My 1000l Fowlr Tank(from China)

I have no reason to call on moderators to lock this thread since I like some others had enjoyed the poster's chronology of his tank's evolution until you came along. As I said many posts earlier when I give my last word talking to you, I thought you could understand what I meant and stop hopping here, you have made your point loud and clear even a three year old could hear, and of course you have succeeded in ruining this thread some time ago, so go find your next target please.

Is it your life principle that everyone has to respond to every one of your arguments till they agree with you? Well good luck with that.
 
no flames intended but the irony of your posts on this thread is astounding. 1) you expect direct answers to your questions regarding my aquarium while on the other hand you completely ignore my questions to you, which is wise as it would completely contradict your point in this thread. 2) you state that one give an opinion and leave yet you continue to post in here arguing my valid points without addressing any of my questions. 3) you say i should pm a mod to lock this thread because i find it objectionable yet you are the only one complaining about how people should and should not post on reef central ie we should not criticize other people's tanks and methods. and the most obvious 4) you say the thread was fine before i came along and ruined it yet if you reread the thread, you would see many people criticized his tank and i assume it was the result of those people which caused coolfish china to leave the thread and not post anymore... this happened long before i made my first post, yet i'm the one that ruined the thread?

here is a point blank simple question for you: if 1 out of 100 baby leapord sharks survived the collection/shipping process, is it wrong to house the shark in a 75 gallon aquarium because that shark has it good compared to the others that perished?
 
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The point was everyone of those other readers who disagreed with this tank knew how to state their opinions and yet still have the courtesy to allow those who enjoy this tank to continue, except you. Why am I obligated to answer each and everyone of your rants? I am here to be amused by this tank, that is why some of us visit this thread, not so we can be constantly annoyed by you.

How about some of us start to pound on your tank build thread with rants every few hours, pick at some things we think are wrong, yet you believe are ok, and do so over and over until no one whats to even visit your thread. I hope now you can at least understand why my reactions to you.

But obviously you can't see that, so I digress.
 
there was no difference in how they posted their opinions and how i posted mine go back and re read, the difference is, their opinions are what made coolfish china leave and no longer post pictures yet you are directing your anger towards me, i have no idea how i rubbed you the wrong way but the hypocrisy is obvious.

i welcome criticism of my tank, in fact when i started my tank buildup i posted this as well as that is how people learn, you are welcome to go into "my" thread and criticize all you want.

and thanks for answering the simple question... oh wait, you didn't.
 
First of all I want to thank the author of this thread for sharing his pictures with us!! Beautiful pictures! Lot´s of BEAUTIFUL FISH in a really nice FOWLR tank!!

Personally I always find "difficult" setups the most interesting ones. Keeping lots of different angels or triggers together for instance is difficult, but it can be done successfully. With all the close-up pictures we got from this tank I think that we all can see that the fish seems to do good in his tank!!

As to the opinions on what´s the right amount of fish to keep in a tank I think we can all keep it to ourselves as long as the author doesn´t ask for our opinions. There´s tons of people who can give you all a billion reasons why it´s not ok to keep fish at all in a tank. And who´s to say that they´re not right? And who´s to say that they cannot write angry messages in each and every thread on this forum? I think we should try to keep critisism in a case like this to ourselves as long as the authour of the thread hasn´t asked for our opinions.

This Chinese tank is full of life, and it´s great to see that he´s managed to break the "rules" made up by other hobbyists and manages to keep healthy fish in a large amount in his tank. Congratulations on a great setup!!
 
...This Chinese tank is full of life, and it´s great to see that he´s managed to break the "rules" made up by other hobbyists and manages to keep healthy fish in a large amount in his tank. Congratulations on a great setup!! [/B]
Click to expand...


Except we probably will not hear him back again. I for one like to see how he is doing, whether indeed he had too much he could chew, or there maybe some break through that allowed him to keep more fish than we are accustomed to, rather speculating what had become his fish, all because some members have made up their mind how bad this tank was.

BTW, there were a few tanks in Europe that had many more fish per gallon as I recall was quite successful and showcased in this very forum, while there were doubts by many members, the tank owners did get the chance to explain, and I for one learned a great deal from those beautiful tanks.
 
more fish or inches per gallon? as far as i know, the "hong kong" aquariums are the only ones that try to stuff as many angelfish into a tank as possible, and most of the time the fish have to be interchanged or replaced frequently.

i would love to see a european tank that had just as many if not more fish in a small space thriving for years and years.
 
He may have posted a bit harsh and to the point, but I think it does deserve some acknowldgement that indeed what really matters is his last couple of words.

fish in a small space thriving for years
Click to expand...

As hobbiests, we do have to be considerate of our tanks inhabitants as they are mainly all extremely fragile, Angels are indeed one of these animals. Someone also questioned our hobby alltogether as we could be wrong in anothers eyes for simply having these reef animals in a small exhibit.

But truthfully, without Ocean Biologists learning from our home aquaria hobby, alot of the commonly known reef husbandry techniques and breeding techniques and knowledge of how some of these animals eat, sleep, reproduce would still be unknown along with diseases, RTN, light, temperature, this list is extensive on what the hobby has brought to light for biologists and it is a good thing. I won't go into alot of detail as there are plenty of bad spots for our hobby as well. I think what he is trying to get accross here is that with the knowledge we have gained, it would be very unfortunate to see people not act responsable with the knowledge and tools handed down from previous experience. There is nothing wrong with a person feeling very strongly about making sure fragile animals are kept as best they can be even if he comes off a little abrasive, we should be thankfull there are people who do feel this strongly and want to protect our hobby.

