So what is this and how do I get rid of it!!??

[JG1]

It's lyngbya (a type of cyano) or a relative of it. I think without microscope or a sample send to an expert, it's impossible to ID correctly. 3 days without light will kill the majority of them (but they might come back if nothing else is outcompeting them for space and nutrient). There are also snails that will eat them. If you are looking to go this route, I would suggest that you talk to John at reefcleaner.org; he should be able to help you. The sea hare that I used to have also eats it. drummereef also had great success with a certain Zeovit products. You might want to PM him for info. Lyngbya seems to be able to thrive in both nutrient rich or poor environment which makes it some what difficult to deal with. Generally speaking, it seems like when our tanks are so devoid with other algae or micro-organisms is when they would take over a tank. When your tank matures, it will get out competed.

Temperature also has a lot to do with it. The higher the temp, the faster it will grow. If possible, I would lower temp a degree or 2.

Good luck JG!

Yeah, I saw over at the zeo forum he used zeozym and biomate. I just happen to have both and began dosing yesterday.

I just set my heaters to come on at 76 instead of 78.

Guess I'll just keep my fingers crossed.

Should I do a lights out period for a few days ya think?

 

[dzhuo]

Should I do a lights out period for a few days ya think?

I think the lights out should be last resort. I did this once and after the lights were back on the 4th day, I could not find a single trace of it at all. However, my case is nowhere near as bad as yours. In my tank, it only grows on the powerhead and the return pipe (and one very small patch near the top of the rock work where flow is the highest). The lights out didn't seem to bother any corals (majority of mind are SPS) but one small tri-color frag did bleached badly and didn't recover. If you have lots of it all over your tank, I would be a little worry when massive die off happen during lights out; I have no idea if they release any toxic (or excess nutrient) when they die. If this were my tank, I would do the following (with preference):

1. Natural control. I would talk to John and get a few snails. Cost is minimum and you will see result the fastest.
2. Try the Zeovit products since you already have it.
3. Lights out if nothing else works.

78F doesn't seem like very high to be honest so I have no idea if 76F would make a difference. In any case, I think the key really is to encourage other algae or micro-organisms to grow so they can outcompete this crap.

 

[JG1]

I think the lights out should be last resort. I did this once and after the lights were back on the 4th day, I could not find a single trace of it at all. However, my case is nowhere near as bad as yours. In my tank, it only grows on the powerhead and the return pipe (and one very small patch near the top of the rock work where flow is the highest). The lights out didn't seem to bother any corals (majority of mind are SPS) but one small tri-color frag did bleached badly and didn't recover. If you have lots of it all over your tank, I would be a little worry when massive die off happen during lights out; I have no idea if they release any toxic (or excess nutrient) when they die. If this were my tank, I would do the following (with preference):

1. Natural control. I would talk to John and get a few snails. Cost is minimum and you will see result the fastest.
2. Try the Zeovit products since you already have it.
3. Lights out if nothing else works.

78F doesn't seem like very high to be honest so I have no idea if 76F would make a difference. In any case, I think the key really is to encourage other algae or micro-organisms to grow so they can outcompete this crap.

Ok thanks. I swear it's always something....

You think the amino acids and coral vitalizer is possibly fueling this crap as well?

Do you know what kind of snails he was recommending for these (just curious before I email him)?

 

[dzhuo]

You think the amino acids and coral vitalizer is possibly fueling this crap as well?

No idea but I guess any type of food could introduce excess nutrient.

Do you know what kind of snails he was recommending for these (just curious before I email him)?

Yup. Here are what John sent me: Dwarf cerith, Florida cerith, nerite, and another type which I have no idea what it's. The most affective is the cerith and this unknown type.

 

[JG1]

No idea but I guess any type of food could introduce excess nutrient.



Yup. Here are what John sent me: Dwarf cerith, Florida cerith, nerite, and another type which I have no idea what it's. The most affective is the cerith and this unknown type.

Thanks. I emailed him a few minutes ago.

A guy in the other forum said he had this same exact crap as I do and Tech-M wiped it out. I think I'll grab a bottle from the LFS tomorrow.

 

[HighlandReefer]

Lyngbya facts and contacts
http://www.derm.qld.gov.au/environm...ts_and_contacts.html#causes_of_lyngbya_blooms

From it:

Basic features

A detached piece of Lyngbya. Picture courtesy of the Marine Botany Group, University of Queensland

Lyngbya is a toxic marine cyanobacterium (blue-green algae). It grows attached to seagrass, seaweed, coral and rocks in clumps or mats of fine, dark cotton wool-like strands 10 to 30 centimetres long. Through the accumulation of gas bubbles, clumps can rise to the surface to form large floating mats. Floating Lyngbya washes up on some beaches, often mixed with seagrass. Generally fish do not swim in areas affected by Lyngbya and tend to leave these areas to find waters that are not affected.


Causes of Lyngbya blooms


Conceptual diagram summarising the current understanding of causes of Lyngbya blooms in Deception Bay. Source: Coastal Algal Bloom Action (SEQHWP, 2008).

Results from the recently completed Lyngbya Research and Management Program 2005–2007 indicate that the key environmental conditions for Lyngbya growth appear to be the presence of bio-available nutrients including iron, phosphorus and nitrogen; dissolved organic matter; and favourable light, salinity and temperature conditions in the environment.

Land uses and management activities that alter groundwater levels and surface water runoff, in association with major rainfall events, result in significant loads of these nutrients transported to coastal waters.

Potential high-risk activities that may increase nutrient loads to the coast are linked to Lyngbya blooms. Examples include certain activities associated with agriculture, forestry, sewage treatment, industry including extraction, and urban development. The disturbance and subsequent oxidation of acid sulfate soils is also of concern, as it leads to the release of nutrients such as iron.

