Tank Build Ideas

[bohlke]

Jon, I looked at the aqua silencer but not sure how it would work externally, if at all. Sounds like people have had good results with external dursos though.

Sorry my post was a bit confusing the aqua silencer was on the lifereef, that made it noisy instead of sounding like a loud toilet flush every two minutes or so. Its an improvement but in no way as quiet as the megaflows.

 

[bohlke]

How much head height do you have, Ben? I always liked Eheim's for smaller tanks, they are whisper silent, and very dependable (I still have one that works from before the Berlin Wall came down -- says "Made in WEST GERMANY").

I'm also envious of all these fancy renderings. Seems everybody is using them these days.

Cant say enough good things about the Eheim's and I always underestimate the amount of water they can move.

 

[lvpd186]

Just a thought but have you considered just running one of the overflows in to the refuge? That's what I have now and it seems to work pretty well. The reason behind it was to provide nutrient rich water to the refuge, instead of having everything go through the skimmer first.

 

[BennyFrank]

Alan: Thanks for doing the legwork on the drain sizes. Looks like I was off about .25" on my numbers. Do you know if that calculator is based on the drain inlet being at the base of the tank or near the top? I would assume gph would increase with the depth of the drain due to the pressure from the weight of the water column above it. Good call on the fuge draining directly into the return, I will mess around with the configuration and see what I can come up with.

Brad: Yeah I did think about having one of the drains drain directly into the fuge. Everything I've read says to not restrict a drain w/ a valve though and I'd like to be able to adjust the flow through the fuge. Maybe an option would be to T off one drain to the fuge (put a ball valve on the section to the fuge) and have the other end of the T go into the skimmer section. This way, if the other drain clogs the reserve should still be able to handle the entire flow.

One more question; If Alan's estimation of ~900gph is accurate, I'm thinking that may be a little too much flow (30X the display volume:eek1. I'm assuming that the realized drain rate depends on the capacity of the return pump (water can only drain as fast as it is replaced to the display). Do any problems arise when the the return pump is significantly underrated when compared to the drain capacity (ie. ~500gph return < ~900pgh drain)?

Again, thanks for the feedback everyone! Plumbing will be the hardest thing to change if I screw it up, so I want to make sure I've done my due diligence before I get too far into it.

 

[alanmorehead]

Alan: Thanks for doing the legwork on the drain sizes. Looks like I was off about .25" on my numbers. Do you know if that calculator is based on the drain inlet being at the base of the tank or near the top? I would assume gph would increase with the depth of the drain due to the pressure from the weight of the water column above it. Good call on the fuge draining directly into the return, I will mess around with the configuration and see what I can come up with.

One more question; If Alan's estimation of ~900gph is accurate, I'm thinking that may be a little too much flow (30X the display volume:eek1. I'm assuming that the realized drain rate depends on the capacity of the return pump (water can only drain as fast as it is replaced to the display). Do any problems arise when the the return pump is significantly underrated when compared to the drain capacity (ie. ~500gph return < ~900pgh drain)?

Np, I've done them in the past a few times and have used that calculator quite a bit. I'm not sure what formula they use or how much it varies with different heights. Either way, it's probably not going to matter a whole lot and the estimations should be good enough. I mentioned that Eheim pump as a starting point, since 250gph should be adequate for sump flow. A pair of 1" bulkheads should allow plenty of extra flow and redundancy (if not 3/4"). I don't think there are any major issues with oversized drains. Brad made a good point about working with larger PVC, but for 1" it probably won't matter much.

 

[lvpd186]

I've always thought having slower flow through the sump is better so I would say there isn't any problems with using an under-rated return pump. (as in under-rated compared to the amount of flow the overflow can handle)

 

[BennyFrank]

Evil's Par38 LED

Evil's Par38 LED

Anyone have an opinion on these?

http://www.nanotuners.com/product_info.php?products_id=623

Upfront cost for (3) of these would be very close to the Tek 24" 4x24 T5H0 fixture that, as of now, is the front runner for what I'm going with for lighting. But when you figure in the costs for bulb replacements for the T5s over 5 years = $500 and for the LEDs = $0, these LEDs start to look pretty good. They would also operate at a fraction of T5s energy consumption and heat production and would give the "shimmer" effect and a more natural look imo.

