My LFS's display tank - defies rules of reefkeeping

[TheFishTeen]

My local fish store's display tank that defies the rules of reef keeping.

-75 Gal. (one employee said 55 Gallons, owner said 75) Starphire front with euro-bracing and an internal overflow. Sounds nice right? Yah, well the tank is beautiful! And the filterations isn't that bad either!

-20 Gallon Sump with a filter sock and an ASM G2 skimmer. TLF PhosBan Reactor running GFO. 1/4 HP chiller. RIO return pump. 1400 GPH koralia, 1 on each side. LED lighting.

Sounds nice so far right? Get ready to be shocked:

Stocking List:
Majestic Angel
Emperor Angel
Koran Angel
Purple Tang
Clown Tang
Chevron Tang
Bangui Cardinal
Kole Tang

ALL IN ONE TANK!!! But wait, there's more!!!
Corals: Lot's of SPS, LPS and star polyps, all lit under LED lighting. Nice right?

THE KILLER: THE ENTIRE TANK RUNS OF TAP WATER!

Since when could 75 Gallons of conditioned *tap water* mixed with salt handle such an insane bio load? Oh, and did I mention the tank is crystal clear without a sign of any bad algaes! The only algae growing is coraline algae!

What are they doing right?

 

[disc1]

They are at a fish store. They have access to all sorts of stuff that would cost us money. They have an employee there to pull algae out of that tank every morning if they need to. The stock is probably transient. They have a nearly unlimited supply of fish.

The fish store can pull a lot of stuff off that you can't at home. Just because they are the fish store. Then they try to tell you it's OK to do with your tank because that makes them more money.

 

[Gill_bucket]

That is awsome, i love tanks that defie the norm. I wonder how often they change water? How big are the fish, I am imagining they must be baby's?

 

[ackee]

What's the big deal? I use straight tap water for most of my tanks. My local tap water is very good quality. I do some chemical filtration first, then mix in the salt. I've been doing this for years and years. I use RO water for a few delicate applications, but I have no trouble maintaining and growing some hardier corals, sponges and sea fans in mixed fish/ invertebrate aquaria that use tap water. The overcrowding in the LFS tank will not be a problem if there is a fairly rapid turnover of the stock and/or if frequent water changes are done. Don't believe everything you read. Skill and a deft experienced touch will trump high tech and exacting parameters almost every time. There are exceptions, though, particularly when attempting to raise fry.

 

[gon08]

They are at a fish store. They have access to all sorts of stuff that would cost us money. They have an employee there to pull algae out of that tank every morning if they need to. The stock is probably transient. They have a nearly unlimited supply of fish.

The fish store can pull a lot of stuff off that you can't at home. Just because they are the fish store. Then they try to tell you it's OK to do with your tank because that makes them more money.

I hate to break it to you but the fish store doesn't have anything under the hood thats not available to you. Also important to know is that there is no such thing as any product or piece of equipment that could do what you claim to be impossible. Employing someone full time just to pull algae is counter productive to say the least. As for cost and unlimited supply..... the store is there to make money not throw money into a tank that is going to cost them money..... fish and products cost them money too.

 

[ziyaadb]

how long has he has it running?
Longer then 3 years with the same exact fish?
corals grown from frags?
If yes then i am impressed

 

[jim6584]

It is a sales pitch...

It is a sales pitch...

Look a LFS knows there are not too many people getting into the hobby if they know it is going to cost them $5000+ up front for a tank like that.

They want to get you started with the pretty salt water fish at a very low price point. I am not saying the LFS is being dishonest here they have to use a model that works or they will not survive in business. It is kind of like having kids, if some tell you the eventual cost of each kid and a wife, a good dog & salt water tanks seem rather cheap!

You get a person into a salt water tank for as low cost as possible. Now you have a customer. When they are having problems, no you get to sell them more stuff! Water problems - We have something that will fix that. Coral problems - You need better lights! Fish problems - You need a bigger tank!

If you spend 4 hours trying to explain all of the requirements and the total costs, you're going to lose a customer because they'll say nice tank but I can't afford it and walk out the door. An uneducated consumer has no excuses with the wealth of information available on-line. A LFS that doesn't understand what butters his bread is not going to have any butter or bread.

A smart LFS doesn't rip customers off but they slowly get them into the hobby in baby steps. Knowing that customer will come back to them again and again. But it isn't their job to blow the customers mind and scare them away as soon as they walk in the door!

 

[duncantse]

IMO, there are two types of fish tanks. The American way and the Asian way. The American way likes to stock their tank lightly and the Asian way likes to stock their tank heavily. IMO & IMO, I don't see anything wrong with both setups.

 

[gon08]

Look a LFS knows there are not too many people getting into the hobby if they know it is going to cost them $5000+ up front for a tank like that.

They want to get you started with the pretty salt water fish at a very low price point. I am not saying the LFS is being dishonest here they have to use a model that works or they will not survive in business. It is kind of like having kids, if some tell you the eventual cost of each kid and a wife, a good dog & salt water tanks seem rather cheap!

