Skimmer Recommendations for 500 G Tank

[Drae]

Is running two smaller skimmers more effective than one larger? Have you done that?

On larger systems it can be effective but on smaller systems not so much. Buying a skimmer no matter what size of tank shouldn't be tough at all. Just ask yourself what's the most important features you want in your skimmer (after production of course). Do you want internal or external? Needle wheel or beckett or down draft? Recirculating? High end or mid grade ( higher end skimmers are slightly quieter)? People will tell you that you need a 5' tall skimmer with some gigantic power hungry pump and this is just not true! I suggest a needle wheel skimmer thats has a very large reaction chamber. In sump or external would be more than adequate if you get a skimmer with a 16" diameter and dual pumps. This shouldn't be a tough decision. Btw, nothing wrong with tall skimmers that have huge pumps on them. They're just not the only skimmers that are effective. I personally would try to keep the power usage as low as possible if I was planning a large system.

 

[smb2415]

I have posed this question myself concerning my in-process build for my 550g DT. SLIEF and other replied and I decided to bite the bullet so to speak and go for the SuperMarin 300. I compared some alternatives and the price differential was n't enough for me to justify king to a ford instead of the Ferrari.

In my build I am also focusing on efficiency in regards to electric and maintenance, another reason for opting for the SuperMarin.

FYI - you might want to check out my thread on closed loop heating since you are building a home you could save the expense of running a dedicated electric heater.

 

[ChrisColumbus]

In my build I am also focusing on efficiency in regards to electric and maintenance, another reason for opting for the SuperMarin.

FYI - you might want to check out my thread on closed loop heating since you are building a home you could save the expense of running a dedicated electric heater.

I have never heard the idea of using a recirc loop on a hot water heater to heat the tank. Very interesting. With propane fired hot water I wonder whether that would be less costly than a standard electric aquarium heater? You are stilling paying to heat the aquarium since whatever heat it takes from the heat exchanger has to be "replaced" by the hot water heater.

 

[ChrisColumbus]

As far a substrate just remember what goes in must come out some day, I would put as little as possible after you add live rock or none. Live sand is not necessary. Dry and soak in ro/di for a couple of days.

Thanks for all the info. So curious what you mean by this "what goes in must come out some day"?

 

[smb2415]

True, you will be "replacing" the heat transferred however in my case the hot water in my tank goes largely unused and with this system I gain the benefit of having almost constant hot water at each tap without wasting or waiting. Depending upon your setup the closed loop could be run off the boiler. In my case a min 2000W in electric heat proved more expensive than the recirc setup.

 

[ChrisColumbus]

You do not need a refugium with carbon dosing.

Can you elaborate on this? not sure I understand. Thanks.

 

[ChrisColumbus]

True, you will be "replacing" the heat transferred however in my case the hot water in my tank goes largely unused and with this system I gain the benefit of having almost constant hot water at each tap without wasting or waiting. Depending upon your setup the closed loop could be run off the boiler. In my case a min 2000W in electric heat proved more expensive than the recirc setup.

Yeah when you put it that way it makes sense. I always figured the basement life support room would be great to help dump heat and hopefully eliminate the need for a chiller...I haven't thought too much about the heat factor especially in winter. The basement is pretty consistent around 60...good for summer cooling...but when the room temp is in the mid 60s upstairs in the winter that's really going to take some heat to keep the tank temp up:crazy1:

 

[smb2415]

"As far a substrate just remember what goes in must come out some day,"

I believe what tooth man was referring to is what some consider mature tank syndrome = the over accumulation of detritus and phosphates in the sand bed over time. There is a school of thought which says it must be replaced after xxx period of time (usually years).

 

[ChrisColumbus]

So here's the foundation for the aquarium. If you have the chance, why not go overkill? That's pretty much my style in life.

 

[toothman]

It just is not necessary to use a refugium with carbon dosing, you get enough bacterial effect with out. I have tinkered for years with different products, refugium with a ton of chaeto, ca reactor, kalk reactor, bio pellet reactor all of which are on my shelf not in use. My personal conclusion is bare bottom carbon dosing is the most effective way to keep corals. you never have to worry about high phosphates, nitrate and detritus in your substrate. I think gravel looks better but it usually fails at some point. With carbon dosing you can feed your tank 2x as much food with out raising unwanted nutrients. I use zeovit basic 4 and faunna marin supplements in the three part dosing ca, kh and mg.

