So you got a new fish tank Newbie

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JohnM99 said:
How about this one - on the way to the LFS stop at the ATM, get a wad of cash, and pay for your new whatever from the LFS say 70% in cash, the rest on Visa and when she sees the statement you will agree with her "that was a pretty good deal!".
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I don't know John. If your wife is also into medical imaging she may see right through it. :D

I know some of you out there don't really read the links I give you. At least that is what my CIA and NSA operatives tell me when they are not reporting on all the WMD's that such and such a dictator has.:D

I did want to bring up a quote from one of the above articles-
Originally from the RC article by Doug WojtczaK Lighting the Reef Tank
I have personally used all of the above Kelvin bulbs with the following results:

The 6500 Kevin bulbs have given me the greatest coral growth in SPS, LPS placed lower in the tank and even soft corals. The color of the 6500-Kelvin bulbs when supplemented with actinic VHO tubes produces a crisp white appearance. For those seeking the greatest growth rates from SPS corals, I would recommend this color bulb.

The 10000-Kelvin bulbs also achieve good growth rates, albeit slower than the 6500-Kelvin bulbs. Their appearance is white with a slight blue tint when used with actinic supplementation. Bulbs of this color have produced excellent growth with soft corals and LPS in my own tanks along with slower paced SPS growth. I would recommend this bulb for a mixed reef environment.

The 20000-Kelvin bulb is very blue and brings out all of the fluorescent pigments in many corals. While they are visually appealing, the growth rate of my SPS corals came to a complete standstill while using them. I feel that these bulbs are well suited for a tank that simulates a deeper reef environment with LPS and soft corals but from my own experience, I do not feel that they are the best choice for high light SPS and clams. One note about the 20000-Kelvin lamps: in order to get the best intensity and color from these bulbs, they require a special HQI ballast for them to be driven as intended. This ballast is similar to the standard metal halide ballast, but includes a special starter to fire the lamp.
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This is a very good point. On choosing any lighting system it is important to try to get a broad spectrum of color tempertures. Pushing too high a K value, while maybe pleasing to the eye, can cause problems by omitting higher wavelength light.

Doug also says one should spurn using the old watt per gallon rule. The rule is surely not scientific but no one ever seems to offer a better solution that is simple for the beginner to understand. You should keep in mind that that 4-6 watt per gallon for a tank minimum is for tanks in the 18"-30" range. The same goes for the 8+ wpg suggested for SPS, clams and anemones. Taller tanks will require higher wattages.

OK, OK! So you know that 1/683rd of a watt over a square meter is a Lux but how many Lux in a bagel smarty pants?

Is also .0929 foot-candles, which is a pretty puny birthday cake. :)

Someone also asked if there where dimmable MH lights. There have been rumors afloat that they are soon to be available. I'm just not sure how they would work. Where a fluorescent emits light from the phosphors a MH produces light by heating the filler gas to incandesence. It does so by emitting an arc discharge, through the gas, across the internal filaments. If you lower the current the gas will become cooler and the K value will decrease. Lower it enough and the internal resistance will increase to the point where the bulb goes out. Don't you love it when I talk technical?:rolleyes:

The bottom line is I'm not sure how they will manage to make dimmable MH but the wonders of science never cease to amaze me.

I also failed to mention moonlights. The really "with it" reefers are always looking for ways to improve the natural function of their tanks and empty their wallets. Moon lighting is one such innovation.

The idea here is to simulate the moon over the reef. A dim light is used over the tank and, if you want to really be realistic, is illuminated in a fashion that simulates the phases of the moon. One of the claims is that this will cause their corals to go sexual and have a once a year breeding frenzy.

Having a tank filled with millions of gametes by horny coral is not an event I relish, at least in my opinion. Two things will happen. One--you have corals all over the place in no time flat. Two--and the most likely, you'll have a major ammonia spike after the orgy. Neither to me is a desirable event. But, to each his own.

Of course, things change and your may want to hold off for the wave of the future before getting lights Future Lights :p

Well I think I've about worn out lighting. Judging by JohnM's posts everyone wants critters and wants them now!!! I have no idea why someone would wish to pollute perfectly good tank water with fish and inverts but I guess I'll take a look at it next.
 
