Salt questions ???

Crusty Old Shellback

Crusty Old Shellback

MASVC OG
Premium Member
Ok all you smart people, I'm looking for info or thoughts here.

Since my local NSW supply has been shut down, I have had to switch back over to making my own ASW and it gets real expensive doing 200G water changes. So I'm looking at alternatives.

My question is this, can salt that is derived from the ocean be reconstitued and used with no harm? What I am looking at is using salt that is harvested from the salt ponds where it is evaporated and then mined. They basically flood a field with ocean water, let the sun evap the water out and then mine up the salt that's left. The ponds are down in the Bahamas and therefor it is Carbiean ocean water that the salt comes from. The cost of the salt is a whole lot cheapier than buying ASW mix and is readily available, 5 bucks for 50 lb's. I've done some initial research into it and now want to take the next step of mixing some up.

Any input? Has anyone looked into this before?

Thanks for your inputs.
 
Crusty Old Shellback said:
Ok all you smart people, I'm looking for info or thoughts here.

Since my local NSW supply has been shut down, I have had to switch back over to making my own ASW and it gets real expensive doing 200G water changes. So I'm looking at alternatives.

My question is this, can salt that is derived from the ocean be reconstitued and used with no harm? What I am looking at is using salt that is harvested from the salt ponds where it is evaporated and then mined. They basically flood a field with ocean water, let the sun evap the water out and then mine up the salt that's left. The ponds are down in the Bahamas and therefor it is Carbiean ocean water that the salt comes from. The cost of the salt is a whole lot cheapier than buying ASW mix and is readily available, 5 bucks for 50 lb's. I've done some initial research into it and now want to take the next step of mixing some up.

Any input? Has anyone looked into this before?

Thanks for your inputs.
Click to expand...

Nope... when seawater evaporates, things like calcium and carbonate reach saturation and precipitate out. If you take the resulting salt and redissolve it, the levels will be nowhere near the original seawater.
 
Ok, I'm not chemical savy so please bear with me.

If I'm understanding you correctly, just by removing the water (H2O) the chemical make up of what is left will alter itself from the original make up, and when I add the water back in, it will be different? Meaning that different elements will attach differently to each other from what they were when they were in a lquid form.

Does that sound right?
 
Crusty Old Shellback said:
Ok, I'm not chemical savy so please bear with me.

If I'm understanding you correctly, just by removing the water (H2O) the chemical make up of what is left will alter itself from the original make up, and when I add the water back in, it will be different? Meaning that different elements will attach differently to each other from what they were when they were in a lquid form.

Does that sound right?
Click to expand...

Correct. :)

As an example, calcium and alkalinity will precipitate out as calcium carbonate (limestone), which will not re-dissolve when mixed with water.

You can try the experiment yourself by taking a gallon of seawater, allowing it to evaporate, adding RO/DI or distilled water to make one gallon, and then testing the levels.
 
You wouldn't be looking at Morton Solar Salt by chance? I've seen their operation. While it is indeed evaporated sea water, the end product is nearly 99% pure NaCl. The rest of the constituents we need for out tanks is left behind. The same will be true of any other salt pond operations in the islands.
 
Yea Bill, that's the one. I had to pick some up yesterday for the water softner. Started reading the label and it got me to thinking so I called them this morning. They said it is a ocean water pond that dries up and they harvest it. I've seen similar operations down in Baja.

It's just droping 200 bucks a month on salt is getting expensive when I used to only spend 25 bucks in gas to collect the same amount of NSW. the NSW spigot will not be back in operation for at least another year. :(
 
They make that salt on the island of Great Inagua. Morton owns 2/3's of the island, with the remaining 1/3 owned by the Bahamian Audubon Society as a preserve for the largest breeding population of Flamingos in this hemisphere. They are also the brightest colored Flamingos found anywhere, due to the orange bacteria and plankton that the shrimp they eat feeds on. Interesting place, right down the to company store :D The only privately owned business on the island when I was there was a small restaurant run by the wives of two guys working for Morton. The food was very good :D
 
I'm not expert either on this but would think that the elements in the ground would get mixed in with the harvested salt and not knowing what those might be could pose a risk to the aquarium flora and fauna. Additionally I would think that the heat and I could be wrong but the heat from the sun baking the water until evaporated might change or destroy some of the elements necessary as well. $200.00/month on salt what size tank do you have?
 