It is thought that blooms in Deception Bay are triggered by high concentrations of nutrients and bio-available iron being discharged into the marine environment from wet-weather surface run-off and some groundwater discharges. In contrast, blooms on the eastern banks are considered to be primarily a result of groundwater discharges or some other forms of environmental disturbance.

 

[HighlandReefer]

Have you been dosing any micro-nutrient supplements that contain iron?

 

[JG1]

Have you been dosing any micro-nutrient supplements that contain iron?

no but I am running GFO.

 

[HighlandReefer]

Lyngbya produces some nasty toxins. I would run GAC to help remove these toxins along with proper water changes. Perhaps changing GAC more often (every two weeks may help here too) Keeping it out of your tank is important.

I don't know if GFO will contribute enough iron to cause problems, but letting the fines escape could be a problem.

 

[HighlandReefer]

One way to tell if GFO is a possible problem would be to switch to lanthanum chloride or aluminum binders, but you need to be aware of possible problems with both of these.

 

[HighlandReefer]

Lyngbya Management Strategy
http://www.derm.qld.gov.au/register/p00540aa.pdf

From it:

POTENTIAL BIOCONTROL AGENTS?
"¢ The herbivorous "˜rabbit fish' has been observed
feeding on Lyngbya both in Moreton Bay and other
parts of the world. A feeding preference trial with
mature Lyngbya showed that Lyngbya is not
preferred, given dietary choice. Separate,
preliminary, Department of Primary Industries cage
trials indicated that given Lyngyba, rabbit fish prefer
new Lyngyba growth versus mature growth.
Lyngbya bloom at Hardy Reef around helicopter
pontoon
Marine Botany, UQ
"¢ Stylocheilus, a mollusc that lives in and feeds upon
Lyngbya, has demonstrated in laboratory trials a
feeding preference for Lyngbya and its rapid
incorporation into biomass. However it will also
graze on other filamentous algal species.
"¢ Biocontrol scoping work is needed, whilst recognising
the need for caution in the assessment of any potential
measures and, in terms of allocation of scarce
research funds, noting there have been few global
successes in biocontrol.

 

[JG1]

Lyngbya produces some nasty toxins. I would run GAC to help remove these toxins along with proper water changes. Perhaps changing GAC more often (every two weeks may help here too) Keeping it out of your tank is important.

I don't know if GFO will contribute enough iron to cause problems, but letting the fines escape could be a problem.

Thanks.

I'm running a dual BRS Rx with 3/4c of HC-GFO in the first chamber, and 2/3c Rox 0.8 carbon in the second chamber. I'll change the Rox maybe weekly.

 

[JG1]

Lyngbya Management Strategy
http://www.derm.qld.gov.au/register/p00540aa.pdf

From it:

POTENTIAL BIOCONTROL AGENTS?
• The herbivorous ‘rabbit fish’ has been observed
feeding on Lyngbya both in Moreton Bay and other
parts of the world. A feeding preference trial with
mature Lyngbya showed that Lyngbya is not
preferred, given dietary choice. Separate,
preliminary, Department of Primary Industries cage
trials indicated that given Lyngyba, rabbit fish prefer
new Lyngyba growth versus mature growth.
Lyngbya bloom at Hardy Reef around helicopter
pontoon
Marine Botany, UQ
• Stylocheilus, a mollusc that lives in and feeds upon
Lyngbya, has demonstrated in laboratory trials a
feeding preference for Lyngbya and its rapid
incorporation into biomass. However it will also
graze on other filamentous algal species.
• Biocontrol scoping work is needed, whilst recognising
the need for caution in the assessment of any potential
measures and, in terms of allocation of scarce
research funds, noting there have been few global
successes in biocontrol.

Interesting. I'd like to try and eradicate the problem instead of just trying to control it through grazers (although I'll take the second option if the first doesn't work)

Do you think the Tech-M is worth a shot?

 

[HighlandReefer]

Increasing the mag level helps for some algae, but I haven't read where it works for any of the cyanobacteria.

Dzhuo's recommendations look good to me along with reducing your dissolved organics using GAC. I would not use any AA, since they increase dissolved organic levels.

If you do decide to use lights out, make sure you remove all this cyano before you do it. When lights out occurs, the vegetative stage of this cyano will break down quickly and release a lot of toxins it produces.

 

[JG1]

What a friggin headache I swear....

 

[HighlandReefer]

Yes these type of pests certainly are frustrating, but with lots of scrubbing, siphoning, running filter bags, running GFO, GAC, vacuuming the sand bed, perhaps reduced temperatures and lighting, you can win.

You need to say no to any detritus in your tank. Spic and span & elbow grease are a major factor.

 

[HighlandReefer]

How do you think you introduced this cyano into your tank? Just curious for future reference.

 

[JG1]

How do you think you introduced this cyano into your tank? Just curious for future reference.

I haven't got a clue. I started the tank with dry rock. Maybe from frags I recieved....I dunno.

 

[HighlandReefer]

Thanks. Unfortunately, problem algae, cyano and other pests are growing rampant thought the worlds reefs, especially where run off & polluted rivers enter near by. Live rock is collected from many of these problematic regions and work their way into our reef tanks. I have seen one local fish store that has this cyano in its tanks, which I refuse to buy from. One reason I recommend quarantining all things added to a reef tank while providing plenty of light and some nutrients for these type of pests to grow.

 

[HighlandReefer]

I might add that cyanobacteria do produce spore stages which may last for extremely long periods of time even when completely dry and frozen. Also bleach may not effect some of these spore stages (as well as acids used to remove phosphate and heavy metals). Bacteria and cyanobacteria are tough.