Reboot
- Thread starter galleon
- Start date
markalot
...
Howdy,
I've read both threads, fun to follow along.
In the first thread it was mentioned that Therman's old TOTM winner was lost. The wayback machine has a copy, just FYI for those who want to see it.
http://web.archive.org/web/20040413050805/http://www.reefcentral.com/totm/2001-10/index.php
Looking forward to seeing continued progress with this tank.
I've read both threads, fun to follow along.
In the first thread it was mentioned that Therman's old TOTM winner was lost. The wayback machine has a copy, just FYI for those who want to see it.
http://web.archive.org/web/20040413050805/http://www.reefcentral.com/totm/2001-10/index.php
Looking forward to seeing continued progress with this tank.
naterealbig
Premium Member
Thank you for the reply. I have noticed that there is a great deal of confusion regarding the term nutrients when talking about reef tanks. One 'definition' of the term would seem to describe the levels of nitrate and phosphate in the reef, while the other 'definition' describes the amount of food in the water column that the corals (hard and soft) can consume. Base on the literature I have read, real stony dominate reefs are low in the 'nutrients' phosphate and nitrate, while nutrient dense with regard to flora and fauna that the corals can actually consume.
I believe that the bare bottom method is the perfect approach while trying to achieve this balance, as it allows a greater degree of control with regard to nutrient control, in both senses. It appears that perhaps with a less aggressive means of detritus removal (with your tank compared to mine) there is more food for the coral, and therefore would require less frequent intentional feedings. Would you agree? Also, do you feel that the addition of a carbon source provides additional food for your corals?
I value your input, as well as your 'against-the-grain' attitude concerning the propagation of stony corals. Keep us posted, and good luck with the reboot.
Regards - Nathaniel
Thanks Mark! Great find with therman's tank!
Correct. Bacterial counts on reefs are very high, higher than in the average reef aquarium. Acropora, etc. exhibit plenty of heterotrophy in the wild.
I think there is almost certainly more food for the corals, in the form of intentionally added particles (TDO), then instead of decomposed dissolved nutrients, the breakdown of leftover food/respired waste, you get bacteria. The thing to watch is phosphate build up, as the level of phosphate going in does not balance with what bacteria take up. Methods like Calcium/Potassium nitrate dosing for the advanced and chemistry savvy reefer, or GFO use, are a great way to pick up this excess phosphate. Right now, I'm implementing GFO at less than half the recommended rate (I think aquarists commonly overdose GFO). I will adjust once my Hanna checker comes in (tomorrow!). Once all the old crap has been removed from the system (the Porites rocks are still shedding detritus from the crash and neglect), I will reevaluate my phosphate management and asses whether to stick with GFO or to begin dosing Ca(NO3)2.
sahin
Ultimate Reefer
I love it.
I have the same meter. I love mine for how consistent and accurate it is. In terms of accuracy, I have tested against D&D and Merck low range kits.
I have been using mine for nearly two years I think. Over 100 tests done with it.
My meter gave me a reading of 17 the other day...converted that is roughly 0.05ppm phosphate. I would like lower, in the hopes my corals colour up better.
Some of my SPS (mainly the aquacultured) are colouring up nicely. The Mari frags are kinda brown or some very brown.
Two questions for you:
1. Couldnt see on this thread; what are you using to control phosphates?
2. How low do you wish to take the phosphate (ie 0.03ppm or even lower)?
Hey sahin,
I actually did multiple replicates of this one reaction, it read 22, 24, 26, 19. That's a precision of 2 ppb (1 sigma) P or 0.006 ppm phosphate. That's pretty good. I'm impressed so far. I wish the kit came with more than 6 reagent packets though.
Phosphate control is accomplished two ways at the moment, vinegar dosing (which will take up PO4, but not at the ratio of N
that most foods have in them, so there will be leftover P to accumulate), and very conservative GFO use. I got the Hanna checker to be able to more effectively control and utilize the GFO. I wouldn't mind getting natural reef water phosphate concentration (sub 0.03 ppm). Once I have a value I'm satisfied with, I may remove GFO and begin using Ca(NO3)2 dosing to balance the N ratio for bacterial consumption.I finally found the last reservoir of garbage in the tank from the crash, it was a pile of detritus inside the skimmer body. After deep cleaning the skimmer and tuning it to run very wet on the 11th, today the PO4 measures 0.006 ppm, and the water is as clear as air this morning. I'm excited to see how things progress from here.
sahin
Ultimate Reefer
I finally found the last reservoir of garbage in the tank from the crash, it was a pile of detritus inside the skimmer body. After deep cleaning the skimmer and tuning it to run very wet on the 11th, today the PO4 measures 0.006 ppm, and the water is as clear as air this morning. I'm excited to see how things progress from here.
Can you provide an idea of much skimmer fluid you are collecting daily or even weekly?
A shot of your skimmate fluid would be very useful. I just didnt think wet skimming would make much of an impact on phosphate levels.
Thanks for continuing this very interesting and useful thread :thumbsup:
Sahin, after cleaning the skimmer, I'm getting about 100 mL of very cloudy (think bacteria bloom cloudy) every day over the past couple of days. I like wet skimming for a lot of reasons, for a large part it keeps caked scum from being in the riser tube and continuously being in contact with the water column in the tank. It also allows passive water changes: I check and adjust salinity weekly. I attribute the drop in P to multiple avenues, though, not solely wet skimming: I found and cleaned a PILE of old detritus out of the skimmer body, which I feel is highly likely to have given my management methods a leg up: I carbon dose, and I use GFO, both in great moderation.
For any skeptics:
Right after skimmer cleaning:
This morning:
I about spit my coffee out when I saw the reading at the end of the timer this morning.
sahin
Ultimate Reefer
I about spit my coffee out when I saw the reading at the end of the timer this morning.
Wow! That is very low! 0.006ppm phosphate. Natural levels have been reached.
Will be interesting to see whether the corals colour up fast (assuming the phosphate levels remains at or very near this level).
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