The Great T5 Reflector Glarathon

[The Grim Reefer]

I think any commercial lighting place will have bulb clipsof some kind. A little too specialized for Ace or Home Depot. How will the clip rust unless the powder coat is damaged, these wont get peppered with sand and rocks, done a little time in the desert myself. My X reflector came with steel clips, maybe they ran out of the plastic or they aren't strong enough for the bigger reflector, dunno. In a pinch the steel with some high temp rustolium paint should hold up for a long time, probablylonger than you'll have the lamps. Did you get the Pics I sent you?.

 

[PRC]

Ok Grim, your drivin me crazy here . I think I reread this post six times looking for numbers. Do you actually have PAR numbers for T5's and you're not telling us what they are? Don't make me come up there to Montana to get them now (Especially not in February). Please tell me you're going to post those numbers, or you already did and I'm just losing my mind in my old age here. I think Sanjay Joshi is testing an Icecap SLR setup but I haven't seen the numbers out anywhere yet. I've been dying to see this stuff for a year and a half now. So what's it gonna cost us? Thanks for doing this work, I for one certainly appreciate it.

 

[horkn]

yeah, i got the pics grim, but have not yet looked at them yet.. maybe yet tonight

rocks and crap wont cip the powdercoat, but the bending of the clips will, possibly....

maybe a rubberized tool handle dip will work better? at least it wont crack...

 

[The Grim Reefer]

Ok Grim, your drivin me crazy here . I think I reread this post six times looking for numbers. Do you actually have PAR numbers for T5's and you're not telling us what they are? Don't make me come up there to Montana to get them now (Especially not in February). .

Yeah I got the numbers, if you come to get em you better be better armed than me My test area will not be as good as Sanjay's I am sure. I was mainly looking at the differences in the reflectors rather than making hard statements as to the lamp output vs. halides.

This was with a single lamp shooting through 2 panes of glass in addition to the 24" of water. This test I used an actinic lamp. Had the same differences using the sun but I can't for the life of me find the darn numbers from that lamp.

Ice Cap Solid 31 umol

Brand X 29~30

Tek 25~26

The 18" numbers were taken in my 125 with no glass over the center where I tookthe reading from. It was like 54 for Brand X and Ice Cap and 49 for the Tek, that is from memory but I am pretty sure that is right. I will take a reading from the full T5 system but I will have to wait until tomorrow. If you want to know how these stack up against halides measuring the full system is the only good way to do it. I did it before with the glass tops on and it was like 164 but I will get a good reading without the lids on. Will also attempt to get readings at various levels.

You might find the following interesting. It was posted in the Ice Cap forum a couple weeks ago. My underwater readings don't seem to track with his but again, I had the lids on and they needed a good cleaning. My water seems very clear to me. The out of water readings were pretty close.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I just got the PAR meter, and tested my T5's vs PC tonight.

The first set of measurements are out of the water - so water clarity is not a factor. I took the acrylic lens off the PC fixture to help it out a bit (t5's have no lens).

Measurements are from the bottom of the fixtures. This is about 1.5" from the bulbs for the PCs, and 2.25" from the bulbs for T5's.

CustomSeaLife Moon-Lite 4x65 Watt fixture - bulbs 6-8 months old:

0" - 690
1" - 540
2" - 450
3" - 380
4" - 315
5" - 270
6" - 240
8" - 175
12" - 115
16" - 80
20" - 50
24" - 38

Icecap 660, SLR reflectors, 2xBluePlus, 1xGE 6500K, 1xAquablue (all 48") - bulbs 1 month old.

0" - 810
1" - 745
2" - 680
3" - 640
4" - 600
5" - 550
6" - 500
8" - 430
12" - 320
16" - 240
20" - 185
24" - 150

I also took a couple underwater measurements with the T5's. 10" under the water I got 385. 15" under the water (on my sand bed) I got 312. I could not set the probe on anything to keep it level enough to read any other depths with the hood closed, but it is well over 400 a couple inches under.

The meter just came back from Apogee straight to me, so these measurements are definitely legit .

Notice how in the out of water measurements the T5's are double the intensity of the PC's from about 5". This difference is magnified as the distance from bulbs increases.

