OT: Solar Electric homes anyone?

[boviac]

I'm seriously jones'n for solar panels right now. However, I still rent. Does anyone have any on their home and have an comments? Does anyone want them on their home? Anyone have any interesting comments concerning solar? I'm really interested to see if anyone has tracking data to determine performance or knows of any internet links.

I would love to find out more and play around with it if only to help the costs my aquarium uses in electricity; or mywhole house; or better yet, spin my meter backwards!!!!

Clearly with heat like this and seeing our Meter's spin forward like crazy, these thoughts have to be going through your mind.

Think about even being Off-Grid running on solar/wind and batteries. Quite an industrius task considering a nominal tank load in addition to house loads. But no worries about generation or transmission outages. Ahh but it is enticing. So much sun and such high energy bills, what's there to lose?

 

[Nu2SW]

This guy does it
http://media.www.duclarion.com/medi...larion.com&MIIHost=media.collegepublisher.com
"same as the other post, but easier for you to click here"

 

[boviac]

Yeah. I've seen several do it (spin backwards -YEAH!) but again unless you have a pretty decent sized array in with an AC load in these conditions.... That article was from last October, again another milder month and in the Denver area. Still it is a pretty awesome concept to know that the pretty penny you spend for energy could be going into your own investment instead of a bottomless pit that will undoubtedly grow as time does. This to me is the only way to eventually have a well balanced energy bill. Because in time PG&E will most likely keep pace with the likes of SOCAL Edison and raise rates.

 

[BONDQ]

I'm 100% with you.
I want solar really bad. I'm tired of being told by my power bill to conserve. I don't want to conserve, I want to use a ton of power and have fun doing it!

So, I guess that means I need to start generating some.

They are a pricey initial investment, but depending on how much power you use, it could work out quickly to your advantage.

Units for about a 2,000 sq.ft. house with battery backups start at about $40K. You also need to calculate your rebates (State & Federal).

Your meter can spin backwards if you generate more than you use, but you can only use that as credit towards power you need back, at least in the SDG&E area.

Think of it like Store Credit in a store. I send some power back to the power company, let's say $50 worth. Then, they give me $50 store credit on my bill towards power that I need back (like at night, or when the batteries are low).

Power bills for generating houses are settled every 12 months. I'm told that generated credit is "use it or loose it".

You don't get sent a check or anything like that. So, don't assume you can retire on your solar panels. That would be nice, though.

 

[boviac]

Yeah, I knew some people who had credit that very way with PG&E when they went bankrupt in 2001. He went to customer service and asked if he could cash in credit... I think he said they laughed. Yes the net metering thing is exactly like store credit.

BONDQ - thats quite an occupation - Director of Water and Power - and you don't have a special hook-up? JK. I agree.

I am curious enough to install it myself. Now I just need to convince a family or friend to let me put it up for them. I'm familiar with permit process and electrical inspections - but this would be the first time for something like this for me.

 

[boviac]

How about with the heat. I hear the Standard efficiency is tested out at 25 Celcius and today its almost 40C!!! That doesn't include what temp a black colored panel would be on my roof : 150F+ (Sorry to switch units - of the top of my head I'm not sure what that is.) I've seen some specs that show panels efficency go down to about 85-90% when the get that hot.

Anyone got anything on this?

Anybody tried some for of panel cooling that is RELIABLE after thermal cycling, UV exposure, potential phase changes (Liquid - solid)???

 

[Sparkss]

Jimsar in our BAR club uses solar panels on his house (they are in his avatar also ).

We have also been considering Solar, but it is jsut hard to put that first $40k foot forward......

I also read on one thread (on a board about solar houses) where if the grid went down, so did your house, even if you had power coming from the panels. Something to do with synchronizing with the grid... but maybe it was just the way he had it set up ?

 

[Sparkss]

P.S. These days this isn't really so much Off Topic, not in our area

 

[Fragmented]

Lots of folks up in my area have solar & many are off the grid. The problem up here is the trees. We get too much shade to make it work out $$ wise. However with the rising costs, it may be worth it soon.

Even if you have solar conserving is a good thing.

 

[1SickReefer]

So for 40k solar can produce enough power to run my entire house air conditioning and all?

Just curious I know nothing about solar energy

 

[BONDQ]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7807130#post7807130 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by 1SickReefer
So for 40k solar can produce enough power to run my entire house air conditioning and all?

Just curious I know nothing about solar energy

It's entirely dependent on your individual usage.

You need to look at your power bill and determine how much you use. Some folks curb costs by just generating a portion of their usage and then adding to the system later on.

You also need to decide if you want battery back-up or not.
Not everyone needs or wants to spend the extra money for this.

 

[goslugsgo]

Jimsar has commented on it in the past (Nov-Dec?). You may want to search his posts for the info, links and what-not.

 

[Izsabelle]

There are zero energy homes in the Rosemont area. The homes are about 2000 sq ft, and the owners have their a/c running all day and only pay $20 per month!

