replacing 250W MH setup... LED options please

[crvz]

Hey folks,

I havent bought lights in 8 years, and havent really paid attention to technology development over the last 4 or 5. I've currently got three 250W radium 20Kk bulbs in lumen bright pendants run by lumatek ballasts. BUT... one of the ballasts has failed, and I am looking to replace hardware at this time. I'm currently just moving the bulbs around each week to get by, but that's not a long term solution. These lights are hanging over a 300 gallon tank with a 72"x36" footprint, which is about 24" deep. The pendants sit in an aluminum frame on which I have installed a bunch of cree LEDs (LEDs are used for lighting when the MHs are not on, but dont add much significant usable light for corals). The tank is a mixed reef with mostly LPS and softies right now, but I do have some SPS. Here's a shot of the current assembly right when I installed it.

So I provide the prelude to give context of what might work well in replacement. I'm trying to budget some monies right now for a replacement, as I don't expect it to run cheap. I've been relatively satisfied with the MHs over time, but I don't care for the sustaining costs ($$ bulbs and electricity), and the heat is not helping the fish room humidity. As you can see infer from that picture, I've got the flexibility to mount about anything I want. There's about 4' above the aquarium that I can use, and I currently have the light rig on a bike hoist for flexibility. Given all this intel, what might you guys steer me towards knowing I want something that:

- provides performance on par (pun intended) or better than my current MH setup
- covers the footprint of my aquarium (72x36 and 24" deep, though the tank is aquascaped that I really only need to light 72"x24" of the fooprint)
- hopefully costs under $1200 (though that may be optimistic, budget can stretch if hardware quality and performance justifies it)

more about the tank can be found here: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1692900

 

[d2mini]

I think the only way you are going to have enough LEDs to cover that size tank and give you the spread and intensity you are used to for $1200, you are going to have to either build your own or go with the cheap ebay black boxes.

If you were to go with a popular fixture like Radions over that size tank you would need at least 4 units across to cover the 72" and then getting one radion to cover 36" front to back is not going to happen either, so IMHO, you are looking at two rows of 4, totaling 8 lights. Bulb replacements and electricity ain't looking so bad now, eh?

But ya, you could cover the tank in ebay boxes much cheaper. You just don't get all the bells and whistles.

 

[AZRippster]

Yep, coming from a guy that moved from solely LED to MH/T5, you're gonna need at least double what any LED manufacturer claims to prevent shadowing and provide the PAR you need. You may also want to consider LED/T5, something I'm working on for the summer months here in Arizona.

 

[crvz]

yeah, I actually had really good success with T5 on my previous tank. One bit I left out is that there is a top brace that splits my current tank into three sections (at 24" sections across the length). It's the marineland 300DD tank.

I really don't care about lighting the back 10-12" of the tank, though, as that's where the overflows are and as mentioned, the rock really doesnt start until forward of that (pretty open against the back wall). I could do three 24" T5 fixtures, but then bulb prices are going to hit hard at replacement time (i found bulb prices don't vary much by length).

I also am not really into having excessive control, either. It doesnt have to work with the controller, or have a million color options. The term "Ebay black boxes" doesnt exactly hit what I had in mind, but are they considered viable by the masses? Or just junk?

 

[simpleman98]

I am looking at upgrading to the same tank you have and have been weighing my options for lighting. I am leaning toward a DIY LED/T5 combo. Current tank is 100% LED and it does have more shadowing than I would prefer.

 

[Mrw1936]

I have to say I just installed the new reefbreeders photon v2 light on my tank. It has a lot of controlability, uses quality LED'S and is at a middle ground as far as price. I do have t5 for suppliments though. I think the t5's let you get away with not having to stack led fixtures side by side to get the proper coverage.

 

[Hentz]

I also would go with Reefbreeders with a budget like that. I had incredible success with them!

 

[Ostentum]

Chris. I have the Reefbreeders Value Series, the Photon 24s and the new AI Hydra 52's if you want me to bring any over and let you see what you think over your tank.

 

[mr_anderson]

I vote replace the ballast for ~ $120 and call it a day. I don't want to get into a lighting debate but I went from MH/T5 to LED and now back to MH/T5. To me, LED was not worth the initial investment and ROI long term 5-7 years. My SPS is loving the MH/T5.

 

[Arthur1]

I am a halide and florescent fan. I use Kessils and Ocean Revive LEDs and honestly, if ever I set up a display aquarium for myself, it will be MH. I have been doubling up on LEDs that replaced halides and on a 90 that I just did...2 more LED fixtures are going onto it. I do like Kessils for shallower/smaller aquariums but other than that...you can decide.

 

[yacn]

check out http://www.ledzeal.com/

Email Kevin for pricing and information...there is a large thread about these lights and people's success using them. They look like best quality LED for the money.

I am in the process of ordering my LED light from them. I want my light in silver and they won't have it in stock for another 2 weeks. You can customize LED layout and lenses. Can order with WIFI or wired remote. I have 72" long tank x 18 wide and 29 deep, and their model 400S should work for me....$600 ish....I'm ordering extra LED's, lenses, etc in case I want to change my layout down the road. If you needed 2 of these lights for your tank you would be in $1200 range.

I too am running (3) 250 MH and (2) 72" Super Actinic VHO's. I'm going to give LED's a shot. Save money on electricity and bulb replacements. Lot's of people are having success with LED's.

 

[Breadman03]

I vote replace the ballast for ~ $120 and call it a day. I don't want to get into a lighting debate but I went from MH/T5 to LED and now back to MH/T5. To me, LED was not worth the initial investment and ROI long term 5-7 years. My SPS is loving the MH/T5.