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but isn't watts per gallon quite indirect? Talking about the wattage of a light is like talking about how many gallons of gas your car burns per hour - not how many miles it makes you go. What we are actually interested in is how many lumens of useful light are delivered, not really in how many watts you had to burn up to generate them?

So a T5 light will deliver more lumens per watt than a power compact - you get both more light actually delivered, but also more for your money. (which you can then hide and spend at the LFS).

Oh, and yes please, bring on the Critters!
 
JohnM99 said:
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but isn't watts per gallon quite indirect? What we are actually interested in is how many lumens of useful light are delivered, not really in how many watts you had to burn up to generate them?
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That's for sure John. The watts per gallon is only a general rule for those that only know that PAR is what you try to break on the golf course. Since this is a newbie thread, I try not to complicate it with too much weird science:D

For most of the newbie readers we are not talking about massive tanks (200 gallons+). Following the general rule of x watts per gallon will get them started without needing to take a course in physics. For those that want the most bang for the buck (or those that start out with massive tanks) it is a good idea to hang out on the Lighting Forum and get the latest lowdown on what's up.

I was kidding earlier when I did the table thing. However, even comprehensive (real) lighting tables tend to become outdated very shortly after they are published. Improvements in phosphors and in fill gasses for MH change the total lumens and overall K values of many lamps used in the trade. Fortunately we have people like NY Joe, who seems to have endless research funds, who try to produce threads that are up to date. Just a year of two ago PC was all the rage. Now it is T5. A year from now it may indeed be LED. Advancement in this hobby is pretty swift.

I encourage anyone with a big tank or that wants to get the most light for the least money to explore both RC and the www for the latest data on lighting. It can save a fossil....fuel. :smokin:

Now about that Sphyrna zygaena you Newbies are just dying to add to your new tank....:rollface:
 
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Actually I would like to have a Sphyrna zygaena . If all the 9000 + people that have read this thread would send me around $200 a piece I could fulfill my dream.
:fish2:

As John has been hinting, by this time your tank should have all the basics in place and be well past the cycle. At least I hope so since I started this thread back in September. It is about time that you add some livestock.

First off, please, PLEASE don't send me lists of fish and corals you want in your tank. I'm not a marine biologist and I don't know the Latin name and breeding habits of every critter in the sea. You want ot send those lists to the expert droids, Eric Borneman, Ron Shimek and Frank Marini. These droids know everything that has ever swam, crawled or slithered about in the ocean and will probably kill me for telling all you Newbies to PM them with fish wish lists.:mad2:

Most new reefers acquire a "clean up crew" as soon as ammonia levels reach zero. Usually this is snails, hermit crabs and perhaps a sea cucumber. Snails are the most common addition and the safest to add. When adding snails you want about one for each gallon of tank volume. Try to mix the types you add. There are all sorts of claims on which snail is best so variety covers the bases. Hermit crabs get mixed reviews. Doc Ron feels they may be too good at their job removing beneficial critters from you sand bed. I have hermits and seem to have a good stable DSB with lots of pods. Hermits are not mandatory so make your own decision. Sea cukes are sand processors. They stir the bed and eat the sand. Well, they really don't eat sand but run it through their gut and consume the biological growth attached to it. I've never had one but it would seem this removal of the critters in the bed may be harmful. If you get one I'd keep it to just one. The critters in your bed do repopulate fairly quickly and probably can withstand a single cuke.

I don't have a lot of time today but I'll continue this new part of the thread over the next week or so.

I know--it has taken 5 months to get here but we always say on RC that patience is a virtue.
 
Mr Waterkeeper, all along I thought you were writing this for the love of us newbies only to find your need for a hammerhead. Oh well, send me your address. The education I've received will more than make it up. (how about $150.00 - live rock ain't cheap)
Thanks
 
Slatts said:
(how about $150.00 - live rock ain't cheap)
Thanks
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I know, I know---and to keep that hammerhead I figure I need about 200,000 lbs of it for the tank. Of course, if I also get a really cool Manta birostris I'll need a lot more than that. :D

John,

Q tells me the portable SCUBA tank is only good for 4 minutes so I'll need something larger for tank cleaning.
 
Tom - (or others)

Thanks for your time. I ended up buying the same tank I PM'd you about in 120 gal instead of 150 (4ft vs 5ft) due to where I'm putting it.

Few questions:
1) Would you get a royal blue background or black? It's my choice. Wondered what the general opinion was...

