sdietz2469's 300 DD build thread

[sdietz2469]

OK, so the wife has finally okayed my upgrade! we have decided on the marineland 300DD standard tank with starfire front panel. I am planning on a sps/lps mixed reef. This thread is gonna be sparatic as i am workin 2 jobs and sometimes just cant get to the build between the rest of my lifes challenge.

Anyways,
My plans are to have a local welder build my steel stand. He is certified and specializes in structural support, so i am confident that he has the knowledge and ability to build my stand. The reason i am doing a steel stand is a few reasons.
1- i know that wood has flex and while i fully trust a wood stand, i am just that much more comfortable with steel than wood.
2- marineland doesnt make a stand taller than 27" tall and i really want my stand to be atleast 34" tall. Unfortunately i know marineland wont warranty their tank on any stand but marinelands built stands
3- i like how clean the underside of the stand looks with steel (you dont see 2x4s screwed and glued)
4 - moisture + wood = expansion and contraction, so it kinda worries me(again that piece of mind thing)

My equipment plans......

display-

4- tunze 6105's w/ 7095 controller
atb 4300 flowstar return pump split to feed chiller, frag tank, gfo/carbon, and boipellets/ skimmer
2- 400 watt 20 k radiums fired by blue wave 2 ballast in lumenmaxx 2 reflectors on each end
1- 250 watt 20 k radium fired by a bluewave ballast in a lumenmaxx 2 reflector
4- 5 ft 454 vhos fired with 2 icecap 660's
trying to decide between this and cree 3 w RB xt-e fired by meanwell 60-1050
I am unsure how many i should use, and the lenses that would be best, or how far apart they should be spaced etc( still trying to do a little research)
8- 1 watt blue moonlights
2- 100 gal rubbermaide troughs 1 for a frag/ growout tank 1 for a sump
atb med external w/ airstar skimmer
2-brs- gfo/ carbon reactor
geo 6-12 reactor w/ biopellets
20 gal fuge
chiller(tbd)
2- vertex mocean 3500 on the returns
i plan on runnin herbie drains and a safety durso in each overflow box


I will post as i recieve things or thing start to come together. the plan is to order the tankks ometime in febuary as long as everythingstays on track by summer i will have everything up and running full bore.

thank you for the patience and any advice would be much appreciated, as i am a newbie when it comes to anything over about 200 gallons .

shane

 

[ReeferEric]

Looks well thought out already, now let's just see if it goes as planned. We all know how that goes! lol

 

[sdietz2469]

Thanks I have been plannin for a while now....

 

[brannock_16]

I can't wait for this build! 100% subscribed!

 

[sdietz2469]

ok, so finally got a little progress towards my build, got the floor supported!!!! here are some pics.....

some 4 x 6 s and some 2 x10's for bracing the floor

concrete pads lag screws and brackets. originally, i bought these js-36 floor jacks, but had to return them and buy the js15(special order only)

total of 4 jacks installed leveled and secured

lag bolts set, and brackets that hold the 4 x 6 to the joists screwed in

2x10's cut and installed to keep from twisting toe nailed

each 4x6 spans a total of 4 floor joists approx 3ft apart and with my structural support already in the house i will have a total of 3 supports that will run perdindicular to the length of my tank.....

progress is the main thing i wanted to show everyone, my birthday is next week and i am hoping to maybe order the tank( fingers crossed) that way i can get the stand ordered and start to work on the light rack............

cant wait, i am getting excited!!!!!!!

shane

 

[Addict0Reef]

Two things I see could cause some problems later on...

1. The I-Joist floor that you have in your house is weak in resisting the crushing forces the beam and the load of the tank exert.

To alleviate this problem add to either side of the I-Joist web stiffeners (that are 1/8" longer than the depth of the joist) directly above the 4x6 beams, mechanically fasten in place. This way all the load will be transfered to the beam and not though the delecate web of the joist. Also contact manufacturer/distributor of I-Joist for their recommendations.

2. If the concrete blocks that your columns are bearing on is soil, that soil should be capable of bearing the loads.

Good luck with your build:celeb2:

 

[jarrett shark]

Nice start!!!

 

[sdietz2469]

Two things I see could cause some problems later on...

1. The I-Joist floor that you have in your house is weak in resisting the crushing forces the beam and the load of the tank exert.