In all honesty, that is probably your most cost effective option.

 

[Wazzel]

If I were setting up that tank for LED only I would use 8 AI Hydra26 units. Once you get past 24 inches in the long axis the 52 does not cover well.

Your most cost effective option is to fix the broken component and keep the rest of the system. LEDs are nice, but you are not going to save piles and piles of money. It will take years to break even.

 

[oreo57]

nothing wrong w/ 2 Photon 32-V2......

 

[yacn]

If I were setting up that tank for LED only I would use 8 AI Hydra26 units. Once you get past 24 inches in the long axis the 52 does not cover well.

Your most cost effective option is to fix the broken component and keep the rest of the system. LEDs are nice, but you are not going to save piles and piles of money. It will take years to break even.

You do save money switching from MH/VHO combo like I have to LED's and it doesn't take as long as you might think.

Go online and use energy cost calculator to see....http://www.rapidtables.com/calc/electric/electricity-calculator.htm

I have (3) 250 watt MH & (2) 160 watt VHO's = 1070 watts

1070 watts x 8 hours a day = $390 annual cost at 12.5 cents Kw Hour

The LED's are 360 watts x 8 hours a day = $131 annual electricity cost

Savings of $259 per year in electricity alone. Now factor in I spend another $300 on bulbs each year, and I am saving money very quickly.

My LED's only cost me $600....I guess if you are willing to pay thousands for LED's the savings might not be there. So it's well worth it to consider the switch to LED's. Too many people are having success with LED's not to consider this option.

 

[Wazzel]

You do save money switching from MH/VHO combo like I have to LED's and it doesn't take as long as you might think.

Go online and use energy cost calculator to see....http://www.rapidtables.com/calc/electric/electricity-calculator.htm

I have (3) 250 watt MH & (2) 160 watt VHO's = 1070 watts

1070 watts x 8 hours a day = $390 annual cost at 12.5 cents Kw Hour

The LED's are 360 watts x 8 hours a day = $131 annual electricity cost

Savings of $259 per year in electricity alone. Now factor in I spend another $300 on bulbs each year, and I am saving money very quickly.

My LED's only cost me $600....I guess if you are willing to pay thousands for LED's the savings might not be there. So it's well worth it to consider the switch to LED's. Too many people are having success with LED's not to consider this option.

I have an LED only lit tanks and generally a proponent of their use. Ditching a working system and replacing it with another is not a cost effective option unless you stay in the hobby for many years, in most cases.

I think my break even vs MH or t5 was 2 or 3 years. I forget, been over two years since I did the cost analysis.

 

[Fredfish]

...
I think my break even vs MH or t5 was 2 or 3 years. I forget, been over two years since I did the cost analysis.

2 to 3 years is not that long at all unless you are one of those in and out in 2 years hobbyists.

yacn. I don't think that 360 watts of LEDs is going to replace 1,100 watts of MH/T5 and get you either equal spread or intensity. A more reasonable number would be about a 30% reduction in power use. That is the case that Phillips put forward.

Now if that switch is working for you then great, but you probably had too much light in your previous setup.

 

[Breadman03]

You do save money switching from MH/VHO combo like I have to LED's and it doesn't take as long as you might think.

Go online and use energy cost calculator to see....http://www.rapidtables.com/calc/electric/electricity-calculator.htm

I have (3) 250 watt MH & (2) 160 watt VHO's = 1070 watts

1070 watts x 8 hours a day = $390 annual cost at 12.5 cents Kw Hour

The LED's are 360 watts x 8 hours a day = $131 annual electricity cost

Savings of $259 per year in electricity alone. Now factor in I spend another $300 on bulbs each year, and I am saving money very quickly.

My LED's only cost me $600....I guess if you are willing to pay thousands for LED's the savings might not be there. So it's well worth it to consider the switch to LED's. Too many people are having success with LED's not to consider this option.

That surely impacted your heater or chiller use. Perhaps you were running a chiller and don't need to anymore, or your heaters barely ever turned on and now run more often. There are peripheral costs that may not be apparent at first. I also went to LED due to their efficiency, but just want to point out that cost analysis should consider other factors as well.

 

[kevin_e]

For that size tank, replace the ballast. You won't find d better success that with the lighting you have now.

 

[pyton]

I built a LED fixture myself several years ago for this foot print.
Marineland 300 gallon Deep Dem.

8 rows (70" long) with 35 LED's on each row (spaced 1 3/4" apart)

Each row is 1 1/2" wide and spaced 3" on center.

White and Blue lights only

driven at 75% (more LED's per line) and ran between 60% to 70% (dimming) throughout the day with a GHL Profilux.

Ran for over a year with no problems and great growth.

I had a good mix before I took my tank down and sold it. The only thing I kept was my light and the Profilux.

I did NOT use CREE LED's as I was on budget, I ordered them from the factory in China that also made the CREE LEDs (so I was told).

The only thing I would change is adding some other colors to the light such as green or red LED's

Cost of build was around $2000.00, not including the Profilux which you do not need. You can wire it for an Apex and if you do not have a controller you can plug into timers and rig your own dimming knob.

Savings per month in Electric bill from my 250W MH about $100.00 and we live in a area where our power is cheap.

Sorry I do not have anymore of my contacts for the build or I would post them.

The reason I built my own was:
1. Cost!
2. store bought did not cover the entire tank
3. store bought seemed to use use cheap LED's and over drive them
4. I know exactly what I have (at least I did at the time)
5. No one was happy with the store bought LED's