Question about Ich and 2 old clownfish

[MatAndPatti]

About 8 or 9 years ago we added 2 clown fish to our 8 gallon nano. Those were the days before we "knew better" about quarantining our fish...

Fast forward to today... We now have a 40BR setup which has been home to the same 2 clown fish for about 2 years now. Both clowns have luckily always appeared healthy, so it never occurred to us to QT them prior to moving them to the 40BR. There haven't been any other fish added during that time period, so we figured they were pest-free and just moved them over.

Anyhow, the other day when shopping at one of our favorite local shops, one of the owners recommended to us to put the clowns through TTM for ich, and to leave our 40BR fallow for 72 days...

I'm tending to feel like that probably *is* the right thing to do, but I figured before we went through the trouble I'd try to get some second opinions. Is it really possible that after several years of apparently good health that they could be ich carriers?

And on a related note, we're setting up a BC29 right now, and I am positive that I've used the same wet pipette to take water from both aforementioned 40BR (which house the clowns) and the BC29 to test salinity... Should I also worry about our BC29 now potentially containing ich? :headwally:

Thanks!

 

[ThRoewer]

After 8 years, and if there were never any other fish added, and you never saw any symptoms on them, any ich they may have had likely has died out.

That said, if ich is of concern it is always a good idea to do TTM with every fish that is moved from one tank to another.

 

[snorvich]

After 8 years, and if there were never any other fish added, and you never saw any symptoms on them, any ich they may have had likely has died out.

That said, if ich is of concern it is always a good idea to do TTM with every fish that is moved from one tank to another.

What he said. Have you added any other wet item?

 

[MatAndPatti]

What he said. Have you added any other wet item?

Just corals and inverts (emerald crab, some hermits and snails). And most of those additions are fairly recent.

Speaking of adding wet items, what's protects you from ich when purchasing corals? Couldn't one of the lifecycle stages be attached to a frag plug? We always dip (lugols and CoralRx) but would those be enough?

 

[snorvich]

Just corals and inverts (emerald crab, some hermits and snails). And most of those additions are fairly recent.

Speaking of adding wet items, what's protects you from ich when purchasing corals? Couldn't one of the lifecycle stages be attached to a frag plug? We always dip (lugols and CoralRx) but would those be enough?

Ich can come in with CUC (hermits and snails) and corals if on a frag plug if they came from a system containing fish.

 

[SNAKEMANVET]

This may sound like a dumb question,but how is ich going to die off if fish are still present in the dt.

 

[snorvich]

This may sound like a dumb question,but how is ich going to die off if fish are still present in the dt.

It won't.

 

[SNAKEMANVET]

I was just asking,because I seen this posted by Roewer post #2. After 8 years, and if there were never any other fish added, and you never saw any symptoms on them, any ich they may have had likely has died out..

 

[jbvdhp]

I was just asking,because I seen this posted by Roewer post #2. After 8 years, and if there were never any other fish added, and you never saw any symptoms on them, any ich they may have had likely has died out..

I've read that the strain becomes less and less potent with each subsequent generation, and usually after 11-12 generations (i.e. 1 year) the strain dies out as it becomes less effective at infecting.

 

[SNAKEMANVET]

Thanks for the info jbvdhp,but I can't see it dying off completely no matter how long it is.As long as a parasite has a host to feed off of it will continue to complete it's life cycle.True the number of parasites can dwindle but they are still there.

 

[ThRoewer]

This may sound like a dumb question,but how is ich going to die off if fish are still present in the dt.

1. If the fish are fully immune it will die out as if the tank was fallow.
Even with partially immune fish it is likely that it rather sooner than later dies out simply due to the constant predation it is under in a reef tank - in the end it's just another microorganism corals and filter feeders go after.
This does not apply to FOWLR tanks!

2. There were lab findings that a single strain of ich can only go through a certain number of life cycles before it degenerates.

All the above of course only applies when no new strains are introduced and no highly susceptible fish are present.

Also, it is nothing you should really count on.

 

[SNAKEMANVET]

Thanks for clearing that up for me Roewer.

 

[MatAndPatti]

Ich can come in with CUC (hermits and snails) and corals if on a frag plug if they came from a system containing fish.

Yikes, that's what I was afraid of! So what do people do to protect themselves, then? Most of our local shops have a couple of fish in their frag tanks...

Do people QT their corals for 72 days?

Are there any coral dips that are effective at eliminating or reducing the risk?

 

[ThRoewer]

Some people QT corals, though usually more to prevent coral parasites entering their DT.
With frags you could have the store cut the plug off. That would eliminate ich cysts as long as there are no dead areas on the coral itself. it would also eliminate a lot of coral parasites or at least their eggs.

No dip that leaves the coral alive has the strength to kill an ich cyst.

 

[Deinonych]

Do people QT their corals for 72 days?

I do, in a dedicated invert-only QT.

 

[MatAndPatti]

So, is it fairly common that people pick up ich from coral or inverts?

I'm not looking for shortcuts, but I think everyone has an acceptable level (or none whatsoever) of risk they're willing to take on. I'm just trying to understand the likelihood of this happening... The possibility hadn't even occurred to me prior to this thread!

 

[MatAndPatti]

Some people QT corals, though usually more to prevent coral parasites entering their DT.
With frags you could have the store cut the plug off. That would eliminate ich cysts as long as there are no dead areas on the coral itself. it would also eliminate a lot of coral parasites or at least their eggs.

No dip that leaves the coral alive has the strength to kill an ich cyst.

Thanks for that suggestion, that's definitely something I'll think about next time we pick up something new!

 

[Deinonych]

So, is it fairly common that people pick up ich from coral or inverts?

I'm not looking for shortcuts, but I think everyone has an acceptable level (or none whatsoever) of risk they're willing to take on. I'm just trying to understand the likelihood of this happening... The possibility hadn't even occurred to me prior to this thread!

I can't speak to the frequency, but it did happen to me a few years back. I suspect a zoa colony that was on a sizeable chunk of live rock. Another user had Brooklynella come in on an urchin. I think the likelihood is pretty small with frags, but I'm not taking any chances. Agree that everyone has their own barometer for acceptable risk.

 

[microlady]

So, is it fairly common that people pick up ich from coral or inverts?

I'm not looking for shortcuts, but I think everyone has an acceptable level (or none whatsoever) of risk they're willing to take on. I'm just trying to understand the likelihood of this happening... The possibility hadn't even occurred to me prior to this thread!

It happened to me once. Crypto came in on some zoas and mushrooms that were attached to some large rocks.