My Journey with C./P. multifasciata

[griseum]

Absutely gorgeous fish!
Knock on wood... I've been establishing a deepwater Marshall Island Biotope and I was able to purchase a M.I. Parac. multifasciatus as well. It came in to the store, sat there for two days, acquired some flukes, as did most of the other deepwater M.I. fish but as soon as he hit my tank, be took to NLS UltraRed 1mm pellets. I added all of the fish to the display at once, with fw dips before entry. Then even with LR i dosed prazi, just to make doubly sure about the flukes. Now at the end of the second treatment of prazi in Display.
I think i may have just been in the right place at the right time. I've wanted this species for a long time and have turned down many that were too skinny or weren't displaying grazing behavior.
Sorry to hear of the original pair but these newer fish look beautiful!

Im sure KKevin only offers the Marshall Islands collected multifasciatus, but I'd like to ask you for sure of their point of origin?
Thanks!

 

[Ambition]

Both pairs are from Vanuatu from what Kevin had told me. He is happy and told me the fish are lookin great. Thanks for sharig your story.

 

[griseum]

I apologize if i semi-hijacked the thread. I was posting from my phone and in a rush as well.
I was hoping that perhaps you had any advice from your experiences? This is my first Paracentropyge spp. And its been a long wait for me to find a specimen worth purchasing. I have and have had many Centropyge angels and i have a good handle on the QT measures with those. I choose not to ever expose them to Copper/cupramine after losing too many in Quarantine even at very slow and low dosing.
I added peppermint shrimp and a half dozen dwarf hermits and i believe the multifasciatus took out a crab and the smallest of the shrimp! This seems contrary to what I've read about there interaction with motile inverts. Everything has said the sessile inverts are picked at and to use caution!
If there is anything you can share, please do. I respect your experience with delicate fish very much and i wish you the best of luck with breeding these amazing fish!

 

[Ambition]

I've been fortunate enough to have Kevin do most of the heavy lifting of getting the fish eating. That is going to be the first priority. To do this, I would suggest having live rock in the QT tank so it can graze while you play around with a wide variety of foods to see what it likes. Brine shrimp and mysis are what the two I have now will eat. Start there, then move into something like clams or oyster on the shell and even live brine just to get them eating. Once they are eating, it is important to feed them often. I think Kevin was feeding around 8x per day for the first month he had this pair. After this I would attempt to get them eating the foods you feed (noting that pellets and flakes are going to be a challenge). Through this time, I would just observe for maladies, and only treat what appears if need be.

 

[griseum]

Thanks!
And in regards to copper/cupramine, what has been your experience with dwarf angels?
If needed do you use it? Or do you prefer an alternative?

I read a few pages back, that Kevin advised copper and formalin in conjunction! Thats a powerful cocktail, IMO. I've had problems dosing dwarfs with just low dose cupramine. They dont handle it well, IME, at all.... But without a doubt Kevin is probably one of the best in the world at what he does... Needless to say, I'd go with his recommendations all the time.
Flukes seem to be the biggest problem for me now, my rhomboidalis fairy had them as well.
After reading Bob Fenner for years, who I believe has always heavily promoted the QT of all fishes before entry to display, has also made exceptions for certain fish like Cirrhilabrus wrasses. His advice in the extreme cases, which I would group Multifasciatus in, is a dutiful FW bath, perhaps with Formalin as well, but much abbreviated. Then entry right to display.

Thanks again !
I think a good QT protocol for these and Venusta should be prepared as a stickie or primer, if the latter does not exist already.

 

[polleke]

Hi Kyle, how long do you want to keep them in the QT? Just wondering since I am looking into a pair of Venusta to be added to my current pair of Multifasciata.

I don't think I want to quarantine them but have not yet made up my mind. With the Multi's I did not do it and that worked really well. But the problem is that they (at least one) still does not eat anything I throw in the tank... so if I add a pair of Venustas I am no longer sure that my tank can sustain that much fish feeding of the live rock.

You have a beautiful pair there!! They are absolutely stunning fish.

 

[Ambition]

plleke, I plan to QT them for another 4 weeks for a total of 6 weeks of observational QT. The QT they are in has some rock, but not much since they eat pretty well. With fish that are new to aquarium life, I would keep a fair amount of rock in the QT for them to graze on until they eat foods offered with vigor.

And thanks!

 

[Ambition]

I have good news!

The presumed female of the two is developing a very nice plump belly. The male isn't getting near as round. I think this is a sign that they are doing well since thy are obviously able to put in weight. The next battle will be to get them eating a wider variety of foods.

 

[SDguy]

Glad to hear they are doing well, Kyle.

 

[griseum]

Thats great!
Congrats!

 

[Ambition]

I want to thank everyone following along with this journey.