I don't know, the more I read about them, the more I'm considering it. They are fairly new though ~6mos. and haven't really been time tested. Below is some light reading (pun fully intended) if you're interested.

The almighty "creator":
http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=169131&st=400

Review and PAR analysis:
http://glassbox-design.com/2009/led-spotlight-nano-customs-par38/
http://glassbox-design.com/2010/par-spread-nanocustoms-par38-led-spotlight/

Deconstruction and discussion:
http://************.com/2009/12/02/par-38-led-spotlight-bears-guts-uncensored-teardown/
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1746535&highlight=evil+s+par38

Beeker's 200gal DD :
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1805886&highlight=evil+s+par38

 

[alanmorehead]

Anyone have an opinion on these?

http://www.nanotuners.com/product_info.php?products_id=623

Upfront cost for (3) of these would be very close to the Tek 24" 4x24 T5H0 fixture that, as of now, is the front runner for what I'm going with for lighting. But when you figure in the costs for bulb replacements for the T5s over 5 years = $500 and for the LEDs = $0, these LEDs start to look pretty good. They would also operate at a fraction of T5s energy consumption and heat production and would give the "shimmer" effect and a more natural look imo.

I don't know, the more I read about them, the more I'm considering it. They are fairly new though ~6mos. and haven't really been time tested. Below is some light reading (pun fully intended) if you're interested.

The almighty "creator":
http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=169131&st=400

Review and PAR analysis:
http://glassbox-design.com/2009/led-spotlight-nano-customs-par38/
http://glassbox-design.com/2010/par-spread-nanocustoms-par38-led-spotlight/

Deconstruction and discussion:
http://************.com/2009/12/02/par-38-led-spotlight-bears-guts-uncensored-teardown/
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1746535&highlight=evil+s+par38

Beeker's 200gal DD :
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1805886&highlight=evil+s+par38

I think they had these at ReefStock in Denver last month. I've never seriously considered LEDs on any of my setups. Compared to T5s and MHs, it has always been cost prohibitive and too many unknowns. The long-term savings is where the LEDs make up ground, but the technology is still changing pretty fast. A nano or smaller tank like yours would be the best one to try it on though. The reduced heat, electricity savings ($10/yr?), shimmer effect, and potential lamp-replacement savings are pretty enticing. You could probably stretch out your lamp life on the t5s to over a year (18 mo?), especially if you're running a softy-based system and spec-driven lamps. However, there's still a lot of potential for savings on the LEDs even with that. I would definitely be interested in seeing the results with the LEDs if you decide to go with them. I'm following the Beeker 200DD thread now too.

 

[BennyFrank]

$10/yr?... retirement here I come!

It seems like there are new threads popping up everyday with people using these and other LEDs as their primary lighting source, but none that are more than a few weeks/months old. More than likely I will just get evertyhing else setup and hold off on upgrading the lighting (my PC bulbs are fairly new) and let my tank cycle for a few months. That way I can at least see some preliminary results and make a more informed decision.

 

[jd474]

Hey Ben, if you're interested, I built an LED light for a 10 G for one of the zoo kid's projects. It was a 6 bulb (CREE LEDs), 18 W (I think), fixture that produced zero heat, and enough PAR to keep tridacna and SPS. Total build cost was around $130, if I remember right. Like Alan mentioned, on a small tank, it is a good option, and they do look really cool. I would think 18 - 24 LEDs would be plenty, and wouldn't break the bank. Even if you "only" get 25 000 hrs. instead of 50 000 hrs of lamp life, I think that's still pretty good. The light itself is easy to build, it's just finding a nice way to wrap the unit, can be the hardest part. Maybe Brad can get you a fancy clear acrylic casing fabbed for it?? That would look SWEEEEET. Just an option, though.