2) I'm reading this thread. I'm studying, I'm following, I'm stuck. You (Tom) mentioned powerheads but never suggested size. So what do you recommend for the 120 gal?

3) I never saw anything about pumps. What size, how many, what gph they should have. Assuming a sump underneath. Again help a boy with a 120 gal.

Thanks again for an awesome thread!
 
Newbie Questions

Newbie Questions

I currently have a FOWLR 105g tank with a 35g sump. It was given to me by a friend (?);) and I've since been scrambling to get every bit of info I can.

My tank seems to be quite stable with the following parameters:
PH: 8.3-8.5
Ammonia: 0
Nitrites:0
Nitrates: 0-10
Sg: 1.022
Temp: 79.9

Known Inhabitants: 1 Hawiian Black Trigger, 1 Lunar Wrasse, 1 Giant Hermit Crab, 1 Emerald Crab, Numerous small hermit crabs, 1 Un-Identified hairy crab.

I am currently trying to increase my coraline algae growth by adding a weekly dose of Calcium and a Buffer to steady the PH.

Questions:
1) Flow rate, how do I calculate this? What would be an appropriate flow rate for a tank this size?
2) Oxygen levels, how do I test for this? How can I improve my Oxygen levels (or decrease them, if that would ever be necessary)?
3) Alkalinity is this something I need to worry about with a FOWLR? How do I test for it? How do I 'control' the level?

Thanks for your input, and for all the detailed info! Great job!
 
Hi thewuf
<img src="/images/welcome.gif" width="500" height="62"><br><b><i><big><big>To Reef Central</b></i></big></big>

Both you and Emma have similar questions, well except for the interior decorating thing. :D Choose whichever color you like for the background. Black backgrounds do let your fish and coral stand out during photo ops.

79.9 degrees huh Emma? I can see you like to get down to the real nitty gritty. :)

Circulation is somewhat more important for coral and other inverts than for a FO. The general rule for a true reef is to have a minimum circulation rate of at least 10X the volume of the main tank. In a FO I'd shoot for at least 5X to allow for proper biological filtration. There is nothing wrong with having higher flow rates and may people do.

Power heads can be used on a smaller tank without a sump to provide circulation. In a tank with sump they are used to provide additional circulation for high flow critters and to get water movement in the tank's dead spots. The sizing depends on what critters you keep.

Coralline is not a fast growing algae. Keeping the Calcium and alkalinity at NSW levels. does help promote its growth. If you see it growing on the seams of the tank (it really loves to grow on silicone) then you are in good shape. Emma you do need to worry about alkalinity even in a FO tank. The alkalinity provides buffering that keeps the pH stable. Test kits are usually of the drop titration type. You add an indicator to a tank water sample and add a weak acid drop-wise until the color changes. By counting the number of drops used you can calculate the alkalinity. Here is some stuff from Doc Randy, our chemistry droid on the subject Alkalinity Adjustment

I really don't know of any good oxygen test kits. The reagents used in the "wet" chemistry method are too dangerous for use in home testing. Meters are preferred but prices start around $450. In most cases if you follow the circulation rules I mentioned above you will be OK on oxygen. In a FO, like yours, the fish gulping air at the surface usually indicates a problem.

Here is the RC headloss calculator used to size sump pumps Headloss Calc

And a two part pump article-
Aquarium Water Pumps
Pumps Part 2

That should get you the pump you need.
 
Hi WK, great thread, learnt more here that i did in all my years at school ;)

I have a quickie question if you dont mind.
I have just brought a 100g tank with a fluval 404, unfortunatly i neither have the room for a sump,nor will the misses let me buy "another bloody tank" i am looking at keeping just fish and LR and was going to add a powerhead to the setup for more water movement, if i take all the media out of the 404 and just just it to circulate the water along with the powerhead, would this be enough? also would i be able to get by for the next few months without a skimmer? as its gonna take me that long to amount that much hidden money ;)

Thanks in advance

And remember

Stay on target ;)
 
Hi Oakley
<img src="/images/welcome.gif" width="500" height="62"><br><b><i><big><big>To Reef Central</b></i></big></big>

First I made a little mistake in the last post. Rex's article on pumps is in three parts so here is the final piece Pumps Part 3

I hope that makes all you Newbies quit squawking about this thread running into its fifth month. Rex took three months just to talk about pumps and I've covered about a dozen topics so far. :D

Back to your question Oakley,

You pretty much answered it yourself. In the FO tank you are not faced with the problem of uniform circulation throughout the tank as you are with a full blown reef. You also don't need as high a circulation rate. Using the Fluval, sans media, is a good way to provide circulation when you don't have a sump. Later, when you get the Ã"šÃ‚£, (anyone who uses the word bloody uses pounds ;)) you can add a hang-on type skimmer that will also provide additional circulation. A powerhead or two hidden behind the rock work may also help.

