I havent...I went another direction on my tank so I had to deal with that first. I am absolutely dead set on finding something very clean to hang over my rimless. That has been my hang up to this point. The DIY route I can do Im just not sure of the cleanliness of them...Im also looking at AI, Reeftech, and the Radion
what size tank are you wanting to put this on??
Thank you for your input Jamie. I am trying to decide between an led fixture that has RGB and one that doesnt.
You don't want a RGB fixture and here is why: although these are primary colours and it is possible to optically mix all colours (more or less) with them, they represent only three wavelengths. There is a difference between wavelengths and optical mix. The last is a trick our eyes play, such as what artists call pointilism and we use for colour printing. If we are far enough away from the individual colour spots or they are fine enough to start with, our vision blends them to create other colours. This will not help your corals as they require wavelengths, not an optical mix!
With LEDs, you want two main types of light: white light for our eyes and to balance missing spectrum, typically one uses a cool to neutral white phosphor, plus violet to blue light for the photosynthesis and colour rendition of coral pigments. Red is not required, unless you really like warm colouring and, frankly, I would try to supply this with a warmer white LED.
At this point in time, you have two excellent choices (and certainly more coming/ proving themselves over the years) for top quality lighting that I've had experience with; AI and Vertex. I have the later and am very pleased with it. It was defintiely the right choice. Both are expensive to start, but actually worth the price and difficult to compare, as they are very different approaches to LED lighting. You'll find plenty of fans of both types.
Although they may cost more than most want to spend, I am one that always trys to buy quality, as I've learned over the years, cheap products are cheap for a reason. You tend to buy them twice or three times (if you're that gullable)! and typically don't do the job you expected to begin with. I've been keeping marine tanks for over 40 years, I know what can happen. :headwally:
You don't want a RGB fixture and here is why: although these are primary colours and it is possible to optically mix all colours (more or less) with them, they represent only three wavelengths. There is a difference between wavelengths and optical mix. The last is a trick our eyes play, such as what artists call pointilism and we use for colour printing. If we are far enough away from the individual colour spots or they are fine enough to start with, our vision blends them to create other colours. This will not help your corals as they require wavelengths, not an optical mix!
With LEDs, you want two main types of light: white light for our eyes and to balance missing spectrum, typically one uses a cool to neutral white phosphor, plus violet to blue light for the photosynthesis and colour rendition of coral pigments. Red is not required, unless you really like warm colouring and, frankly, I would try to supply this with a warmer white LED.
At this point in time, you have two excellent choices (and certainly more coming/ proving themselves over the years) for top quality lighting that I've had experience with; AI and Vertex. I have the later and am very pleased with it. It was defintiely the right choice. Both are expensive to start, but actually worth the price and difficult to compare, as they are very different approaches to LED lighting. You'll find plenty of fans of both types.
Although they may cost more than most want to spend, I am one that always trys to buy quality, as I've learned over the years, cheap products are cheap for a reason. You tend to buy them twice or three times (if you're that gullable)! and typically don't do the job you expected to begin with. I've been keeping marine tanks for over 40 years, I know what can happen. :headwally:
With a canopy you could go with AI's and DIY the supplementation as you feel fit. I have a 24 led kit I put together with a mix of warm whites, neutral whites, cool white, blues, and royal blues. At first I only had cool whites and royal blues. The addition of the other led's is not a HUGE difference, but I would definately consider it a marked improvement.
Sounds like quite the build you are about to begin.
You don't want a RGB fixture and here is why: although these are primary colours and it is possible to optically mix all colours (more or less) with them, they represent only three wavelengths. There is a difference between wavelengths and optical mix. The last is a trick our eyes play, such as what artists call pointilism and we use for colour printing. If we are far enough away from the individual colour spots or they are fine enough to start with, our vision blends them to create other colours. This will not help your corals as they require wavelengths, not an optical mix!
Would you care the share the details of what exactly you are running? Thanks!I don't agree with this at all. I am running some RGB LEDs right now and am loving the results.
I don't agree with this at all. I am running some RGB LEDs right now and am loving the results. I can't stand the white/blue mix that Vertex and AI employ. Colors lack in most cases and it is a VERY limited spectrum.
EVERY single MH and T5 bulb out there has a portion of red in it, yet when we switch to LED, red is terrible and stay away??? Find the logic in that one. :headwalls:
I am not saying we need a bunch of red/pink/magenta/purple LEDs but we need some. Chlorohplyll uses red light the most efficiently actually. (http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1496092)
I like that my RGB has an equal mix of red, green and blue and then I can add more blue and UV LEDs to off set the white a little bit.
By the time LED has run its' course, we will not be using the standard blue/white mix that we have now. T5s tried to go that route and it never worked out. Other lighting technologies have also tried and all fail. Strictly white and blue never has been nor ever will be a good solution.
First, if the wavelength is not being transmited from the LED, it is simply not there! This is basic physics. You cannot trick a coral into believing it is getting 490nm, if it is not there. End of discussion. with a RGB spectrum, only the blue light is giving the corals any usable PAR; i.e. PUR. The rest is decoration.
Marine organisms use very little of the red spectrum for photosynthesis, as this part of the PAR spectrum is no longer present in usable amounts at about 5m depth. Our corals do not use it to any notable extent, indeed, when corals are exposed to just red light, life processes literally stop. No photosynthesis. (read some of Dana Riddle's articles on PAR, pigments, etc) This is a simple fact of marine environments. organisms that actually live in the tidal zone MAY be able to utilize red light, as many algae can, but, if you dive, you will notice that such organisms disappear after a few meters under the waves, unless they are able to utilize the blue PAR. Other organisms that use the blue PAR spectrum replace the red light dependant forms. The PAR spectrum was originally established for land plants and does not take into consideration the effect of water, which filters the wavelengths, starting with the red and moving right down into the UV.
Also, the thread you noted is quite old and contains a great deal of misinformation.
As to previous lighting schemes containing red, some do, most do not! Check the actual spectra involved. Yes, a bit of red is typically there, as it is hard to avoid, but only certain T5s or halides have any notable red and this is for the aesthetic.
if you want red, then use it, our eyes seem to relish these tones, but don't expect the corals to suddenly applaud. They are blind to it.
Alright show me some popular T5 bulbs and MH bulbs that do not contain at least some red. Even the ATI Blue Plus has red in it.
I am not telling anyone to go throw a ton of red LEDs onto their tank. But the VERY limited spectrum that AI has, is not what corals need. Just like you said, if it isn't there, it isn't there. The AIs have major spikes in very limited areas. They miss all the rest.
You can argue this all you want but I have seen enough tanks lit up with the CW/RB combo to know that tank looks UGLY to me and the corals are never that impressive.
of course you dont agree, you are running it.I don't agree with this at all. I am running some RGB LEDs right now and am loving the results.
Ryan,
here is a link that may be interesting
http://www.ehow.com/facts_5513672_far-underwater-can-light-travel.html
and another on photography
http://www.uwphotographyguide.com/underwater-photography-lighting-fundamentals
These principles of light physics clearly define the conditions one would find on a reef. As you can read, at 15ft/5m, there is no red light present. None what so ever. Yellow is gone at 35ft/12m, which is not very deep and represents the average depth most of our corals would call home.
What the green LED can bring?
of course you dont agree, you are running it.
people always justify every equipment they are using even if it's unnecessary and they will argue that they are right.
i knowYou are right.