N/P reducing pellets (solid vodka dosing)

[Scej12]

....On a note, my PH is always low ( 7.7). I dose alk to bring it up (but making sure its not too high) and i drip kalk at night to help with PH too. But it didn't seem to be working.

To add a little perspective - I have two large systems that I look after with carbon dosing: one total about 500g using biopellets; and the other approx. 1000g total using EtOH/vodka.

The bp system struggles to maintain a pH of 7.9 - 8.0 and I do have cyanobacteria in this system. On this system, the only form of aeration is from a relatively small protein skimmer (only 6" diameter by about 18" high); the primary circulation (not including powerheads) is just enough to turn the tank volume over about 2.5x per hour, however, thanks to the bp: NO3 is 0 and PO4 is 0.28. On this system, even when I pushed the alk up to 12, the best pH I was able to achieve was about 8.1 during the photoperiod...

Alternatively, the vodka dosing system just happens to have quite a large oxygen infusion regime. It has two large beckett run Protein skimmers (each are 10" dia by 48" high; plus a ginormous bio-tower (18"x24"x42"H); plus 2 large macro algae refugiums on reverse photoperiods. On this system, Nitrates are also around 0ppm; and PO4 hovers around 0.32... there was a short bout with cyano on this system as well, but eventually ran its course after about 3 weeks away from iodine and a focus on elevating pH. Pertinent to this discussion is the fact that on this system, I've been able to achieve a pH of 8.1 - 8.2 with my hardness hovering between 6.5-7.5.

In other words the system with a good strong strategy of O2 replenishment, has a greater capacity for alkalinity without upsetting pH if that makes any sense.

Sheldon

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

A week into the start of bio pellets and now my pH is at 8.6. Are these bacteria using up the co2? =

They produce CO2 and will tend to reduce pH. Pellets won't generally raise pH and definitely won't boost pH to excessive levels. I agree with SJ to double check the measurement and also check the alk. If the pH is high and alk is normal, aeration will bring the pH back toward normal.

 

[Rhodes19]

Ok, I figured out why my Reef Octopus BR 140 only turns pellets on one side. The bottom of the center tube just barley touches the top of the triangular diverter on the bottom and most of the tube diverts to one side only. I'll have to see if I can find some pvc and cut it to the proper length so it centers on the diverter.

 

[plankton99]

Reef Octopus BR 70 Clogging with BRS Pellets

Reef Octopus BR 70 Clogging with BRS Pellets

Does anyone have this problem? I have the Reef Octopus BR-70 pellet reactor and am using Bulk reef supply pellets and they are clogging the unit.

When i first connect it the flow is a strong biol (see pic below) and then overnight the little pellets get caught in the slits at the bottom and clogs up the whole thing to where it barely boils.

Should I use another pellet? I just ordered the NP Bio Pellets from Marine depot, they seem rounder and may not clog like the BRS pellets.

This is what I ordered from Marine Depot:
http://www.marinedepot.com/NP_Biope...r_Media-NP_Biopellets-XB1113-FIFMCHNR-vi.html


<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/dG5gmZSeLxa4NGvUhuKluQ?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_NXpuq2m0IHc/TbTwu1-b_MI/AAAAAAAADUo/S-NAmJ0FloY/s800/IMG_5504.JPG" /></a>

 

[Paradiddle7]

How much flow are you putting through the reactor. Sounds like you need a bigger pump and more flow.

 

[plankton99]

How much flow are you putting through the reactor. Sounds like you need a bigger pump and more flow.

I am using a Maxijet 1200, like I said when i first hook it up and unclog the slits at the bottom, the flow is too much, too much of a boil. Then usually in a day or two, the pellets get stuck in the slits and the flow is greatly diminished.

 

[gary faulkner]

You can get a round needlepoint canvas from wally world or one of the craft stores to add to the reactor and keep it from clogging. There is a thread on here somewhere talking about this. Usually used to convert a GFO or carbon reactor to pellets. Also BRS sells them for their reactors.

HTH

 

[Rhodes19]

Does anyone have this problem? I have the Reef Octopus BR-70 pellet reactor and am using Bulk reef supply pellets and they are clogging the unit.

When i first connect it the flow is a strong biol (see pic below) and then overnight the little pellets get caught in the slits at the bottom and clogs up the whole thing to where it barely boils.

Should I use another pellet? I just ordered the NP Bio Pellets from Marine depot, they seem rounder and may not clog like the BRS pellets.