Fantastic news to present for the three week update. I witnessed some prespawning behavior between the two of them. They formed a T, with the male's nose near the midline of the female's body. He did some minor showing off as well. I should have figured something was up with the female continuing to get plumper each day.

 

[Ambition]

It's been just over a month with the new pair. They are doing great now, but I almost gave up around the third of May when the female was laying on the bottom and breathing heavy as I described in the thread in the fish disease forum. I thought I was going to lose her, but after getting a couple water changes done and shooting Kevin an email on the issue, she recovered with no other action taken. Kevin told me this can happen when some chemical that isn't supposed to be present enters the water or a parameter swings too fast.

Both are eating very well now and I'm slowly expanding their diet. They both eat PE and Hikari mysis and regular and Spirulina brine with gusto. Since I use a turkey baster to squirt some food into their tank, they will nibble the end of the turkey baster. I have recently began thawing out and breaking up Ocean Nutrition Angel Formula into the mix and they eat it if the pieces are broken up small enough. If it isn't broken up, they don't think it's food since it will look like a flake. During the female's bout of issues, the male ate an entire flake after lessening the feedings with the female not eating.

The female is quite fat, and swims just a little odd because of it I think. I'm still unsure if she is gravid, packing in the food, or constipated. Any way to know how to rule out or know if it is constipation? I'm confident that the success will continue now that I've gotten to the one month mark and I can't express how vital Kevin Kohen and his team were in this since they did the acclimation to captivity for me.

Some pictures, although blurry, that show some of their personality:

 

[Ambition]

 

[aquaph8]

Looking great Kyle , I almost picked up a pair this morning but decided to wait until I have a more fuge like QT setup for them. Venustus is first on my list but I love these guys almost as much along with the false Shepardi that show up from time to time.

 

[Ambition]

Looking great Kyle , I almost picked up a pair this morning but decided to wait until I have a more fuge like QT setup for them. Venustus is first on my list but I love these guys almost as much along with the false Shepardi that show up from time to time.

Thanks. Oddly enough, the pair I have won't exhibit grazing behavior when I'm in the room. I'm contemplating the idea of getting a camera set up to observe them from a different room to see if I catch any spawning, but grazing as well.

I'm keeping my eyes on the look out for a Venustus, Colini, Multicolor, Bicolor or good looking flame angel pair. If I found a true shepardi pair, I would be stoked, but I don't think I'll come across any for some time.

I forgot to note this in the update, but the male has grown enough to where the size difference is becoming more evident. I'm also noticing that the extension of his pelvic fins is getting longer in comparison to the female. Maybe a distinguishing characteristic between the sexes?

 

[Ambition]

Bad news...

I lost the female multibar this morning. She ended up relapsing into sinking to the bottom of the tank and breathing heavy. Like last time I started a series of water changes to see if that would help because my weekly tests showed nothing out of the ordinary. I believe she has been constipated, but I don't think that would cause such an issue? I've been in contact with Kevin since she became symptomatic again. He told me he has another smaller juvie/female he can send should I lose the female. Frankly, I'm not sure whether I hang the towel on a pair of these and keep the male solo and get a different species to work with or if I give it another go with the small juvie/female...

 

[humaguy]

Bad news...

I lost the female multibar this morning. She ended up relapsing into sinking to the bottom of the tank and breathing heavy. Like last time I started a series of water changes to see if that would help because my weekly tests showed nothing out of the ordinary. I believe she has been constipated, but I don't think that would cause such an issue? I've been in contact with Kevin since she became symptomatic again. He told me he has another smaller juvie/female he can send should I lose the female. Frankly, I'm not sure whether I hang the towel on a pair of these and keep the male solo and get a different species to work with or if I give it another go with the small juvie/female...

sorry, big bummer....I have some of the pairs you are looking for....where do you live? I would be happy to donate them towards your breeding program...

 

[Ambition]

sorry, big bummer....I have some of the pairs you are looking for....where do you live? I would be happy to donate them towards your breeding program...

I live in MN. I'm going to think about another shot over the long weekend and let Kevin know what my plan is when he is back from his fun weekend, though I'm leaning very heavily towards keeping the male solo for awhile and work with him more. Maybe see if I can snag a baby venusta from Karen when they are ready for new homes. He is definitely display material with his pelvic fins growing.

 

[humaguy]

I live in MN. I'm going to think about another shot over the long weekend and let Kevin know what my plan is when he is back from his fun weekend, though I'm leaning very heavily towards keeping the male solo for awhile and work with him more. Maybe see if I can snag a baby venusta from Karen when they are ready for new homes. He is definitely display material with his pelvic fins growing.

Cool, lemme know...

 

[aquaph8]

Sorry to hear Kyle, it's so tough figuring out what is wrong with them and a lotta times it's too late already. I've probably even loved them to death on occasion, live and learn though . Hope you keep working on it man, don't give up.