's for the last year

Matt

 

[Peter Schmiedel]

Matt,

have you ever observed probelms with the female of A. margaritophorus releasing eggs? I have now the second group and again had one female that ended up with an ripped open cloake and eggs hanging there. Both times the wound healed without any further damage or significant handicap for the fish.

 

[mwp]

Peter, my female Apogon margaritophorus DIED from just such a reoccuring problem of egg binding - that ended my efforts with the species.

Matt

 

[Peter Schmiedel]

Matt,

interessting that we both had the same observations. Luckly mine did make it. That either means we need more males (??) or we are missing someting in food or water quality.

 

[mwp]

Well she was egg bound on more than one occasion before ultimately dying. I had 2M, 1F...the problem with the males was that they never held the eggs to term, at least not that I was able to observe. I personally think that the egg binding may not have been a dietary "deficiency" related issue, but perhaps overly "good quality" of food caused the female to produce an excessive amount of eggs...that's just my hunch.

Fasting the fish once or twice per week may help (considering how ravenous they normally would feed).

FWIW,

Matt