Quarantine deaths

[Royalturtle]

So, I had my first fish losses today . I have a 10g qt (small, I know) set up with cf lights, an internal filter, a heater, and some rocks for hiding. I have quarantined 5 fish (2 ocellaris clowns, a firefish, a bangaii cardinal, and a yellow watchman goby - 1 or 2 at a time) in this tank with no problems. I cycled the sponge for the filter in my dt for about four weeks, during the initial dt cycle 4 months ago. 13 days ago I purchased a small Royal Gramma and a small (~2") Kole tang from live aquaria and began quarantining them. I changed the water (90%) first. All seemed normal last night, they would both hide when first approached but otherwise were swimming around and eating well. I was feeding strips of nori on a veggie clip, as well as spirulina flakes, New Life Spectrum marine formula pellets, and frozen mysis shrimp on occasion - not all at once, I was cycling through to give variety and try not to over feed. I tested the ammonia last night, got a reading of 0, SG 1.023, temp 77F. This morning I went in to feed and both fish were dead. No signs of trauma, temp is stable. The tang has a couple of light colored patches on his tail, not sure if that is a post-morten change - I didn't notice it yesterday. I tested nitrates today (should have done it yesterday, I know) trying to find a cause for the deaths, and they were between 10-20 ppm. This is definitely much higher than I ever get in my dt, but is this high enough to kill the fish? Any other ideas? I just hate that they died, and if it was a potential husbandry issue I would like to avoid making the same mistake in the future. Thank you for your help!

 

[Rideblue101]

By no means am I a master, but in a 10g QT 90% change is big. I run the same setup but 50% is max for me. And I use the water from my display never make new water for my QT. Suggestion if you made new water start slowly replacing it with DT water to replenish with cycled water you need all the bacteria you can get in a 10 gallon and no sand bed. Get your water right before your medication. You may have stressed the system with to many fish at once. You need a larger tank to take the load of multi fish QT. Good luck.

 

[ca1ore]

Nitrates aren't going to kill the fish. I assume you changed 90% of the water prior to adding these two new fish, so that's unlikely to be the problem. That they died at the same time arouses suspicions, but it also could have been coincidence.

 

[Betta132]

The big water change wasn't the best idea, however... I think something may have gotten into the water that shouldn't. My suspicion would be something toxic got in there.

 

[Royalturtle]

The water change was before adding the fish to the tank - I didn't want to add them into water that had just been used to quarantine the previous fish - could this really have caused a problem? This is how i have quarantined the other fish, and these two were fine for 12 days until they weren't. I tested ammonia, nitrates, pH, SG on the new water before adding the fish. Once the fish are in I only do a 20% change at a time. I did make new water, I could add water from the dt next time if that will help, I'm just not sure if it will as the fish did well for so long and the ammonia never increased - it was 0 when they died - I could certainly be wrong, feel free to correct me, but I would have thought that ammonia of 0 would mean that the bacteria in the filter sponge were handling the load well. I don't know how something toxic could have gotten into the water, but I hadn't thought of that possibility so I will try to think through my routine last night and see if I can come up with any possibilities. Thanks again for the ideas.

 

[MrTuskfish]

By no means am I a master, but in a 10g QT 90% change is big. I run the same setup but 50% is max for me. And I use the water from my display never make new water for my QT. Suggestion if you made new water start slowly replacing it with DT water to replenish with cycled water you need all the bacteria you can get in a 10 gallon and no sand bed. Get your water right before your medication. You may have stressed the system with to many fish at once. You need a larger tank to take the load of multi fish QT. Good luck.

There is no such thing as "cycled water". The friendly bacteria live in the filter media, LR, substrate, etc. Not in the water column. I remember telling this to someone who just got done moving 300gals of "cycled water" for 300 miles. He did save a few bucks on salt, which were spent on gas.

 

[snorvich]

There is no such thing as "cycled water". The friendly bacteria live in the filter media, LR, substrate, etc. Not in the water column. I remember telling this to someone who just got done moving 300gals of "cycled water" for 300 miles. He did save a few bucks on salt, which were spent on gas.

And treatment for his back. At a little over 8 lbs per gallon on salt water . . .

 

[MikeinCt001]

It might not be "cycled" but it is "aged", and is supposed to be easier on the livestock vs freshly made saltwater.

 

[aquaph8]

And treatment for his back. At a little over 8 lbs per gallon on salt water . . .

But he didn't have to go to the gym.

 

[Ralph ATL]

for future reference, I always get a container of Seachem Matrix (the rock) which is an awesome nitrifying media. I also add Seachem prime daily for the 1st 7 days, only adding what I have removed in water changes to keep the same level & I add a little stability trice a week for 2 weeks...even if I have set this up 2 weeks in advance. I use the Matrix as 1/2 substrate and sugar fine sand in the other half (only for the delicate wrasses of course). I usually do 10% water change in morning and 20% at night in a heavily fed (6-14 times a day) tank.

if the water ever gets cloudy, I drop a mesh bag with 1 cup of Rox carbon for 24 hours, then re add medication at 50%....

 

[drej424]

It's strange to lose them suddenly like that after 13 days in QT, with no signs of illness or injury. Were those the only fish in the tank at the time? Just to be cautious, I would take that tank down and bleach everything, including the sponge filter. Then start over to cycle before putting more fish in. From what you've said, it sounds like you are practicing good husbandry. If you continue to use these methods, I doubt you'll have a lot of losses in this hobby.

 

[Betta132]

I'll second the above.
You're doing a very good job with pretty much everything I can see. I'm thinking you had some kind of weird contamination issue...

 

[Macimage]

Coul it have been oxygen deprivation? Maybe the internal filter didn't move the surface water enough for good oxygen exchange. The tang (although small) may have needed/used more oxygen.