Tank Bred vs. Captive Bred vs. Wild Caught

[gtstylez87]

the under lying cause is TCM. Its been proven there is no medical benefit of eating seahorses. if they stopped using them the population would be able to reach a stable number. i got mine for a friend that captive bred them. she got hers for seahorsesource. now there the messed up part she can't sell them to a LFS because she doesnt have a aquaculture license. so she is stuck with a bunch of them. lucky she release then back into the wild. now before i get anger replies about non-native introduction and diseases, they are erectus and they are native to florida and she introduces them right after they are born. the hobby if anything helps seahorses by spreading awareness about their decline, but more needs so be done about TCM. i work at a pet shop that sells saltwater fish and corals, and when i tell people that its hard to get them in because of TCM they are shocked. also other pet shop dont have knowledgeable employees that can help someone if they are interested in keeping them. most of the customers thinks they are just another fish, and you can put them in with anything. oh yea lol my favorite reply when i tell them that they cant put them in with anything is "well they are in the ocean with the fish" lmfao i tell them well if you got an ocean size tank there should but no problem . just like any other pet everyone should do research about them before they buy one.

also you guys should watch this, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmkXD-KDsCg

 

[loganbug3]

That video was a real eye opener. We definitely need to conserve the seahorses. I've decided to try and breed them so I can relese them. Anyone have some suggestions?

 

[rayjay]

Please DO NOT release any seahorse that has been kept in an aquarium, or, fry from birthing of tank kept seahorses.
You will almost certainly be introducing pathogens acquired in the tanks, to the ocean waters.
It isn't just a case of reintroducing native species which if done, needs to occur under very controlled methods by people trained for doing such a thing.

 

[TamiW]

I just popped in to say the same thing as rayjay. Don't release seahorses or any other fish that has been in an aquarium. Aside from what Rayjay said, its probably illegal. And unless you captured the seahorse yourself from a known location, you have no way of guaranteeing that it is actually the right species from those waters. Programs that try to repopulate wild animals take animals from the same location as broodstock, and if they can't, they search extensively for genetically and geographically similar stock.

Also, releasing into the wild probably isn't going to help much, especially stateside. As big or a bigger threat is habitat loss.

If you really want to help, get involved in or donate to programs that are working to protect seahorses or restore habitat. A few are:
http://counties.cce.cornell.edu/suf...seagrassli/ecology/fauna_flora/seahorses.html
http://www.sosmalaysia.org/home.html
http://www.projectseahorse.com/
http://www.sacf.org.au/projects/36-...conservation-fund/34-seahorses-sydney-harbour

 

[ackee]

I guess I'm fortunate in having an unlimited supply of H. erectus available during the summer and fall. They are found in almost all of NJ's bays and inlets, and in some places are extremely numerous. The most serious threat to their numbers seems to be the rapidly diminishing eel grass beds, which are their primary habitat up here. Last August, I counted 43 in an hour, snorkeling along the margins of a small islet in Barnegat Bay, in about 3 feet of water. I always see them while scuba diving in the inlets. Very powerful currents there are created as the tide moves in and out, but the seahorses cling to anything: musslebeds, old half-buried wooden objects, clam shells, etc. They never stop searching for food, even when the current actually flattens them against the bottom; they still manage to move using their tail, almost crawling, sucking down their prey.

The local H. erectus will eat frozen mysis and similar frozen food within a day. I've seen a few learn to eat strips of fish and shrimp, blasting them into pieces if necessary. They are voracious eaters, and not difficult to feed. They will take frozen food almost immediately. I've kept small colonies alive for more than 3 years, and had them complete egg transfers and produce young many times in a 90 gal aquarium. They will do fine at temps in the mid to high 70s, and are extremely tough. Some contract diseases, but very, very few.

I've stopped collecting and keeping them for several reasons, but I have no doubt that locally caught erectus that have not been subjected to the trauma of wholesale dealers, shipping, pet stores, etc., are hardy, easy to feed aquarium specimens, if given their own lightly stocked aquarium, lots of food, and a clean well designed habitat with very high water quality. The ones I've collected went from the bay to an aerated container, to the aquarium, in the space of a few hours. This undoubtedly contributed to their hardiness.

On another topic, one of the most beautiful things I've seen in shallow seas happened last May in Dominica. A pair of H. reidi (an Atlantic/Caribbean species) were courting, with tails tightly entwined, rising from a rocky bottom in 15 feet of water almost to the surface, then sinking back to the bottom, sometimes still entwined, sometimes swimming close to each other. They did this 5 times that I saw, and seemed to be attempting to position themselves belly to belly to effect an egg transfer, something I've seen many times in my aquaria. I did not stay to watch the reidi because I was disturbing them, so I left. They were not colorful, but were certainly the biggest and most beautiful reidi I've ever seen.

I wish all seahorses well. They are an extremely vulnerable fish, and are being crushed under the steamroller demands of teeming humanity.