We all tell everyone who wants to get into the hobby to read, read, read, and then ask questions and read some more. We do this because we want them to do it right and preserve any life forms they might want to bring home to their aquaria the first time out. Not to just grab a handfull of salt and the nearest Anemone and Clown and mix em up in a 5 gallon aquarium.

I would hope anyone who has any understanding of aquarium husbandry would do their very best to give the best chance for those organisms not only to survive, but to flourish and that is all that is really important.
 
Mahlhavoc, first off this tank owner certainly had read a great deal and acquired more than an average hobbyist would have done, his choice of fish might have been questionable, the number of fish in the tank certainly is not the most extreme. Just look at some of the public aquariums. I don't see anyone of us picketing in front of those places.

I was never against anyone who has strong opinions on this matter to express them, but it comes to a point when the points made are very clear, and continued repeating of the same old obviously will not change the course of the debate, then it is time to go some place else so that those who actually want to communicate with the original poster can have some peace and quite time here.

If you value the contributions our hobby has brought to our general understanding of reef and its inhabitants, or even the scientific value of it all, then why dismiss the fact attempting to keep some fish in an environment seemingly impossible by current standard, may one day contribute to the preservation of the species after all?

Who is to say that one member has the moral authority on this subject and the other completely lacks it?
 
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jacmyoung, cool china left almost 2 months before i made my first post in this thread, probably as a result of XtrmCHoPZ and emperior911 posting their opinions which were similar to mine. in fact XtrmCHoPZ even stated his tank was discpicable. i never used such "viscious" attacks yet you continue to flame me while condoning everyone else voicing their disapproval of the tank, it just doesn't make any sense other than you have it out for me for some odd reason.

i really don't care that you try to belittle and flame me but why do you keep implying i ran him off and ruined the thread? tsk tsk you should get your facts but don't worry, i'm not offended not that you care. i'm dropping this subject as i have stated my opinion which every conscientious aquarist would agree with .

btw, can you give me a link to the european aquariums that have a higher stocking level than coolfish chinas you were referring to? i'm sincerely interested in seeing them as i have never heard of this before. thanks.
 
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i have to apologize to jacmyoung and anyone else, after more research, this practice has been done for awhile by many people and not just limited to hong kong/asia but all over and quite a few people have been successful with the lockerroom effect. i still don't agree with it but you can't argue with the success of some people stocking their tanks in this manner.

here is what bob fenner wrote to me regarding this

Hi Bob,
'Chaidan'
As I am planning on my stocking list, I got a chance to see a very
overstocked aquarium from Hong Kong where as many as 10 large angelfish
was crammed inside a 150 gallon aquarium which I thought was cruel and
not acceptable under any circumstances yet I hear it is the norm over
there.
'Is not an uncommon practice...'
Have you heard of this method of fish keeping in Asia?
'Yes, have seen there, and some places in W. Europe and N. America...
mainly amongst folks of Chinese background... and one large service
company on the U.S. eastern seaboard... can be done'
Are the people employing these methods having any long term success
with them?
'At least some of them, yes'
what are you long term mental and physical damage from angelfish being
crammed in an aquarium for an extended period of time and having to
suffer from the lockerroom effect?
'Well-worded... and I don't know exactly. It seems that such an
arrangement might well lead to psychological problems... but the examples I've
witnessed first hand show little signs of such... and often quite
vigorous, colorful specimens...'
I know there is not a guideline of inch per gallon but should even 2
angels be stocked inside a 150 gallon much less 10 or am I overreacting?
'Sort of the situation with semi-compatible mixes of African Great
Lakes Cichlids... either undercrowded, akin to natural presence, or
purposely over-crowded... With commensurate filtration, circulation,
aeration... and feeding...'
Any information would be appreciated.
Thank you,
Chaidan
'Mmm... I wrote a review of a book expounding, exemplifying this
"technique": http://wetwebmedia.com/capmaraqbkrev.htm
By Wayne Shang... You might read it... I am not a fan of this
crowding... as it too often can/does lead to catastrophic loss, but it can be
done. Bob Fenner'

sorry if i offended anyone, especially coolfish china.
 
clekchau, no need to apologize, despite the heated exchange, I always understood your passion was sincere, thanks for the link. While I personally do not find having many large angels appealing, it does show that our knowledge of reef and its fish are still very limited, which makes this hobby ever addictive, to the point that we can easily get carried away.
 
Hi! everyone!
I'm back!
I'm so busy!
My tank not turns out!!!
My fishs VERY GOOD!

After tow day,I will post new pictures.

THS!

:lol: :lol: :lol:
 
I JUST MOVE FROM CHINA TO US.
WHERE ARE YOU FROM?

SCOTT 523:
I GUESS in one of his earlier messages, he mentioned in Chinese , he is based on Ningbo. a city in Central China close to Shanghai.

I am based in Tianjin, Northern China close to Beijing.

Unfortunately, here,you only have a handful of marine LFS with very limited selections of fishes. And they cost several folds what it would cost me back in HK.Where were you based in China ? Where did you get your livestock then?
 
COOLFISH:

WHERE do YOU GET your fishes? In Ningbo? Or do you have them flown in from Guangzhou? I am based in Tianjin, so few local fish shops for the marine trade. I may be moving to Shanghai next year and would hope to know a few tips from where marine fishes wouldbe available.

Cool system, hope you maintain the system well. More Power !
Jia Yow!
 
COOLFISH: Don't worry about these people, they just want something to 'feel good' about. Please post more pics of your setup - it's always nice to see different setups from all over the world y'know :)

Only in America where people have the 'oh-my-God don't hurt the poor puppy' kind of mentality; Where animals have seemingly more importance than people. Not saying that they shouldn't but come on. The dude's taking care of his fish, it's not like he's killing them or something.
 
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