To alleviate this problem add to either side of the I-Joist web stiffeners (that are 1/8" longer than the depth of the joist) directly above the 4x6 beams, mechanically fasten in place. This way all the load will be transfered to the beam and not though the delecate web of the joist. Also contact manufacturer/distributor of I-Joist for their recommendations.

2. If the concrete blocks that your columns are bearing on is soil, that soil should be capable of bearing the loads.

Good luck with your build:celeb2:

thankyou for the feedback, as i will welcome any ideas that any of you might have.......


first-where might i find these stiffiners home depot, lowes or are they something i need to fabricate? also where would i find who manufacuted my joists? is there a stamp or something on them?

2nd- i compacted the soil down the best i could with slamming the concrete pad down several times(prob 30-35lbs). then actually, due to the weight of my current system, my floor joist under my system was slightly sagging, so i slowly raised the jacks until all the joists were level again(1/2" sag over all). over the next few weeks i will go back down and check to make sure everything is level plumb and snug. the weight of my current system should be enough to compact test the ground and see if it sinks down(300 total gallons of water)120 display and 2-100 gallon troughs.is there something else i should be lookin into doing to compact the soil better?

thanks again.
shane

 

[Addict0Reef]

2nd- i compacted the soil down the best...

Worse case scenario: your concrete blocks are bearing on highly compressible organics such as topsoil or peat-moss (this is unlikely but hey, who knows?:headwallblue.

To discover your sub surface conditions you need to dig a small test hole adjacent to where the columns are bearing (the idea is not to disturb the soil under the columns if no action is required). Ideally you will dig down until you discover virgin soil, if this is not possible and the material you are digging is granular (sand and gravel) I suppose** a 2' depth test pit would suffice.

**Please consult a local soils engineer.

One more thing while we are at it.

I would ensure that the new aquarium footprint falls directly above the beams you have installed. If you missed the beam location by a couple of inches you could be inducing shear forces that the I-joist were not designed to accommodate. Your best bet is to seek professional advice (a vendor that sells your brand of I Joist usually found at local lumber yard). Give the vendor all your pertinent information (tank location, location of your new beams, size of room, size of joist ect). Then they can design a reinforcing detail that you can be confident in.

first-where might i find these stiffiners home depot, lowes or are they something i need to fabricate?

Sorry I got the nomenclature wrong. Not web stiffeners but squash blocks, if you go this route...

 

[sdietz2469]

Worse case scenario: your concrete blocks are bearing on highly compressible organics such as topsoil or peat-moss (this is unlikely but hey, who knows?:headwallblue.

To discover your sub surface conditions you need to dig a small test hole adjacent to where the columns are bearing (the idea is not to disturb the soil under the columns if no action is required). Ideally you will dig down until you discover virgin soil, if this is not possible and the material you are digging is granular (sand and gravel) I suppose** a 2' depth test pit would suffice.

**Please consult a local soils engineer.

One more thing while we are at it.

I would ensure that the new aquarium footprint falls directly above the beams you have installed. If you missed the beam location by a couple of inches you could be inducing shear forces that the I-joist were not designed to accommodate. Your best bet is to seek professional advice (a vendor that sells your brand of I Joist usually found at local lumber yard). Give the vendor all your pertinent information (tank location, location of your new beams, size of room, size of joist ect). Then they can design a reinforcing detail that you can be confident in.




Sorry I got the nomenclature wrong. Not web stiffeners but squash blocks, if you go this route...

Addict0reef- thank u for you excellence and expertise, pluss takin the time to read my thread and help. I have contacted an engineer and an waiting to hear back.

I do understand about the soil thing too, I know they didn't bring in any top soil etc, where my house was build was a clover field, and is heavily comprised of clays( really hard crap), and where my house sits they dug down 18" when they poured my foundation, that being said I will have this also checked out though, as I don't want anything th fail.

As far as the support beams the 2 I placed are approx 1.5 ft apart plus u have a standard floor support that will also fall directly under tha tank

 

[sdietz2469]

Oh, today I was going to order my tank, but really want to tank to an engineer before I buy a tank I can't use. Oh and it's my birthday, so hopefully everything falls into place for me .

