blfuller123
Premium Member
updates/pictures?
My wood tank build
- Thread starter dsandfort
- Start date
dsandfort
Premium Member
Sorry-nothing new to post that is interesting. You can only post so many epoxy lay-up pictures. If I didn't have a job, this would be much easier and faster.
However, the LAST FIBERGLASS goes on this weekend. And, the bulkheads are on the way so I will be drilling in a week. 14 holes to seal once drilled.
Shopping for glass has started.
However, the LAST FIBERGLASS goes on this weekend. And, the bulkheads are on the way so I will be drilling in a week. 14 holes to seal once drilled.
Shopping for glass has started.
You all should look at my fellow norwegian aquarist web page on plywood construction:
http://www.jonolavsakvarium.com/eng_diy/2200litre/2200litres.html
Dan
http://www.jonolavsakvarium.com/eng_diy/2200litre/2200litres.html
Dan
If you check that page, also look at this:
http://www.jonolavsakvarium.com/eng_diy/tankbuilding2006/index.html
It's a much smaller tank, but built with a better technique. In fact, the same technique dsandfort is using! Except the resin is polyester instead of epoxy. The advantage of polyester is price and ease of use. Epoxy is a far superior resin since it allows taking advantage of the full strength of the fiberglass, whereas the polyester only allows 1/3 of the strength to be used. It has to do with the brittleness of polyester that makes it break long before the fibers. But still, when you never use that strength, like me, there is no point in having it.
The page has some theory around building these tanks. I see some people are using up to 10 layers of glass on the inside of the tanks. What's the point? Surface strength? Even 1 layer of epoxy and glass gives enough of that. Stiffness? For stiffness you must place the glass on the outside of the tank not on the inside.
http://www.jonolavsakvarium.com/eng_diy/tankbuilding2006/index.html
It's a much smaller tank, but built with a better technique. In fact, the same technique dsandfort is using! Except the resin is polyester instead of epoxy. The advantage of polyester is price and ease of use. Epoxy is a far superior resin since it allows taking advantage of the full strength of the fiberglass, whereas the polyester only allows 1/3 of the strength to be used. It has to do with the brittleness of polyester that makes it break long before the fibers. But still, when you never use that strength, like me, there is no point in having it.
The page has some theory around building these tanks. I see some people are using up to 10 layers of glass on the inside of the tanks. What's the point? Surface strength? Even 1 layer of epoxy and glass gives enough of that. Stiffness? For stiffness you must place the glass on the outside of the tank not on the inside.
NY_Englishman
Premium Member
and, as a side note, don't forget Jon's concerns regarding using long timbers for the front frame as opposed to plywood, mentioned here:
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=716410&perpage=25&pagenumber=3
Great work Jon, by the way, and great thread dsandfort. Good luck.
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=716410&perpage=25&pagenumber=3
Great work Jon, by the way, and great thread dsandfort. Good luck.
NY_Englishman
Premium Member
dsandfort - I didn't forget - my comments were for your (growing) wider audience, not your goodself. That's why is was a side note.
Keep up the great work!
Keep up the great work!
masharp1126
New member
You ended up with 6 layers inside, correct?
1 fiberglass
2 epoxy
1 fiberglass
2 epoxy
Did you allow it to dry between coats, then sand, and apply another?
Got my epoxy and fiberglass in late last week, so will probably start cutting plywood this coming weekend. I went with Raka epoxy, instead of West Systems. I read several comparisons and hope it will be just as good, but less expensive.
1 fiberglass
2 epoxy
1 fiberglass
2 epoxy
Did you allow it to dry between coats, then sand, and apply another?
Got my epoxy and fiberglass in late last week, so will probably start cutting plywood this coming weekend. I went with Raka epoxy, instead of West Systems. I read several comparisons and hope it will be just as good, but less expensive.
dsandfort
Premium Member
Hi Mark-
Yep, 6 layers.
The way it works is to lay down the fiberglass cloth dry then wet it out with epoxy making sure to get all the fibers wet. You can tell they are wet when they become transparent. Then squeegee out most of the epoxy with a straight edge. You want the fiberglass mat in contact with the wood and not floating in epoxy.