Extreme water flow is also very helpful, I just did the math and my tank has 75x, that is a lot of flow for a 400 gallon tank. I thought I would add a couple of show off pictures taken this month. These are just simple photos with my I phone camera.<a href="http://s382.photobucket.com/user/eralff/media/photo17.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo268/eralff/photo17.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo photo17.jpg"/></a><a href="http://s382.photobucket.com/user/eralff/media/photo18.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo268/eralff/photo18.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo photo18.jpg"/></a<a href="http://s382.photobucket.com/user/eralff/media/6517111e-4dd4-4880-acbd-8eb255335c76.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo268/eralff/6517111e-4dd4-4880-acbd-8eb255335c76.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 6517111e-4dd4-4880-acbd-8eb255335c76.jpg"/></a>

 

[toothman]

Did not realize you were in phila, you can stop at my house if you want to look at my set up.

 

[Alex T.]

Did not realize you were in phila, you can stop at my house if you want to look at my set up.

Hell, I'd drive from 60 miles away here in South Jersey to take a look at your tank.:lolspin:

 

[ChrisColumbus]

It just is not necessary to use a refugium with carbon dosing, you get enough bacterial effect with out. I have tinkered for years with different products, refugium with a ton of chaeto, ca reactor, kalk reactor, bio pellet reactor all of which are on my shelf not in use. My personal conclusion is bare bottom carbon dosing is the most effective way to keep corals. you never have to worry about high phosphates, nitrate and detritus in your substrate. I think gravel looks better but it usually fails at some point. With carbon dosing you can feed your tank 2x as much food with out raising unwanted nutrients. I use zeovit basic 4 and faunna marin supplements in the three part dosing ca, kh and mg.

Extreme water flow is also very helpful, I just did the math and my tank has 75x, that is a lot of flow for a 400 gallon tank. I thought I would add a couple of show off pictures taken this month. These are just simple photos with my I phone camera.<a href="http://s382.photobucket.com/user/eralff/media/photo17.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo268/eralff/photo17.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo photo17.jpg"/></a><a href="http://s382.photobucket.com/user/eralff/media/photo18.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo268/eralff/photo18.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo photo18.jpg"/></a<a href="http://s382.photobucket.com/user/eralff/media/6517111e-4dd4-4880-acbd-8eb255335c76.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo268/eralff/6517111e-4dd4-4880-acbd-8eb255335c76.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 6517111e-4dd4-4880-acbd-8eb255335c76.jpg"/></a>

Wow! Amazing tank. I need to read up on carbon dosing. I've heard of it but have no real idea how it works.
Not sure if I could live with a bare bottom. I really like the look of sand. I guess the idea is to cover up the bottom with rock and coral and then there's nothing to look at.

 

[ChrisColumbus]

Did not realize you were in phila, you can stop at my house if you want to look at my set up.

Thanks for the offer. I,d love to see your setup and maybe learn a thing or two. PM me if you're serious.

 

[toothman]

pm sent

 

[viggen]

Fwiw I have a 475g tank here in Ohio. Due to allergies we keep the windows shut and ac on all summer long and even with my 3 metal halide fixtures my heaters still kicked an all summer long. I do not have a basement so all my filtration is under the tank and we keep the ac at 72-74 degrees. I would highly doubt that having your filtration in your basement that you will have to worry about a chiller. With all the surface area in your basement of exposed water if anything you will have to worry about keeping it warm especially in the winter like you stated when the upstairs temp is mid 60's.

Skimmer wise I have been going through a similar situation for my tank. Its a 475g fowlr with a heavy bio load (4lg angels, several acantharus tangs etc) and have been doing a lot of reading on what skimmer to get. I was considering the octopus commercial line their 7000 or 8000 however I worry that their skimmers are just thrown together and not actually designed to work. I have been told a few times a sro6000 ext would do the trick but I worry the body is to small for my tank.