Good luck getting the gang down at the Pub to donate to your cause. :)
 
Thanks WK :) yep you are right its the "bloody Pound" over here ;)

I had to give up smoking to be able to justyfy the spend each week to the misses, ah well gotten over the worse of it now, 3 weeks and counting :)

Now to my :( As myself and my friends were struggling to get the tank into my apartment the top piece of glass (that we had thought was secured) fell and cracked one end of the tank :(
Gonna have to wait 2 more weeks before the insurance will replace :(

Can i be cheeky and ask one more question .......?

In England i cannot find anywhere that sells Argonite sand, or if they do, its not on the label, i have tried the vinigar trick and none of the sand fizzes :(
so my question, would the washed sand that lfs sell be fine for my DSB (its the finest one that they sell) then i would add the LS to the top, does that sound ok? its Ã"šÃ‚£14 per 25kg think thats about $20 per 50lb?

Thanks again, you make learning fun :)
shame i didnt have teachers like you when i was in school, i may have enjoyed it then.
 
Tom,

Are you getting tired of all these questions? Hope not because I have one more.

You mentioned a long way back in this thread about having a DSB. However, I could not find anything about maintaining it. I have about 4 inches of sand that is somewhere in between sugar and cat litter in size. I have never seen anything "live" in it, but hope to find something in there someday. Even at night with a red lense, i can not find anything moving around.

I also had been reading other threads on DSB and hear they have to be maintained. What do I need to do? I was told not to vacuum it, even though last week I accidently touched the bottom and tons of brown water went in my siphon.

I was thinking of taking about 2 inches off to put in my sump to make a refuge. Would you do this or leave as is and buy more for the fuge?

Is that to many questions in one reply? Sorry if it is!

John
 
Here is a picture of my poor tank :(

ouch.JPG
 
Oh Nooo Oakley!!!:eek:

That is one bloody hell of a way for a new bloke to enter this hobby. Cracking the old tank is really a pain in the bum.:(

Seems we have the ever-popular DSB questions again. The Southdown (now called Old Castle Tropical Play Sand) is kind of a states type thing and I doubt you'll find it on your side of the pond, Oakley. As I said, I prefer aragonite but it is not mandatory. A fine quartz sand will do in a pinch. What you want is a very fine, smaller than granular sugar, type sand. Having a diverse range of sizes is best. Indeed, use it as a base and seed it with as much LS as your budget allows.

If I was a teacher in England the Queen would have had me beheaded by now. :D

John,

My own feeling is to not to disturb the bed. It takes some time for the various zones in the bed to establish themselves and stirring up the bed disrupts this process.

The brown goop (detritus) is normal in the bed. The bacteria in the bed are constantly feeding on this material and it tends to reach a certain level then stabilize as its consumption matches its production. It is this continuing process of accumulation then breakdown of organic material in the bed that comprises biological filtration.

You may wish to obtain some new LS if you don't see much nighttime activity in the bed. Another option is to buy a detriovore kit. These supply worms, microstarfish and copepods to seed the bed.

When removing sand to seed a new system it is best to take a section all the way to the tank bottom rather than skim off the top layer. The top layer is the most biologically active and the most important part of the bed. Removal of a large portion of the surface may cause some problems in the filtration process. Take a piece of plastic and press it down into the bed to form a partition. Remove the sand on one side of it and replace with the new sand. That new sand will soon become active without disrupting the entire beds biological function. I would try to limit the harvest to no more than about 25-30% of the total bed at any one time. You also want to allow 4-6 weeks before havesting any bed material again.
 
Thanks, Tom

You really are a man of knowledge. Sorry, but one more for you. I have looked on the interenet for detriovore kits and had no luck. Do you know a good place to get one?

thanks

John (trying to get out of beginner status) Radcliff
 
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