With West System, you can recoat when the previous coat reacts and is almost set up, about the tackyness of masking tape. If you let it go too far, no tack, then you need to let it cure completely, sand it down and go again.
I used slow set hardner and was able to get 3 layers down in 1 day. Then I sanded it all down and did 3 more layers. I tried fast set hardner but it was too fast on the big surfaces. I think the middle sanding gave me a nicer finished product.
Have fun, wear your gloves. Raka has a good how-to page. You might want to pick up some fillers to thicken the epoxy. Much easier to fill holes and other imperfections.
Del
Yep, 6 layers.
The way it works is to lay down the fiberglass cloth dry then wet it out with epoxy making sure to get all the fibers wet. You can tell they are wet when they become transparent. Then squeegee out most of the epoxy with a straight edge. You want the fiberglass mat in contact with the wood and not floating in epoxy.
With West System, you can recoat when the previous coat reacts and is almost set up, about the tackyness of masking tape. If you let it go too far, no tack, then you need to let it cure completely, sand it down and go again.
I used slow set hardner and was able to get 3 layers down in 1 day. Then I sanded it all down and did 3 more layers. I tried fast set hardner but it was too fast on the big surfaces. I think the middle sanding gave me a nicer finished product.
Have fun, wear your gloves. Raka has a good how-to page. You might want to pick up some fillers to thicken the epoxy. Much easier to fill holes and other imperfections.
Del
masharp1126
New member
Del,
I did get some filler for thickening it up. Also got the pumps, so it should be just as easy to mix as the WS.
When you were laying the fiberglass, did you start with one flat surface (let's say the bottom), apply the fiberglass and overlap the sides, back and front. Then flip the tank on to it's back and lay the fiberglass on the back, still overlapping the bottom and sides? Or, did you try to work on vertical surfaces? And, on the first layer of fiberglass, did you end up with mutliple layers in the corners from overlapping?
Thanks in advance for your answers. Trying not to screw this up. I've done plenty of wookworking, but never used fiberglass and epoxy before.
I did get some filler for thickening it up. Also got the pumps, so it should be just as easy to mix as the WS.
When you were laying the fiberglass, did you start with one flat surface (let's say the bottom), apply the fiberglass and overlap the sides, back and front. Then flip the tank on to it's back and lay the fiberglass on the back, still overlapping the bottom and sides? Or, did you try to work on vertical surfaces? And, on the first layer of fiberglass, did you end up with mutliple layers in the corners from overlapping?
Thanks in advance for your answers. Trying not to screw this up. I've done plenty of wookworking, but never used fiberglass and epoxy before.
dsandfort
Premium Member
I tried my hand at vertical surfaces, I'm not very good at it. So, like you said, 1 flat surface at a time. This ended up with 2 layers of fiberglass on each surface and 4 layers in each corner.
Here are some updates.................
Last fiberglass in the overflow. Actually, last fiberglass period.
Finish joinery on the outside corners. The glop in the top left is where I missed a big drip and glued the entire tank to the floor. NOTE TO SELF: Use some plastic dummy.
Now some real aquarium type stuff. Bulkheads. The ones on the back of the overflow will actually go in the bottom. 2 closed loops fed from the back, 1 under the substrate, 1 to the top middle 1/3 of tank. 2 more fed from the sides and returning in the top left and right 1/3s. 1 bulkhead in the overflow is just for a small manifold to drip in new arrivals.
Here are some updates.................
Last fiberglass in the overflow. Actually, last fiberglass period.
Finish joinery on the outside corners. The glop in the top left is where I missed a big drip and glued the entire tank to the floor. NOTE TO SELF: Use some plastic dummy.
Now some real aquarium type stuff. Bulkheads. The ones on the back of the overflow will actually go in the bottom. 2 closed loops fed from the back, 1 under the substrate, 1 to the top middle 1/3 of tank. 2 more fed from the sides and returning in the top left and right 1/3s. 1 bulkhead in the overflow is just for a small manifold to drip in new arrivals.
cbui2
Premium Member
dsandfort, very very nice i know how it is working with fiberglass and man that stuff is itchy, for the trick i coat myself with baby powder on me so glass won't soak in my pore when sanding it down, six layers this baby is gonna be so strong, but more won't hurt in the beginning but less will kill you in the end...keep it up looking great
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