Big tank is 400 G/550 G system volume. Small tank is 30 G.

I do large water changes 200G as I have to drain down the system that much so I can clean the front glass (3 foot tall tank).
 
Somehow, the thought of reconstituting SW from dried ocean salt from a sea pond out in the open, invites a thought of getting some 'unwanted guests' from the soil that invariably gets mixed when harvesting the dried white powder in these ponds. I could be wrong, just my opinion.
I know kosher salt sold in stores or natural sea salt is made that way, hard to imagine that there's other stuff/minerals in there besides NaCl!
Or contact any of the ASW salt manufacturers for wholesale pricing, i.e. bulk salt not packaged, etc. Just a suggestion.
 
Buying in bulk may be cheapier in the long run, but I'd have to buy it in a large quantity to get a deal. Plus I'd have to find a god spot to store that much salt.

vipulgshukla, love the avatar. beautiful fish. I have one myself. beatuiful colors on them, espically the neon blue around the edge of the fins.
 
vipulgshukla said:
Somehow, the thought of reconstituting SW from dried ocean salt from a sea pond out in the open, invites a thought of getting some 'unwanted guests' from the soil that invariably gets mixed when harvesting the dried white powder in these ponds. I could be wrong, just my opinion.
I know kosher salt sold in stores or natural sea salt is made that way, hard to imagine that there's other stuff/minerals in there besides NaCl!
Or contact any of the ASW salt manufacturers for wholesale pricing, i.e. bulk salt not packaged, etc. Just a suggestion.
Click to expand...


Where do you think the NaCl is commercial salt mixes comes from ;)
 
Im a little confused by some things that have been brought up.

If evaporated salt is so bad then how are we assuming that the big marine salt companies are harvesting it? i think that they probly use the same method and then add any elements that they have determind need supplementation from the research.

as far as calcium and alkalinity dissapearing im not sure that is correct. my thought process is that calcium turns into calcium carbonate(limestone) when dried. but wouldnt that crystal still be left mixed in with the dried NaCl? same with alkalinity or sodium bicarbonate? i think the problem would lie in the ratio of calcium and alkalinity when you redesolve it because they would probly settle out at different layers when evaporating.

id be interested in testing the levels and seeing. although this may not be a good idea for reef tanks i think it may work for fish only tanks. also im no chemist so if i said anything stupid please correct me i love learning new things!
 
What happens as the salt evaporates, the salinity increases. As the this happens, the different constituents of the SW precipitate out of solution. In many cases, these precipitates are insoluble. Those insoluable preciptates are the reason you can't just scrape up the dehydrated salt water and add fresh to get sea water again. It also the formation of those precipitates that allow the salt companies to seperate out the NaCl. It is the NaCl that the companies like Instant Ocean, Tropic Marin, etc., buy to make their salt mixes with. Of course, they have to add all those components back in that make it usable SW.
 
Bill is right.

Next time you mix salt, feel the water. It is gets slightly warm. This is the chemical reaction happening. You than let it sit for a couple of hours before using it. This gives it time for the different stages of chemical reaction to complete.

If you are just mixing some dried up salt, there are no chemiacl reactions, and the water does not warm up.
 
JohnsonSBK said:
as far as calcium and alkalinity dissapearing im not sure that is correct. my thought process is that calcium turns into calcium carbonate(limestone) when dried. but wouldnt that crystal still be left mixed in with the dried NaCl? same with alkalinity or sodium bicarbonate? i think the problem would lie in the ratio of calcium and alkalinity when you redesolve it because they would probly settle out at different layers when evaporating.
Click to expand...

Calcium carbonate only dissolve in low pH. Sea water is 8.x, which is too high for it to dissolve. That's what a calcium reactor is for ... to dissolve calcium carbonate under low pH.

Do your test. I'm sure the results will speak for itself.
 
this is what i love about this website people who can share there knowledge and explain why in this case i am wrong, haha.

in your guys opinion do you think it would be ok to use in a fish only setup or do you think its not even ok to use it for that?
 
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