 

[Addict0Reef]

I am reassured that you are taking measures to create a system that will be structurally stable.:hammer:

Regarding holding off on the purchase of the tank, that in my opinion is not necessary as any structural problems that you have can be resolved with the appropriately detailed solution.

So roll up your sleeves and get to work! I am eager to see this build unfold. :rollface:

 

[sdietz2469]

all right!!!!!!!!! game time ladys gents, and awaiting fish amd corals(lol). so i have been super busy and have not been able to post on here about my progress, but i have made leaps and bounds.


first addictoreef- thank you for your insight and help with catching the structural side of this! If it were not for you, i would probably be dealing with trying to clean up hundreds of gallons of water off the floor, so again thank you.

after being discouraged and feeling kinda stupid, i sucked up my pride , grabbed my wallet, and headed for one of the local building supply house(not home depot or lowes), and asked to talk to the engineer who designs their trusses. that was an utter failure as he said no way would my house ever hold 5000lbs over a 6ft by 3ft area,and wouldnt even put any of the info in his progam or anything, which later made me eve madder that he was this rude). i left mad to say the least and went to the only other supply house, (other than lowes and home depot)and asked to talk to the their engineer. this guy was nice, and helped me out tremendously. we added everything into his computer program as to my joists, house structure supports, and my added supports and he said it will hold, we just need to add some joist stiffiners or squash blocks at 10ft 6in from the outside wall supptr, but with caution, as he still recommended going to go see a real structural engineer( one that does structural support in houses, but specifically one who deals with crushing weigh loads) and gave me a number to two guys he trusted. I knew this wasnt going to be cheap, so again swallowed my pride and kissed my money for the tank build goodbye. walked in and showed the guy what i had. i had drawings, all the weight loads, we talked for probably 2 hours and came to the conclusion my floor should hold as is, if we add the squash blocks but, if it were his house, he would add a few things, so we did, and now here is what we did.......

 

[sdietz2469]

my joists are 9.5" tall and a solid 4x10 is also exactly 9.5"tall, so we bought 2- 10 ft 4x10's and chopped them the fit in between the joists. running them perpindicular to the joist,parralel to my support wall and added 4x6's with jack stands. I placed them directly above the 4x6s as to make 3 solid wood joists run perpindicular to the I joists.this will keep the subfloor from "deflecting" inbetween the joists, and make the weight of the tank dispursed more evenly and to take the majority of the weight off of the I joists.

the first one is a pic so you can see what we did with the 4x10s

also added 2 more jack stands directly under the tank just as reassurance

and we added a 8ft 4x10 ran parallel with the I joist under where my frag tank and and sump will sit to take the weight off of those 2 I joists also.

then on each side of the 4x10s that we chopped and placed above the 4x6s we added squash blocks to each side of the I joist to sandwich them in. we left them a little long so we had somewhere to hold, ad crawling around under the house with a 16 penny nailer isnt that cool and already dangerous enough.

 

[sdietz2469]

here is where my tank sat, my old stand is still there in the pic. i had just the plumbing running threw the wall, but decided i wanted to be able to access my tank from the back, so project 2 started.

and my fish room

also i really didnt like having carpet in my fish room, so we ripped it out and put down vinyl flooring with 3/8" plywood to make the floor a little more rigid, and also keep it from deflecting., so here are some pics of the construction

 

[sdietz2469]

 

[sdietz2469]

the stand is almost finished and the tank is down at the lfs. My stand is going to be made of 3/16" wall 2x2 tubular steel with a support at each corner, a vertical support directly in the center of the front and back of the 6ft span, and 2 lateral supports on the top and bottom at 2ft from each side to keep from there beinfg any bowing or twisting(doubtful with steel).


One question i would like a little insite on is should o set my tank dirctly on the steel stand, or should i put a 1" piece of plywood down? if i do the plywood, is it nessasary to eppoxy the wood? and if so, what epoxy should i use?

 

[Pallobi]

so far this is excellent! very nice job so far my friend

:beer:

 

[laredo300c]

Can't wait to see the tank, it's funny how we have seen this tank over and over,,,,,but I guess never in your house, so again....I can't wait to see this tank!!!!!!!!!!300dd, a true dream tank,,,,,,never gets old

 

[TheFishTeen]

In this going to be in-wall? Or did you just open the wall for direct access?