You get a person into a salt water tank for as low cost as possible. Now you have a customer. When they are having problems, no you get to sell them more stuff! Water problems - We have something that will fix that. Coral problems - You need better lights! Fish problems - You need a bigger tank!

If you spend 4 hours trying to explain all of the requirements and the total costs, you're going to lose a customer because they'll say nice tank but I can't afford it and walk out the door. An uneducated consumer has no excuses with the wealth of information available on-line. A LFS that doesn't understand what butters his bread is not going to have any butter or bread.

A smart LFS doesn't rip customers off but they slowly get them into the hobby in baby steps. Knowing that customer will come back to them again and again. But it isn't their job to blow the customers mind and scare them away as soon as they walk in the door!

Every LFS I've ever been to in the 22 years I've been in this hobby that did what you describe as a sales gimmick is no longer in business. It doesn't make business sense to deceive customers because they don't return. They simply get out of the hobby with a sour taste in their mouths or they go to a more reputable LFS.

 

[TheFishTeen]

I visit the store almost weekly and they have not added or removed a single fish! The angels are all about 4" and the clown tang, kole and chevron tang are all around 3" but the purple is about 4.5". The purple is growing at an incredible pace!

 

[gon08]

I get all kinds of flack for my tank all the time.
4 year old 40 gallon sps dominated tank with no skimmer, no refugium, no deep sand bed, and 3 water changes a year. Fish: 1 Hippo tang, 1 yellow tang, 1 flame angel, 2 green chromis (breeding pair), 1 six line wrasse, and 1 bristletail filefish. I've been called cruel, amateur, unethical.... you name it. Yet my fish are healthy and happy and the coral is healthy and growing.

 

[billsreef]

I visit the store almost weekly and they have not added or removed a single fish! The angels are all about 4" and the clown tang, kole and chevron tang are all around 3" but the purple is about 4.5". The purple is growing at an incredible pace!

Those juvie fish are the reason that particular bunch of fish is working for now. Won't last when the grow up

As for clean, it's called water changes and manual labor

 

[Flippers4pups]

After eighteen years of reef keeping, it still amazes me at the lack of responsible actions in this hobby. Go ahead and stock your tanks to the rim with fish and corals because a LFS does without researching their needs, you will be throwing away money! (Not to mention the life of the animal.)

 

[snorvich]

So, just out of curiosity, how does one determine that their fish are "happy". I see this all the time.

 

[snorvich]

Those juvie fish are the reason that particular bunch of fish is working for now. Won't last when the grow up

As for clean, it's called water changes and manual labor

Exactly. It is essential that a LFS display tank be gorgeous and highly populated. Not that it is good practice.

 

[gon08]

So, just out of curiosity, how does one determine that their fish are "happy". I see this all the time.

Sensing your sarcasm...... Obviously fish don't show emotion but their behavior is not of a fish in distress in any way. If a fish acts normal swimming normal and eating well, then to me that's a happy fish. The fish are healthy and growing normal and eventually will need to be put in a larger home. I don't lose fish, they die of old age in my tanks.

How do you know your dog or cat are happy? How do you know your 1 yo baby is happy?

 

[billsreef]

Exactly. It is essential that a LFS display tank be gorgeous and highly populated. Not that it is good practice.

I don't think pushing the limits of population is essential to a LFS display tank. I've run some very nice LFS display tanks over the years that were not overpopulated, and had stable populations over a period of several years. Those tanks always caught peoples interest and hooked a number of people. Also got people interested in species they never would looked twice at in the stores stock tanks, but when acclimated and cozy in a proper tank looked quite nice. In my opinion (and it worked well for me when I worked in the trade) a store display tank should be what customer can expect to be able to do at home, not how overstocked a professional aquarist can pull off in a store setting.

 

[gon08]

After eighteen years of reef keeping, it still amazes me at the lack of responsible actions in this hobby. Go ahead and stock your tanks to the rim with fish and corals because a LFS does without researching their needs, you will be throwing away money! (Not to mention the life of the animal.)

Key word here is "Research". Same can be said about freshwater also. How many people buy the beta in the cup and go home and keep it in a bowl only marginally larger than the cup they came in. I think that stocking the tank and being able to keep it and the inhabitants healthy is not the problem for the LFS, it's the unwillingness of most consumers to educate themselves and the LFS dropping the ball on making sure they do.

I used to set up and maintain high end tanks for celebs and businesses in South Florida and the shops I worked with all refused to sell fish without gauging the customers knowledge and a run down on their systems. They've been in business for over 20 years and still going strong.

 

[Chris27]

So, just out of curiosity, how does one determine that their fish are "happy". I see this all the time.

Because Disney and Pixar said so silly!

 

[kcinnick]

I maintained my first reef with water changes. It was a 55 gallon with a HOB filter and fluorescent lights. It was packed to the brim with coral and fish. Oh, I used tap water and the cheapest salt I could find. It too was covered in coralin and I had decent growth without any algae.