NEW plumbing method for an ULTRA QUIET REEF TANK!!!! LONG !!!!

Yes I was thinking whole systems...
But, I am still curious about the loss calculations that you have made - because when I have looked up flow charts, all the loos calc are based on PRESSURED, not siphon scenarios.
So I am curious as to how we can make a common sense approach available to all whan discussing the differences/similaries of the plumbing approaches available.

I have a build thread for my latest system of my own :
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1762906

And please leave a comment!

Thanks,
T
 
If you look at Bean's Thread post 1644 you will see a list of how much a pipe will take given a set head pressure (I think this is feet - read a couple post I asked for clarification). This is ideal case scenario.

Yes the maximum flow is based on the pressure difference of input and output (and pipe size). The path it takes can make a big difference. Got any extra airline hose around. Cut off an inch and blow through it. Now do it with 50 feet - harder isn't it. Now straighten it and it should be easier. DISCALIMER: I have not tried this experiment.

I think the common sense rule is: keep all plumbing runs as straight as possible, and when a bend is required make it as broad as possible (hence the sanitary tees). How critical is this? Only such that at your pump's maximum output your drain can take it. Remember most of us are choking back the full flow with a gate (mine balanced without a gate which is why I know how much a few bends can hurt).
 
No arguement there!

The only question I have really is ...*IS* there a difference in head loss calc when we are PUSHING water ( or blowing thru an airline:)) vs PULLING or suction/siphon....? Make sense?

I posted that question on Bean's thread. Hope to get some input from others as well.

T
 
Hi guys, I'm getting ready to order a 90 gal tank with a center internal overflow. What would be the ideal hole size for the main drain, emergency drain, and return line?
 
I'm new to saltwater so i have no idea what would be a good return pump i have not got that far yet. What would you recommend? I was thinking it would be placed in the sump in it's own chamber with a refuge to grow pods for a mandarin and skimmer in there own chambers as well. The coral i'm thinking of adding are mostly lps with a few sps. Fish will be tang yellow or purple, mandarin, some type of sand cleaning goby, 2 clownfish, and a few others i have not decided on.
 
puggsli1 said:
I'm new to saltwater so i have no idea what would be a good return pump i have not got that far yet. What would you recommend? I was thinking it would be placed in the sump in it's own chamber with a refuge to grow pods for a mandarin and skimmer in there own chambers as well. The coral i'm thinking of adding are mostly lps with a few sps. Fish will be tang yellow or purple, mandarin, some type of sand cleaning goby, 2 clownfish, and a few others i have not decided on.
Click to expand...

Puggsli1,

You may get more/better responses to you questions if you start a thread in the equipment forum. There is more folks there that want to discuss pumps than you will find in this thread. Personally, I have a Pan World external pump and its my first real big pump, so I really can't give any advice on other types of pumps but I can tell you that you will want between 5-10 times your tank volume for flow through the sump. More flow in the tank can be achieved with closed loops systems or power heads. HTH

Chris
 
TheFishMan65 said:
What size return pump? or what flow rate? I would guess 1.5 for drains and 1 for return, but really don't know the specifics.
Click to expand...
I will be using a 900 gph return pump. So 1.5" for the drains and 1" for the return is that the bulk head size?? or is it the pipe size with reducer slip fitting to make it fit in a 1" bh and 3/4" bh?
Also how close should the gate valve be to the sump on the main drain line?
On to the gate valve the and plumbing. Should i use a 1.5" gate with 1.5" plumbing on the drain lines? and 1" with 3/4" slip reducer from return pump back to the tank.
 
I just picked up a 120G Tech tank and am looking at using this method of plumbing to quiet down the overflows. There are four holes drilled in the overflow (45mm each - for 1" bulkheads). I figure I'd probably be best served by using them all as drains and plumbing the return up and over the back. The other thought I had was to use three as drains and one as the return.

My return pump is going to be an Eheim 1260 (635GPH), so you can guestimate the kind of flow rate I'm going to be having based on that.

My question is how best to plumb and control the drains/returns that I have available.

Thanks!

EDIT: I may have just found the answer to my own question! How's this design look? --> http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=16229708&postcount=540
 
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Three as drains and one return would give you a clean look without requiring space for plumbing running behind the back of the tank.

The 1260 will be fine with one return, and honestly, having three drains could be complete overkill for that type of flow. I believe these tanks have a mix of 1" and 1.25" bulkheads. With four drains, there will likely be only one that is a full siphon while the others are dry unless the siphon is blocked.

Shaggss suggestion of the Beananimal overflow is quite good too - it could be lower maintenance/fiddling compared to the overflow in this thread.