Most of these homes were bought a few years ago for in the low 400s. I think they are currently selling in the upper 400s to low 500s, but there aren't many on the market. The last time I looked there was 1 home available. I believe the owners are sitting cool in their homes and have no desire to sell.

I would love to buy a zero energy home and hopefully, there will be more available in Sac soon.

 

[Justin74]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7809921#post7809921 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Izsabelle
There are zero energy homes in the Rosemont area. The homes are about 2000 sq ft, and the owners have their a/c running all day and only pay $20 per month!

That would be such a Godsend.... BTW, I too have had this thought running for awhile but like you too boviac, I rent.And Im definately not hooking thislandlord with any freebies. When Im able to, I will definately invest in one.Even if I dont break even for the next 30 years, just knowing that SMUD wasnt getting any more of my money would make me ecstatic.

-Justin

 

[Nu2SW]

Atleast Smud rates are alot lower than PG&E rates

 

[boviac]

Sparkss - Yeah with the average SPS hobbiest using MH upwards of 400W per bulb for lighting only not including all the powerheads, pumps, chillers/heaters, etc... Energy options and discussions clearly could be on-topic.

40K is a lot considering the rebates out there. You must be including the fact that installation of the system costs about $1.40 a Watt. That amount by my math would by you an on grid system thats about nearly 6KW!!! Thats a lot! Most likely and of course dependant on your specific usage, you'd be selling (or should I say banking) energy back.

Grid-Tie systems are designed to shut down if grid power goes out to prevent a lineman repairing the system from getting electrocuted from your system. So that is one of the disavantages of being grid-tied. However with the net metering (reverse meter spin buy back) option and the infrequency of power outages here, far outweigh going completely off-grid initially in my opinion. Like someone said earlier - you could always upgrade or go off-grid later by adding batteries. This is not to say you couldn't have batteries grid-tied but simply not necessary.

SMUD rates clearly aren't bad after looking at PG&E or SoCal Edison.

I'll search when the search option is available (like never)... still considering the paid member option especially now I'm here so much more.

Yeah, new homes built with Panels on pretty much come well insulated with quality energy star appliances, great windows, and brand new clean and sealed ducts. It would be nice to have an average $240 annual utility bill - especially when I fear this month alone for me will be that much.

Yes conservation is the biggest savings we could all benifit from. Most utlities have lots of information on their websites about conservation and conversions/rebates to energy star appliances and flourescent lights.

There are some great sites simply google solar panels and you'll find some sites that have information. Just filter the electric panels from the heat generating kind like for water or air. A great concept just not really needed in the valley too much.

 

[boviac]

Interesting enough Panel costs are on the rise due to overwhelming europe demand. Since they are actually adhearing to the Kyoto Agreement, governments are largely subsidizing alternetive energies that will eliminate CO2 production.

California still has some fat rebates, plus a decent federal tax credit and there's something about SB1 state bill that would provide a 7.5% state tax rebate if it passes and I understand it correctly.

I've heard that it is important to order from someone who has the panels in stock or can get them quickly. In order to get the rebate you must apply and reserve your rebate. Then you have to have the system installed, inspected, and turned on in order to receive the rebate. If your panels are back ordered and priority is going overseas you may loose out on your 30% rebate.

I've seen local panels create a decent amount. And they were fixed. I wonder if I could set up a tracking grid pole mounted, how much additional energy that would create. So say putting a fixed 2KW system on your roof or maybe only 1.25KW on a pole that tracks may be equivalent. Not sure - still doing research.

I've heard of this one tracking device that uses the sun's heat to change fluid/vapor states within a lenghtwise chamber to position the mounting grid to follow the sun. Novel idea - curious to see how it holds up to temperatures like this and time.

Chris

 

[xia]

I got this graph from
http://www.solardepot.com/r_grid-tied.htm

It shows how much you'd be saving by just making payments on that 40k loan instead of to your power company. Pretty convincing I think. Especially since my bill is on average over $200.

 

[boviac]

There are so many advantages: initial state rebates, federal tax credits, ongoing tax discounts, paying less to your utility, paying more to something you will eventually own, and avoiding the threat of rising energy costs. Oh yeah then theres the overall increase in your home's value. If anyone has shade free optimal roof placement I can't see why anyone wouldn't do it right now.

My landlords own the empty lot behind and I'm seriously thinking about puting a tracking grid on a post there but then again having to move with reef tanks is already a daunting task.

Xia I think if I recall you have room on your roof both South and west.
Check out http://www.partsonsale.com/main.htm

As for installing they appear to recommend the minimum licensed installers but they do have a lot of information as to how much you can save. If anyone is going this route, please let me know.

 

[boviac]

Xia further that plot you posted makes many assumptions. It all depends on 1) your actual electrical usage (you said around $200/mo)) 2) how much you are willing to spend 3) how much room you have on your roof to place panels 4) what relative placement on roof to the suns path 5) how much you want to reduce your electric bill.

This is the thing that motivates me most.