Problems with LiveAquaria livestock
- Thread starter SlowCobra
- Start date
Sullyman
Premium Member
a fish didn't make it, I got a refund, no questions asked, no bodies required. 14 days is a long time to warranty a fish with so many things that could be bad at the customers end.
Not saying you guys had issues that led to the deaths, just that you won't find a store online or local that has a better policy.
If I'm looking for a more common fish, I buy local always. If I have to wait to have it ordered, I do.
If I see something that is rare/new to me at DD, I sometimes buy from the Docs, without any worries.
Sorry to hear of your troubles.
Not saying you guys had issues that led to the deaths, just that you won't find a store online or local that has a better policy.
If I'm looking for a more common fish, I buy local always. If I have to wait to have it ordered, I do.
If I see something that is rare/new to me at DD, I sometimes buy from the Docs, without any worries.
Sorry to hear of your troubles.
SlowCobra
New member
I am not necessarily blaming the livestock quality at the wholesaler. I think the problem lies within not properly packing for the cold weather. They make an attempt to package well however all of the bags arrived cold. While I did not check the actual temperature of the bags just based on touch alone they were much much colder than the range my tank goes through in a day, 76-79.
All fish were temperature acclimated then drip acclimated in my case.
As for buying to many fish... As I posted above the fish went in different tanks. Also when buying schooling fish I highly doubt you add 2 at a time. When you buy a schooling fish you buy them to have a school not 1 here 1 there.
It wasn't 12 medium tangs added at once.
Bebo there was a reason this was posted in the LOCAL forum, I believe the issue with most of the livestock death is shipping and improper packaging for the cold weather.
If you want to argue with me that's wonderful. Have at it. Don't be surprised if I just ignore you. Having a large post count obviously makes you the RC expert. In my eyes your large post count simply equates to having far too much time on your hands. A large post count does not mean you are a god of whatever forum you belong to.
You would have fared better had you not immediately jumped to the conclusion that it was an acclimation or water quality issue when 3 different people unrelated to each other were having issues. Reading comprehension is your friend.
All fish were temperature acclimated then drip acclimated in my case.
As for buying to many fish... As I posted above the fish went in different tanks. Also when buying schooling fish I highly doubt you add 2 at a time. When you buy a schooling fish you buy them to have a school not 1 here 1 there.
It wasn't 12 medium tangs added at once.
Bebo there was a reason this was posted in the LOCAL forum, I believe the issue with most of the livestock death is shipping and improper packaging for the cold weather.
If you want to argue with me that's wonderful. Have at it. Don't be surprised if I just ignore you. Having a large post count obviously makes you the RC expert. In my eyes your large post count simply equates to having far too much time on your hands. A large post count does not mean you are a god of whatever forum you belong to.
You would have fared better had you not immediately jumped to the conclusion that it was an acclimation or water quality issue when 3 different people unrelated to each other were having issues. Reading comprehension is your friend.
glassbox-design
New member
Re-assuring to hear. We've ordered from DD before, but not Cali. We hope these ship out well.
The 14 day guarantee is especially nice for the higher priced fish. Where else can you buy a Conspic or Clarion with that?
Pufferpunk
New member
So what kind of diseae did Pescadero find?
taylor t
New member
I've had problems the past few times I've ordered also. I've ordered several times throughout the winter. The coldest I've read my bags at is 51 degrees. Most of the time stuff pulls through, I don't know how, but I've called as late as a week later. IMO, a 2 week guarentee is too much. How do they know what we keep in our tanks? I keep a couple leathers, xenia is constantly cut, releasing junk into the water column. Some of this stuff may be chemically sensitive.
The last time, I got a bag of dead (cloudy bag of) snails (25 turbos) and put them in my system anyway. What a mistake! They credited me them, no questions.
I also lost a blue carpet after about 5 days. It expanded to over 12 inches, then shrunk, and expelled it's guts and melted. It's not my system, as I have many fish, an existing healthy carpet (still doing well looks great), and a sebae (also doing great), all doing very well. It's hit or miss, but overall, DFS stands by their stuff with me, I'll continue to try them. I don't call on every item, just the ones that are a "come on, you gotta be kiddin' me-who packed these?!". It's not perfect.
I do think there's something going on with quality control in their California location also. DD is usually better.
The last time, I got a bag of dead (cloudy bag of) snails (25 turbos) and put them in my system anyway. What a mistake! They credited me them, no questions.
I also lost a blue carpet after about 5 days. It expanded to over 12 inches, then shrunk, and expelled it's guts and melted. It's not my system, as I have many fish, an existing healthy carpet (still doing well looks great), and a sebae (also doing great), all doing very well. It's hit or miss, but overall, DFS stands by their stuff with me, I'll continue to try them. I don't call on every item, just the ones that are a "come on, you gotta be kiddin' me-who packed these?!". It's not perfect.
I do think there's something going on with quality control in their California location also. DD is usually better.
BreadmanMike
New member
Psam...
How is that solid purple soli doing?
How is that solid purple soli doing?
... 
pescadero
In Memoriam
I'm going to hold off on making comments for now, as I still haven't been reimbursed for all of my losses. Suffice it to say that 50% of the fish arrived dead in the bags, and the remaining 50% died in short order. Autopies were preformed on the bodies by someone with doctorate level training in microbiology and pathology, and the findings were discussed with the curator of a public aquarium in the Midwest who also writes books on reefkeeping.
It appears that I received a diseased shipment. We'll see how LA decides to handle the situation. Two days ago I was told that they were going to credit my visa for all of the fish that died. I checked my account online today and no refund has yet been issued.