It all boils down to personal preference/willingness to do all the plumbing. All your ideas sound reasonable.
 
Ok...I've read the entire thread. I've got most of my parts...including 2 gate valves. Looking at the photos, can anyone tell me the best place to put the gate valves? I have an AGA 120 and note the bypass valve to regulate flow through the fuge.

My original thinking was to put the valves under the tank. I'm running into issues with this. The valves are too big to just stick them in line. I wanted to keep the barbed fitting coming out of the wall for the main drain since it make it easier to get the valves off if needed.

I'm stumped. I just spent over 2 hours at lowe's trying to figure out a way to connect the valves under the tank without having to snake piping all over the place. All that space under there and space is still limited. I also need to leave room for the return lines that need to sweep up to the back of the tank.

So can these valves be placed on the sump/fuge side (other room)? Tank and sump/fuge are on the same level. The hole in the wall under the tank is where my emergency drain will break through. I have all the parts for that and it's pretty much a no brainer at this point.

I was reading about the recommended valve placement for the 120 dual overflow and I can't get the explaination to make sense. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.


4630420694_6b3ba5f6c9_o.jpg

4629819317_bab93b828d_o.jpg
 
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Ok jeff....First off.... for dual overflows, it is necessary to tie the two overflows together. It is way to hard to balance both overflows individually.

So... you said in your PM the two overflow lines are 1.25". So you need to plumb the two overflow lines into a tee. The tee needs to be the two 1.25 inlets, with one 1.5" outlet. 1.5" out will flow plenty of water for both overflows. Then you put your 1.5" gate valve in for adjustment. One valve, both overflows will flow the same.

There is no problems putting the valves at the sump. I have the same set up as you and mine are in the equipment room.

The line going to the fuge... needs to be before the 1.5" gate valve. Looking at your plumbing I'm not sure you would have the same problem as I did, but placing the fuge after the gate valve cause my sump to siphon out my fuge. Seeing you have different water levels as I do I would expect the same problem.

So.... the line you have in the rear...take out the ball valve you have... and place it after the tee you have going to the fuge. Just put it right at the end to the fuge to control flow.

Now you will have a clear line from both overflows. I really think that it wound be best to turn the line in the front going to your sump with an elbow. Not totally sure, but you don't want one overflow having a straight shot and the other having a twisty path.... man I really don't know.... both overflows will have the same head, and you are taking water off the other so it might be fine. However... you do need a tee with two 1.25" on the top of the "T" exiting to a larger 1.5" exit to accomodate the two flows. So that might force the issue of just how you have to join it. Then just dump the 1.5" to the sump. Easy peazy.
 
I've drawn both scenarios out on paper....my existing setup vs. what you are describing. It almost looks like all i need to do is use one gate valve on the sump (not fuge) outlet and just leave the plumbing the way it is. The ball valve already in place will limit (control) the amount of water that dumps to the sump while the system is running. Yes...when I shut it down a siphon will start from the fuge. But if I make sure the outlet pipe is just under the surface of the water, the siphon will break as the fuge empties into the sump.

The siphoning that you are talking about...did it happen when the system was running or when you shut it down?

Thinking about this is driving me nuts. This wouldn't be so bad to experiment with if it was a new setup. But I'm trying to make this conversion with a mature tank.

4634048712_255da764a9_o.jpg
 
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Ya, you got it. And take that existing ball valve out, and put it on the line that takes off to the fuge. I can call you too. Just doing something now.
 
PowermanKW said:
Ok jeff....First off.... for dual overflows, it is necessary to tie the two overflows together. It is way to hard to balance both overflows individually.

So... you said in your PM the two overflow lines are 1.25". So you need to plumb the two overflow lines into a tee. The tee needs to be the two 1.25 inlets, with one 1.5" outlet. 1.5" out will flow plenty of water for both overflows. Then you put your 1.5" gate valve in for adjustment. One valve, both overflows will flow the same.
Click to expand...

+1. I tied my duel 1" pvc overflow into a 1 1/2" pvc pipe into a 1 1/2" T and into a 1 1/2" gate valve on my 180. I'm happy with it. :)
 
Ok...it makes sense now. I didn't quite get why we want to move the bypass vlv. I talked this over with some guys at work and now I get it. I won't actually move it, I'll just open it up. I'm going to just stick a new vlv in for the fuge. The only other thing that I was wondering about was starting this thing up for the first time. How hard is it to get the overflow levels dialed in while you are trying to get the desired flow through the fuge? What's a good starting point?

Powerman...when you had the siphoning, was it when you shut the pump off, or when it was running? Just curious.
 
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