Aquarist007
New member
I agree it works best in a reactor
PO4 high, not coming down, need advice.
- Thread starter SS_Sean
- Start date
What is the evidence that GFO works best in a reactor? The theory I know but I am always interested in seeing the data. Thanks!
Sleepingtiger
Member
so i am having phosphate troubles as well. this LaCl, can i just drip it into the skimmer and let the skimmer skim out the precipitate?
jay13
New member
"Might want to try that reactor and that rowaphos... much more gomer-proof. And the stuff is super aggressive. About $50 for 1000G worth."
nah, no rowaphos reactor for me. it was an oversight on my part and i paid the price. luckily no harm no foul. makes me feel even better about this stuff though. it was mega dosed in the tank with no negative outcome.
no, it has to be slow dripped in and mechanically filtered out when it precipitates the phosphate out of solution. skimmer won't remove it all or maybe even none at all. get the micron sock and do it that way.
nah, no rowaphos reactor for me. it was an oversight on my part and i paid the price. luckily no harm no foul. makes me feel even better about this stuff though. it was mega dosed in the tank with no negative outcome.
no, it has to be slow dripped in and mechanically filtered out when it precipitates the phosphate out of solution. skimmer won't remove it all or maybe even none at all. get the micron sock and do it that way.
Randy did the analysis and posted in his phosphate removal articles.
I bet you, that if you put in one half bottle of rowa, that sheet would already be gone. Plenty of posts to support that. You have the reactor anyway right? Simple stuff.
I think it is probably true that you more effectively use GFO in a reactor than a mesh bag or a canister, but I didn't ever actually measure that.
One concern with a reactor is grinding of the GFO into dust that is released.
FWIW, I use it in a canister mixed with GAC, since I had a canister handy.
One concern with a reactor is grinding of the GFO into dust that is released.
FWIW, I use it in a canister mixed with GAC, since I had a canister handy.
SS_Sean
New member
One thing I'm currently getting ready to try and improve is my flow. I had two small Tunze powerheads on this 170g tank. According to a trusted reefer friend I have very poor flow. I'm going to install a Vertex Mocean 2000 in the next couple weeks and see if I can improve the flow, get the detritus suspended in the water column better, so the skimmer will remove it. That should help a little. I'm not wondering, as previously mentioned, if it's been an over-feeding/left-over food issue. Will continue to post results as I go along.
Aquarist007
New member
I think it is probably true that you more effectively use GFO in a reactor than a mesh bag or a canister, but I didn't ever actually measure that.
One concern with a reactor is grinding of the GFO into dust that is released.
FWIW, I use it in a canister mixed with GAC, since I had a canister handy.
This should be proof enough for you Dan_P
It's anecdotal but the source is impeccable.
SS_Sean
New member
This is my sixth week of working 72 hours + per week... next week will be my seventh... I haven't been able to do anything but work, work, and sleep.
I'll get back at this very soon... Hopefully Tuesday I'll be re-doing the plumbing under the tank, adding a Vertex Mocean 2000, and get some better flow in there to help suspend the detritus and let the skimmer transport it out of the system.
I'll get back at this very soon... Hopefully Tuesday I'll be re-doing the plumbing under the tank, adding a Vertex Mocean 2000, and get some better flow in there to help suspend the detritus and let the skimmer transport it out of the system.
jay13
New member
I hear ya on the sleep part.
I think it is probably true that you more effectively use GFO in a reactor than a mesh bag or a canister, but I didn't ever actually measure that.
One concern with a reactor is grinding of the GFO into dust that is released.
FWIW, I use it in a canister mixed with GAC, since I had a canister handy.
The Rowaphos states on the label that even if you gomer completely and do not rinse it (in a fluidized) application, it will not hurt anything. I would not imagine any dust would hurt anything. In fact, the rowa is already pretty much like dust, like a very fine coffee grind.
The Rowa does not release backward as well when saturated.
The instructions say you do not have to rinse it, but that for a media bag application. For a fluidized app, I think you would be making a mistake not to rinse it.
The key is LOW flow, just enough to make it look like it is lava boiling. You need a small pump with a flow valve to make it work right.