This is what I ordered from Marine Depot:
http://www.marinedepot.com/NP_Biope...r_Media-NP_Biopellets-XB1113-FIFMCHNR-vi.html


<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/dG5gmZSeLxa4NGvUhuKluQ?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_NXpuq2m0IHc/TbTwu1-b_MI/AAAAAAAADUo/S-NAmJ0FloY/s800/IMG_5504.JPG" /></a>

Hi plankton,

I have the BR 140. I'm not sure I understand what you mean by clogging. Are the pellets physically blocking the out let flow at the bottom of the tube or is it just not pushing the pellets on one side of the reactor? If its like my reactor, the tube does not go all the way down to the triangular shaped diverter and the tube is not centered so the flow gets pushed to one side of the reactor. I was going to cut my tube and put an extra inch to it so it would reach but unfortunately, the tube is in metric. HTH

 

[plankton99]

Hi plankton,

I have the BR 140. I'm not sure I understand what you mean by clogging. Are the pellets physically blocking the out let flow at the bottom of the tube or is it just not pushing the pellets on one side of the reactor? If its like my reactor, the tube does not go all the way down to the triangular shaped diverter and the tube is not centered so the flow gets pushed to one side of the reactor. I was going to cut my tube and put an extra inch to it so it would reach but unfortunately, the tube is in metric. HTH

Rhodes: If you look at the picture and at the very bottom, there is a grey piece with slits, you can see the first pellet getting stuck in the slit, after 24 hours the slits get clogged and the flow is greatly reduced to a tiny boil. IF the pellets were round I dont this this would happen. My tube and with grey piece at the bottom hits the red triangle at the bottom. Do you think I should shorten it so it does not touch?

 

[Sohal Tang Tim]

I use NP pellets

I use NP pellets

I have the BR-140 reactor...same mfg and styling but larger.....
I use the NP pellets and a mag 5 pump to fire the reactor but I have to
back the pump off significantly due to the large amount of flow that pump
gives the reactor......

I have had *ZERO* clogging.... the beads are tumbling as slow as I can
make them tumble and the exhaust effluent from the reactor leads to
the intake on my skimmer pump.

Zero problems with the BR-140 and NP pellets.

it took 2 days for all the pellets to get the *air* off of them so they would
sink ...so for 2 days there was a significant amount of pellets that would
float to the top of the reactor...but a bit of shaking and lightly tapping of
the reactor and patience and 100% of the beads sank to bottom and began
tumbling with the batch perfectly.


You should speak to the supplier of your reactor and get them to advise
about the clogging and advise them what pump you use with it etc
and they should have a darn good idea what your problem is with it.
Contact the mfg directly! Internet allows us that easy luxury quickly
and efficiently....

Best of luck

Tim

 

[Rhodes19]

Rhodes: If you look at the picture and at the very bottom, there is a grey piece with slits, you can see the first pellet getting stuck in the slit, after 24 hours the slits get clogged and the flow is greatly reduced to a tiny boil. IF the pellets were round I don't this this would happen. My tube and with grey piece at the bottom hits the red triangle at the bottom. Do you think I should shorten it so it does not touch?

Oh, ok, I see it now. I have no idea. My BR 140 does not have slits at the bottom and it is a solid gray tube from top to bottom not clear like your's. I'd shoot Coralvue an email and see what they have to say. I think the bottom of the tube should be resting on the outer edges of the red triangle and just off the bottom so the flow can be equally divided. Sorry I wasn't any help.

 

[Sohal Tang Tim]

coralvue can answer

coralvue can answer

Agreed...shoot coralvue an email and they will know the solution for this glitch. You should not be having trouble with your equipment!


Best of luck

Tim

 

[SimonSKL]

It seems the purpose of the spiraling slits on the collar is to create a swirling or vortex kind of water movement for the pellets. The problem with this design is when you turn off the pump, some of the pellets will get sucked into the slits as the water flows back to the pump.

 

[DarkSephiroth]

To add a little perspective - I have two large systems that I look after with carbon dosing: one total about 500g using biopellets; and the other approx. 1000g total using EtOH/vodka.

The bp system struggles to maintain a pH of 7.9 - 8.0 and I do have cyanobacteria in this system. On this system, the only form of aeration is from a relatively small protein skimmer (only 6" diameter by about 18" high); the primary circulation (not including powerheads) is just enough to turn the tank volume over about 2.5x per hour, however, thanks to the bp: NO3 is 0 and PO4 is 0.28. On this system, even when I pushed the alk up to 12, the best pH I was able to achieve was about 8.1 during the photoperiod...

Alternatively, the vodka dosing system just happens to have quite a large oxygen infusion regime. It has two large beckett run Protein skimmers (each are 10" dia by 48" high; plus a ginormous bio-tower (18"x24"x42"H); plus 2 large macro algae refugiums on reverse photoperiods. On this system, Nitrates are also around 0ppm; and PO4 hovers around 0.32... there was a short bout with cyano on this system as well, but eventually ran its course after about 3 weeks away from iodine and a focus on elevating pH. Pertinent to this discussion is the fact that on this system, I've been able to achieve a pH of 8.1 - 8.2 with my hardness hovering between 6.5-7.5.