It appears that I received a diseased shipment. We'll see how LA decides to handle the situation. Two days ago I was told that they were going to credit my visa for all of the fish that died. I checked my account online today and no refund has yet been issued.
SlowCobra
New member
It should be noted this thread was not intended to be a "Bash LA/DFS" thread. Honestly that was not the intention of it. Sure I ranted a little but this thread is about finding out if it is a general area wide issue or if it was only a couple select instances. So far it seems as if there have been more than a few of us that have had issues due to what appears to be improper packaging for the most part.
Orders arriving with temperatures as low as 51 is completely unacceptable. As I mentioned I did not take the actual temperature of the livestock upon arrival but when you grab a bag for inspection and the first thought that pops into your head is "damn that feels awfully cold" there is a problem.
DFS/LA relies on feedback to help correct issues. I am sure someone will eventually link this thread and hopefully they look into the packaging issues. They appear to be the biggest issue, in my opinion, with the loss of so much livestock.
While the guarantee is great, I can honestly say I loathe having to contact them in regard to it. That reason is two fold. 1) I am what could be called a pain in the *** customer. I have contacted them a bunch of times for credits due to shipping issues with coral colonies. 2) If I am contacting them about fish, the most obvious reason is they are dead. As with most of the rest reading this, dead fish are something none of us want to have.
Orders arriving with temperatures as low as 51 is completely unacceptable. As I mentioned I did not take the actual temperature of the livestock upon arrival but when you grab a bag for inspection and the first thought that pops into your head is "damn that feels awfully cold" there is a problem.
DFS/LA relies on feedback to help correct issues. I am sure someone will eventually link this thread and hopefully they look into the packaging issues. They appear to be the biggest issue, in my opinion, with the loss of so much livestock.
While the guarantee is great, I can honestly say I loathe having to contact them in regard to it. That reason is two fold. 1) I am what could be called a pain in the *** customer. I have contacted them a bunch of times for credits due to shipping issues with coral colonies. 2) If I am contacting them about fish, the most obvious reason is they are dead. As with most of the rest reading this, dead fish are something none of us want to have.
pescadero
In Memoriam
I just got off of the phone with them. While discussing this sort of problem isn't something that I would call pleasant, they do try to make the process as pleasant as it can be under the circumstances. I have to give them credit for that.
WRT not reporting losses -- I have to admit, I've done that too. A few lost snails isn't something to get excited about when you're looking at a loss of so many fish. When you lose snails its not like you've lost a tang. I've intentionally under reported my losses just so they wouldn't think I'm trying to scam them.
OTOH, I think it is really important to contact to let them know when you do have expired livestock. If we don't call them, then they don't know that there is a problem. When I talked to one of their reps a few days ago, she told me that they have a 4% overall death rate. I was really surprised by that claim of 96% survival at 14-days. If those numbers were accurate, then they're not accurate any more -- those of us who have been posting in this thread have had enough losses to ruin their statistics.
WRT not reporting losses -- I have to admit, I've done that too. A few lost snails isn't something to get excited about when you're looking at a loss of so many fish. When you lose snails its not like you've lost a tang. I've intentionally under reported my losses just so they wouldn't think I'm trying to scam them.
OTOH, I think it is really important to contact to let them know when you do have expired livestock. If we don't call them, then they don't know that there is a problem. When I talked to one of their reps a few days ago, she told me that they have a 4% overall death rate. I was really surprised by that claim of 96% survival at 14-days. If those numbers were accurate, then they're not accurate any more -- those of us who have been posting in this thread have had enough losses to ruin their statistics.
taylor t
New member
This is my last opinion/experience.
Even though I've lost quite a few things, just as others have, DFS has real people on the other end of the phone to straighten things out. Even if it's not always to my advantage. They try, and that's more that I can say for every LFS around my house. I will still try them, but like everything in this hobby, there's a bit of learning. I've learned, really this past year, I can't order if it's too cold out. I should have learned last summer. ...ugh.
When they give up on me, that's when I'll give up on them.
I almost gave up on them on my last shipment, it was 3 strikes in a row, but I emailed them, not asking for anything in return, just venting with my anger. (IMO, 25 turbos in a little bag was way too many, among other things). And they actually called me, and wanted to TRY to make me happy. Most would have read and deleted, which I wrote them I expected them to do. That experience to me is worth another try, no doubt. I'll just be more aware of the temps in the days I order. I just have to remember, I keep asking them to ship me delicate life in a box, asking someone who could care less to bring it to me. I've opened my boxes before, and the whole bottom of the styrafoam box was already broken, like it had been dropped, but how do you prove that? Maybe the Fed Ex guy likes to practice soccer with our boxes.
Even though I've lost quite a few things, just as others have, DFS has real people on the other end of the phone to straighten things out. Even if it's not always to my advantage. They try, and that's more that I can say for every LFS around my house. I will still try them, but like everything in this hobby, there's a bit of learning. I've learned, really this past year, I can't order if it's too cold out. I should have learned last summer. ...ugh.
When they give up on me, that's when I'll give up on them.
I almost gave up on them on my last shipment, it was 3 strikes in a row, but I emailed them, not asking for anything in return, just venting with my anger. (IMO, 25 turbos in a little bag was way too many, among other things). And they actually called me, and wanted to TRY to make me happy. Most would have read and deleted, which I wrote them I expected them to do. That experience to me is worth another try, no doubt. I'll just be more aware of the temps in the days I order. I just have to remember, I keep asking them to ship me delicate life in a box, asking someone who could care less to bring it to me. I've opened my boxes before, and the whole bottom of the styrafoam box was already broken, like it had been dropped, but how do you prove that? Maybe the Fed Ex guy likes to practice soccer with our boxes.
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