I know I sound like a Rowa commercial, but I am telling you, this stuff is really good and easy. The way it is ground, you need very low flow to keep it moving.
I am using the nextreef. I really like this reactor bacause:
1) It is external, and when you see a clump, a simple shake clears it.
2) The multi sponge setup keeps most if not all dust contained.
3) Easy peasy to change, turn off the pump, make sure the return breaks siphon, it self-siphons down to sump height, pop top, no water mess. Simple stupid... which is good for me
With the way you are working the hours, this would be a good fire and forget option for you.
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iamarchitecture
Member
I also battled with phosphate issues and researched a lot on remedies.
I ultimately went with a BRS reactor and paired it up with Fauna Marin Ultra Phos 0,04 Phosphate Remover. It is a very aggressive GFO and i don't think i would use anything other than that.
I struggled to lower my phosphate level from 0.40 ppm for several weeks. After adding the Fauna Marin GFO i checked my levels with the Hannah Tester and it came back at .06. A couple of weeks later my levels came back at 0.00 (which actually is around 0.04) which is where you want to be.
Hope this helps
I ultimately went with a BRS reactor and paired it up with Fauna Marin Ultra Phos 0,04 Phosphate Remover. It is a very aggressive GFO and i don't think i would use anything other than that.
I struggled to lower my phosphate level from 0.40 ppm for several weeks. After adding the Fauna Marin GFO i checked my levels with the Hannah Tester and it came back at .06. A couple of weeks later my levels came back at 0.00 (which actually is around 0.04) which is where you want to be.
Hope this helps
The idea that phosphate does not come of Rowaphos is not true. There is nothing special about it in that regard compared to any other brand of GFO.
I've demonstrated for myself that it, and presumably all forms of solid phosphate binders, bind more and more phosphate as the phosphate concentration rises. No surprise there. That is the way such surface binding must work.
But by the same token, they all release phosphate if the phosphate concentration drops below what it was when the phosphate bound it and came to equilibrium.
I have demonstrated this myself with Rowaphos, as can anyone wishing to spend the time to do so.
Aquarist007
New member
The idea that phosphate does not come of Rowaphos is not true. There is nothing special about it in that regard compared to any other brand of GFO.
I've demonstrated for myself that it, and presumably all forms of solid phosphate binders, bind more and more phosphate as the phosphate concentration rises. No surprise there. That is the way such surface binding must work.
But by the same token, they all release phosphate if the phosphate concentration drops below what it was when the phosphate bound it and came to equilibrium.
I have demonstrated this myself with Rowaphos, as can anyone wishing to spend the time to do so.
Randy, what implications does this have for maintenance? Should you be removing it when you have untraceable phosphates?
Does this explain why you can get an outbreak of bryopsis after your phosphates are untraceable?
Aquarist007
New member
I guess I am having a hard time understanding this concept
"But by the same token, they all release phosphate if the phosphate concentration drops below what it was when the phosphate bound it and came to equilibrium."
"But by the same token, they all release phosphate if the phosphate concentration drops below what it was when the phosphate bound it and came to equilibrium."
Think of it this way: after it has been in a certain level of phosphate for a while (that is, at equilibrium or close to it), there is a certain amount of phosphate bound.
Phosphate is coming on and off all the time. The more phosphate in solution, the more is going onto the surface of the GFO. The more on the surface already, the more is coming off all the time. A balance is reached between these two processes, resulting in an equilibrium amount bound. Do not think of it as a one way process onto the surface.
So if you take GFO that has been in a tank at 0.1 ppm for a reasonable period of time, and put it into a tank with 0.01 ppm phosphate, phosphate will tend to come off the GFO. That is essentially the experiment I did.
As to bryopsis, I just think it is very good at surviving at low phosphate, however that is attained, and possibly iron from GFO might help some types of algae to not become iron limited.
Aquarist007
New member
Thanks I understand now.
So if we are to carry this concept to practical measures. If we continue to leave some Gfo in a system that had high phosphates prior to using the media then will it eventually be released from the media back into the system
So if we are to carry this concept to practical measures. If we continue to leave some Gfo in a system that had high phosphates prior to using the media then will it eventually be released from the media back into the system