In other words the system with a good strong strategy of O2 replenishment, has a greater capacity for alkalinity without upsetting pH if that makes any sense.

Sheldon

Scej12,

I don't have an ozone generator but what i did was raising my koralia evo 1400 to the top so it pulls air into the water. That's what i heard from people that can't afford to buy an O3 gen, do you think that would help my O2

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Adding O2 will not impact pH or precipitation of calcium carbonate. It is carbon dioxide that has the effect, not O2.

Also, ozone is not especially useful for boosting O2 unless you use very large amounts.

 

[bertoni]

It's very unlikely that your system has an oxygen problem. That seems very rare. Most likely, the tank is at full saturation with oxygen. It might have a surplus of carbon dioxide with respect to the ambient air, but with a skimmer, I'm skeptical that there's much discrepancy.

 

[Scej12]

Scej12,

I don't have an ozone generator but what i did was raising my koralia evo 1400 to the top so it pulls air into the water. That's what i heard from people that can't afford to buy an O3 gen, do you think that would help my O2

That would help the O2, but having bubbles blowing through your reef is not a good thing for a couple of reasons, beyond the obvious aesthetic. You'll probably find your corals sliming a lot, as well as encourage more salt-creep around your system...

I would simply aim your koralia (from below the surface) at an angle that breaks up the surface tension without actually introducing bubbles. The constant rolling/surface agitating will encourage that gas exchange you're looking for; and will ultimately help boost your O2; evacuate your CO2; thereby raising your pH to some degree - the question is... will it be enough considering your system size, and its respective loading [w/ respirating livestock]...??

HTH - Sheldon

 

[Scej12]

Adding O2 will not impact pH or precipitation of calcium carbonate. It is carbon dioxide that has the effect, not O2.

Also, ozone is not especially useful for boosting O2 unless you use very large amounts.

It's the gas exchange I'm focusing on. My thinking is that your surface tension is the barrier which obstructs equilibration between your ambient air composition and the water composition, the latter of which has several factors of influence within (relative size: population density; not to mention the respiration of the enhanced bacteria population we are creating with the biopellets) Unless you have a particular issue with CO2 saturation within your ambient air (which is true in some circumstances) , I would think that the tendency would be to have CO2 leave your aquarium water and O2 replace it once you can break up the obstacle of surface tension.

The entire premiss of facilitating O2 saturation by employing surface movement fundamentally assumes that your ambient air does not have more CO2 than your aquarium; and your aquarium does not have more O2 than your ambient air... so in effect, the surface agitation exhausts CO2 from your aquarium, and replaces it with O2. Is this not the case?

Sheldon

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

People frequently confuse O2 issues with CO2/pH issues when we discuss aeration, and some of the posts above had the potential to confuse folks, even if they are correct, so I just wanted to clarify.

The entire premiss of facilitating O2 saturation by employing surface movement fundamentally assumes that your ambient air does not have more CO2 than your aquarium; and your aquarium does not have more O2 than your ambient air... so in effect, the surface agitation exhausts CO2 from your aquarium, and replaces it with O2. Is this not the case?


It can be the case, but it isn't always. In many tanks using limewater that run high in pH, more aeration serves to bring in CO2. Also, some tanks may run supersaturated in O2 during the day due to photosynthesis, and more aeration then could tend to expel it.

I would think that the tendency would be to have CO2 leave your aquarium water and O2 replace it once you can break up the obstacle of surface tension.


These O2 and CO2 processes are entirely independent. One does not replace or in any way impact the other in seawater.

 

[Scej12]

People frequently confuse O2 issues with CO2/pH issues when we discuss aeration, and some of the posts above had the potential to confuse folks, even if they are correct, so I just wanted to clarify.

The entire premiss of facilitating O2 saturation by employing surface movement fundamentally assumes that your ambient air does not have more CO2 than your aquarium; and your aquarium does not have more O2 than your ambient air... so in effect, the surface agitation exhausts CO2 from your aquarium, and replaces it with O2. Is this not the case?


It can be the case, but it isn't always. In many tanks using limewater that run high in pH, more aeration serves to bring in CO2. Also, some tanks may run supersaturated in O2 during the day due to photosynthesis, and more aeration then could tend to expel it.

I would think that the tendency would be to have CO2 leave your aquarium water and O2 replace it once you can break up the obstacle of surface tension.


These O2 and CO2 processes are entirely independent. One does not replace or in any way impact the other in seawater.

I get your drift I believe... the point to emphasize is equilibrium although individual factors may differ from case to case.

Is it then fair to say that surface exchange would favour CO2 reduction in Darksephiroth's aquarium having a circumstance of low pH (7.7 if I recall correctly); unless... there is even more CO2 in the respective ambient environment...?