Lfs owner prefers reef dynamics due to reliability and excellent design. He stated a more affordable option is the orca line which uses the dart pump as well as a deltec. For me noise is a big concern/issue so I will not use a dart powered skimmer and worry about deltec parts being to difficult to get when they are needed. This is also the reason I am not going to get a bubble king due to parts having to come from a others country as well as from what I see they cost a lot more vs reef dynamics when considering skimmer body size and air draw.

I plan in going with either the reef dynamics xrc750 or xrc1000 as well as a bio pellet reactor. They are not cheap but II like being able to talk to the guy that makes them and also not having to worry about ordering parts from across a ocean.

With the mo60's yes they are slightly noisy, you can hear them ramp up in flow from 20ft away when they are at 100% flow. I use two on my tank with them facing each other at opposing ends. With your tank having 3 viewable sides I personally would not get the mp60's to put on each end of your tank. If you have room across the back of your tank I would put 3-4 across the back be it mp60's turned to half speed max or mp40's at full speed. Or.... Due to having your filtration in your basement I would do a closed loop setup. You could do two dart gold pumps in closed loop with either one or both of them connected to a ocean motions 4way or 8way. That would give you lots of flow, be quieter or similar noise vs mp60's and cost quite a bit less as well. Electricity bill would be a bit more though........

With acrylic vs glass.... Acrylic is quite easy to care for. You must be cautious and not collect any substrate or snails to drag across the tank however with a little caution its not difficult to care for. I also briefly considered glass however like you stated the 3 times plus cost kept me away. I would suggest keeping substrate at a minimum depth and when you build the stand and finish the tank simply cover up the bottom few inches of the tank, maybe a ich or two above the substrate level to eliminate the chance of collecting substrate when using a magnet.

 

[ChrisColumbus]

Viggen thanks for your input. Some great info to consider.

I run a/c pretty much full time from May to October and keep temp in mid to upper 60s so Btn that and basement sump know I won't need a chiller. I do think I'll have my challenges economically heating the tank especially in winter. I need to really think that through. Might consider a closed loop recirc pump from my hot water heater to a heat exchanger in the sump. Not sure if propane for my domestic HWH will cost more or less than a couple thousand watts of electric aquarium heaters.

Glad to hear some positive feedback on the acrylic. Acrylic seams like a four letter word in the reefing world. Acrylic is expensive enough...but man those glass guys are crazy expensive.

Ah yes the MP60s. I've never heard them in person and worry about noise and seeing a pair of headphones on the tank as I look at it from the front. I am trying to stay away from the closed loop scenario for what I perceive as a simpler, less complicated, less maintenance demanding, and more flexible method using the vortech mp's. Interesting idea about 4 across the back. Problem I am facing is I can only use mp60s due to the 1" acrylic thickness of the tank. Nothing smaller can go on a tank this thick. So this means more expensive and then the tank gets pushed out away from the wall even more...unless I can figure a way to frame a niche in the house wall to tuck part of the mp60s into so I can keep the tank closer to the wall.

 

[viggen]

The mp60's need to be accessible due to the motors collecting dust/etc which adds heat to the motors and can cause troubles in the long run. Every month or so you need to take a bottle of compressed air and blow them out.... Thus if the back of the tank is on a wall that's not a option. Amazing how much stuff get collected inside the motor..... correct.... I never remember to clean them out every month, every few months is what I do.

Also keeping the pumps at 1/2 to 3/4 speed max they are silent, its only when they go to full song is when they can be noisy. Sounds like if you want to use the mp60's installing on the end is your only option.

Not sure how much led or t5 lighting is needed for what you want to do but I would at least consider metal halide. Yes the bulbs do need to be replaced every so often and yes they put out heat however that heat can help reduce how much the heaters need to be turned on. If you are able to get the water heater worked out that would be ideal I would think.

A closed loop I would say is less maintenance. Yes installation is a bit more complicated however its still quite simple. Also one of the biggest advantages to acrylic is how easy it is to drill thus very easy to setup a closed loop. I would of gone this direction however I need every inch of space under my tank for my filtration.