 

[BennyFrank]

Yeah I would love to hear more about that jd. If you feel like posting some of the details here, feel free, as I'm sure others could learn from what you did also. If not, I may be PMing/emailing you in the near future with some questions if that's alright.

 

[bohlke]

Did you see this build?

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1790422

I mean its Ching so of course its fantastic.

 

[BennyFrank]

Did you see this build?

Yeah I've been watching that one since the beginning. Can't really use it as an example for the efficacy of LED's though as I'm confident Chingchai could grow coral in lake water under incandescents.

Finding his other thread was the the first time I had ever been on Reef Central (someone linked to it from linoma) and is solely responsible for me taking this hobby more seriously. I don't care to think of how many pages of build threads I've clicked through since then...:crazy1:

 

[BennyFrank]

Drain bulkheads:

Any opinions on (thread x slip) vs. (slip x slip) vs. (thread vs. thread) vs. etc....

I plan on hard plumbing everything so really don't see why it would matter as long as I get the corresponding fitting to go off of it. It might be nice to have slip on the inside of the tank to make it easier to adjust the water level with the inverted elbow drain intakes.

I'm guessing there is a slightly higher chance of leakage using thread on the outside vs. slip. But it would be nice to be able to reuse the bulkhead if I ever needed to and not glue directly into it.

Thoughts?

 

[jd474]

If you use silicone on the threaded parts (not teflon tape, and just the male end), it won't leak. I prefer slip fittings whenever possible, however, cutting them out when you tear the tank down provides a good chance to crack a smaller tank (either sawzall or PVC cutters). I'm speaking from experience, here . You'll still need a union somewhere so you can physically unscrew your drain from the bulkhead. Also, remember to support any piping, so you don't run the risk of cracking the glass (pipe clamps, zip ties, etc.)

 

[lvpd186]

If you use silicone on the threaded parts (not teflon tape, and just the male end), it won't leak. I prefer slip fittings whenever possible, however, cutting them out when you tear the tank down provides a good chance to crack a smaller tank (either sawzall or PVC cutters). I'm speaking from experience, here . You'll still need a union somewhere so you can physically unscrew your drain from the bulkhead. Also, remember to support any piping, so you don't run the risk of cracking the glass (pipe clamps, zip ties, etc.)

I agree, silicone will also prevent salt creep on the threaded joints.

 

[BennyFrank]

If you use silicone on the threaded parts (not teflon tape, and just the male end), it won't leak. I prefer slip fittings whenever possible, however, cutting them out when you tear the tank down provides a good chance to crack a smaller tank (either sawzall or PVC cutters). I'm speaking from experience, here . You'll still need a union somewhere so you can physically unscrew your drain from the bulkhead. Also, remember to support any piping, so you don't run the risk of cracking the glass (pipe clamps, zip ties, etc.)

The sawzall inevitably ends up in destruction in one way or another :hammer:... It takes awhile to learn "finesse" with that tool.

So if I choose a slip fitting on the outside of the tank; do I use pvc glue (primer and everything) directly into the bulkhead, or is there a better method?

Why would I need a union on the drain line?.. to make it easier to replace/maintenance the sump in the future?

Again, thanks for all the advice. I want to set up the mechanicals of this system to require minimal maintenance/worry/upgrading over the next 3-5 years. I think I'm over analyzing this build but hopefully the result constitutes the effort. Got the stand done and leveled... my buddy does stone work so I'm waiting on him to do a granite top, but then hopefully the rest of the build will pick up pace a little bit.

 

[jd474]

So if I choose a slip fitting on the outside of the tank; do I use pvc glue (primer and everything) directly into the bulkhead, or is there a better method?

Not that I know of

Why would I need a union on the drain line?.. to make it easier to replace/maintenance the sump in the future?

Only so the drain pipe is physically able to be unscrewed. If your piping won't hit anything unscrewing, then you wouldn't need one.