new clowns!!! 2 b/w ocellaris and 2 hybrids

[Anemone]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10333743#post10333743 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jeeperrs
They have a back-up plan and will use it if they need. Goodness, is this RC or PETA?

Well, it's not PETA.

As far as back up plans go, once again, long-term members have seen them all. The "I'll get a larger tank when my tang outgrows my 40 gallon," or "I'll take it back to the LFS if it starts to look bad," or "I'll give my shark to the public aquarium if it outgrows my 120 gallon tank" backup plan is a pretty common thread in these types of posts. Unfortunately, the "experiments" often fail well before the backup plan ever comes into play.

The only time I ever take these backup plans seriously is if they involve a proven outlet that is already set up (ie, "I'll move the tang into my 220 gallon tank which is already up and running when it outgrows my 40"). Unfortunately, this case doesn't make that grade (for me), since the original poster "will" set up this other tank sometime in the future.

Kevin

 

[Slakker]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10333743#post10333743 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jeeperrs
So in this comment you say it could be possible in a 200+ tank and now you say it is not possible period. Again, I just ask for consistency in advice ...

Very few people have had limited success with docile species of clownfish (i.e. Ocellaris and Perideraion) in 200+ gallon systems. Another post in this thread stated that problems arose with Polymnus clowns in a 600 gallon tank.

So, by following very basic though processes, we can safely come to the conclusion that long term peace with Polymnus hybrids and Ocellaris clowns in a 120 gallon tank is an unreasonable expectation.

 

[jeeperrs]

I guess I am an optimist for the care others will give to their tank. I am still interested in how this works out I was actually having this same discussion with a couple LFS owners the other weekend. They have both seen it work and fail. I am not saying it is with these two specific types of clowns though.

So you think I should take my 4 foot shark out of my 75 now, or wait a little longer I am just teasing you anemone.

 

[triggerfish1976]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10333888#post10333888 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jeeperrs
I was actually having this same discussion with a couple LFS owners the other weekend. They have both seen it work and fail.

The exception to the rule comment is also a general statement that gets brought up by anyone who is trying to defy the general "rules of thumb" regarding fish species compatibiltity and husbandry. I see this statement brought up frequently when discussing angelfish, butterflyfish and triggers in reef tanks or when people want to mix fish that are normally not compatible in the same tank. There are hundreds of threads where people have sucess with all of the scenarios noted above but most of these "experiments" are only months old and the hobbyists already want to boast that they have proved their experiment to be a success. The next thing you know, newer more inexperienced hobbyists read the thread and think that they can duplicate the same scenario but unfortunetly the original poster provided very little scientific explanation as the how they were able to achive their success mainly because they just threw the fish in the tank and crossed their fingers. The next thing that happens is the original poster stops commenting on their experiment because they woke up one day and found their fish fighting. They are to embarrased to post their findings on RC thus giving the illusion that they are experiencing continued success.
I understand that there will be exceptions to the rule based on individual fish but my experiences have taught me that natural instict will eventually take over at some point and cause the so-called experiment to be a failure to some extent.
As far as my situation goes, I was not attempting to keep all of the clowns noted above in order to prove that it could be done. It was more hopeful thinking because my Saddlebacks had been with me for almost 5 years and the percs. live peacefully with them for 3 of those 5. I didn't have any compatibility issues with them until the Latz were introduced which obviously push the limits of the territories already established in the tank. I anticipated agression and knew that someone was probably going to have to go before I introduced the Latz given the size of the tank and the way it is aquascaped but you can never underestimate the agression of an established female percula clownfish.

 

[asch803]

wow, i just went and played golf and in the 6 or 7 hours since I posted this mornimg, quite a few people have responded...some I agree with and some I don't...I will see how this goes and if i have problems, I will either add them to the tank i mentioned i will be setting up (sorry it's not ALREADY SET UP) or i can put a pair in my ALREADY available 80 gallon cube... I also wanted to point out that they are not pure ploymnus, but hybrids, and I'm not sure if the same holds in fish as in dogs, but mutts are generally smarter, healthier and have better dispositions than pure breds they were bred from...I was also sure to add all juvies about the same size and age...As one person did point out and I tried to allude to earlier, all animals are different, so for you to say you are SURE something will or will not happen is just plain ignorant (IMO)...I could see you saying, I think this or I think that...but you're SURE?

For those of you that care, I will continue to keep you updated, but can we please end theis whole debate now? I know i introduced it and asked for it, but let's stop, please...

Thanks!

Andy

 

[Slakker]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10335928#post10335928 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by asch803
... and I'm not sure if the same holds in fish as in dogs, but mutts are generally smarter, healthier and have better dispositions than pure breds they were bred from ... I was also sure to add all juvies about the same size and age ...

Fish to Dogs? That's quite a reach.

Added the same size juvi's will only delay the inevitable. It will happen eventually. Perhaps when a dominant pair emerges, perhaps when the pair decides it's time to spawn, or perhaps sooner, but it will end badly, and likely violently.

 

[asch803]

Thanks for the positive wishes, Tyler...I guess it's only a matter of time before the violence begins.

 

[Slakker]

What do you expect, a cookie?

You're taking unnecessary risks with your livestock. I don't hand out commendations for this sort of thing.

If it's still peaceful in 10 years, Congratulations. You were right, and I was wrong.

 

[Anemone]

I think all sides in this have made their points.

Kevin

 

[asch803]

update...

update...

as promised, this is an update on my 2 pairs of clowns: the hybrids (sebae/polymnus) found one of the two rose bubbles and are now happily calling it home...for the first 3 or 4 days, they were sleeping in the magnifica with the b/w ocellaris and then during the day hovering about the magnifica while the ocellaris were deeper "inside" of the anemone. For the past 2 days each of the pairs is in it's own anemone and both seem happy...I know this is VERY VERY short term, but i was starting to get concerned with all in the same anemone, at least now they each found their own...that's a step in the right direction anyway...will keep you posted and try to post a pic if i can figure that out...

Thanks!

Andy