 

[gtstylez87]

yea you shouldn't release them into the wild unless they are for sure native to the area. yea you could introduce pathogen into the wild population. this should only be done by VERY WELL SEASONED AQUARIST!!! now just because you have kept them alive and health for a many years and are able to breed them does not make you qualified. any little slip up could wipe hundreds of them out in the wild. when ever a large number of seahorses are breed there and they are kept in close quarters there is always a chance from disease. i have been an aquarist for 13 year and of those 13 i have been currently working in a fish store for the pass 6 year. my job is to treat the new and existing fish with a cocktail of different medicines. i have keep both wild and captive bred. you have to treat WC for numerous parasite and other disease. if it has been put in a tank and you dont need a permit to keep it i have dealt with it. i know how to deworm, deparasite, and treat bacteria, funguses, and viruses in almost ALL species of fish including many different types of seahorses. I would still not attempt to reintroduce them back into the wild with out help from someone who have a lot more experience then even me or a lot more research done on my part. even then i would still seek help from an out side source like a marine biologist or a major aquarium.

 

[TamiW]

yea you shouldn't release them into the wild unless they are for sure native to the area. yea you could introduce pathogen into the wild population. this should only be done by VERY WELL SEASONED AQUARIST!!!

No! They should not be released into the wild by any aquarist, ever, no matter how seasoned or how knowledgeable they may seem. I was horrified to read that you know someone that is doing it. That is a *VERY* *BAD* *THING*. I don't care how many years of experience someone has, and in fact I'd argue if you think it could possibly be a good idea, then you need more experience.

Regardless of the ethical implication; it is illegal to do so in FL. Your friend needs to stop and you really need to stop suggesting it might be okay by any aquarist.

Per Florida Fish and Wildlife:
"This policy does prohibit the release of all broodstock, broodstock progeny (offspring), or wild-born marine organisms collected, maintained, bred, or reared in captivity for commerce aquaculture production purposes."
http://myfwc.com/docs/LicensesPermits/SAL_ReleasePolicy.pdf

 

[DanU]

Whenever man decides to help nature, while the intent is honorable and good, the results are more often than not, not good and often disastrous.

There is some scientific body of evidence to suggest that even the government sponsored fish stocking programs often do more harm than good in that:
1. Propensity of hatchery to out compete native fish
2. The transmission of disease
3. Dilution of gene pools

Contrary to popular belief that captive bred specimens are raised in sterile environments compared to wild specimens, the reality is that they are often exposed to higher concentrations of certain pathogens.

The gene pool issue can be particularly troublesome for seahorses. According to evidence gathered so far, they do not travel great distances. They have a tendency to occupy a relative small geographic area through most of their life. Adding a bunch of captive specimens, assuming they survive, would significantly alter and dilute the gene pool in that area.

I don't know the specific laws regarding release of native species but I do know that Fish & Wildlife are not an easy going happy bunch. They take their job quite seriously and don't hesitate to press charges. I have had the opportunity to sit in a courtroom and watch a few these cases. "I didn't know" and "I didn't mean harm" did not serve them well as a defense.

To give an idea of the seriousness of the issue, just before the hurricanes hit a few years ago, some hatcheries on the water fronts moved their brood stock to a protected area and chlorinated their systems to kill all the growout to prevent accidental release from storm damage. This may seem extreme but it is cheaper that paying the fines if there was a release.

Dan

 

[gtstylez87]

ok you that the wrong way and i should have been a little more specific knowing how some people are. aquarist is a general term for someone who keeps and breeds fish. just like how athlete can be use for some who plays and competes in sports. just because i call someone an athlete doesn't mean that they play for a major league. for instance, someone who works at a major aquarium like "miami seaquarium" or "monterey bay aquarium" those people are called aquarist. i'm saying that *ONLY* people under the watch of a marine biologist or a major aquarium should try to do this. now to that guy that want to loganbug3 DONT DO IT! if you want to help contact your local aquarium or a marine biologist. some of them specialize in Syngnathidae. there are breed programs that are trying to release captive bred thats all im trying to say. im going to post 2 links so you can read more about it. now about my friend that did that, she had no room for another batch and they would have died if she didnt release. they would have got sucked up into the filter. they where release an hour after birth. yea she shouldn't have done it but she did. she tried to get rid of one of the old batch but no one would take them. it was between letting them die or releasing them. i talked to one of the marine biologist i know and he said the chances of introducing disease are slim to none but AGAIN YOU SHOULDN'T RELEASE THEM. you could kind of look at it like a seahorse abortion. she doesn't breed much anymore because of this, and this way a one time thing. i should have said that in the first post MY BAD on my behalf. also I WOULD NEVER SUGGEST THAT ANY AQUARIST DO THIS. i was just trying to use my own amount of experience as an example of why someone no matter how qualified they think they are SHOULD NOT DO IT.

the links... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthnews/3314364/Captive-born-seahorses-released-into-wild.html

http://www.fusedjaw.com/about/seahorses/

 

[loganbug3]

Sorry, didn't realize that. Cancel the release part. Thanks for stopping me!

 

[loganbug3]

Sorry, did not realize that. Cancel the release part. Thanks for stopping me!