 

[The Grim Reefer]

yeah, i got the pics grim, but have not yet looked at them yet.. maybe yet tonight

rocks and crap wont cip the powdercoat, but the bending of the clips will, possibly....

maybe a rubberized tool handle dip will work better? at least it wont crack...

Powdercoat shouldn't crack flexing the clips. I played with one a bit and it seems fine. I thought about the rubberized thing but the heat would cause trouble. Thought about laquer (SP?) you work in wood, any of it that can stand hi temp?

 

[highestbid]

Is it fair to compare 6 month old PC bulbs to 1 month old T-5's. I mean PC are only suppose to last about a year so they are middle aged and T-5 some 18 months so ..........

 

[The Grim Reefer]

That point was brought up in that thread. I really threw it in to show the readings from the t5's rather than offering it as a comparison. I assume that month old PC's would have shown better but still been soundly thumped. The difference in life expactancy is a major selling point for T5's anyway.

 

[Aquabucket]

I am one of those who passed on the reflectors alltogethor. Instead my bulbs are packed tightly ~ 6 - 39W bulbs about 1/4" of an apart over a 30G. One drawback is you have to remove several bulbs sometimes to get to one because they are so close togethor.

The light is intense to say the least.

I know this is not as efficent as running the bulbs with the reflectors but I like to run my lights without a splash sheild for more penitraton. The bulbs are about 3" off the water. 4 small DC cooling fans running 24/7 keeps the bulbs cool and dry. Its alot easier wiping the bulbs down than cleaning a reflector. My small end caps had to be water proofed though. Ballasts were wired remotely for easy access and cooling.

I also wanted to experiment with the various type of bulb combos out there and having 6 bulbs instead of 4 with reflectors (which take up more room BTW) gave me more options. I also have 3 light modes instead of 2 and dig the different looks I get throughout the day.

Two T5 bulbs packed in the same area as one with a reflector. Which do you think gives off more light? More spectral options for growth and color?

 

[Deuce67]

After I am done playing with the T6's (I have 4 of them here) I should have some 150 watt halides to compare on the 125. I may be crossing over to the "dark side". I am anxious to see if the fluorescents die as much shollower than halides as people claim. Either way I will try the halides for a while and see how the corals like them. I may be done with T5's.

Your crossing over to the "dark side"! Say it isnt so Grim! Actually I crossed over last week. I took out 4 of my 8 T5 lamps and added 2 150 hqis on a PFO mini pendant and I love it! Are you going de mh? Just like T5s, reflectors on de lamps is also key from what I understand. Even with the glass of my pendant is only 5 inches away from the top of the water, my tank temp is still constant at 78 degrees. You will love em! Try to get the 14kk Phoenix from Reefgeek. There is some rave about them in the sps forum. It may seem a little dim at first but when they fully burn in, nice!

 

[The Grim Reefer]

Yeah, three DE 150's. I'll have to remove the actinics and replace them with something better but I got another of my crazy ideas for that too. Will report on that once I try it but I think I have an idea for a long life actinic.

 

[The Grim Reefer]

Two T5 bulbs packed in the same area as one with a reflector. Which do you think gives off more light? More spectral options for growth and color?

I like more lamps but not at the expense of a reflector. I think 1 lamp with a good reflector will produce at least as much PAR as 2 lamps side by side. A single lamp in front of a flat reflector puts out a little over half as much light as one with a good reflector. When you have the lamps side by side as close together as the hoods with the single reflector, light produced from the upper part of the lamp is sheilded from the tank by the other lamps. I think as long as you have at least 4 lamps you can have a good mix to provide a nice spectrum. Simply using a 50/50 mix of aquablue and blueplus gives a pretty nice color and the blueplus has PAR output that is about equal to that of the sun lamp (aquablue produces the most par). I use a GE 6500K in my mix because I think it makes the yellows and reds look much more natural.

 

[The Grim Reefer]

Ok Grim, your drivin me crazy here . I think I reread this post six times looking for numbers. Do you actually have PAR numbers for T5's and you're not telling us what they are? Don't make me come up there to Montana to get them now (Especially not in February). Please tell me you're going to post those numbers, or you already did and I'm just losing my mind in my old age here. I think Sanjay Joshi is testing an Icecap SLR setup but I haven't seen the numbers out anywhere yet. I've been dying to see this stuff for a year and a half now. So what's it gonna cost us? Thanks for doing this work, I for one certainly appreciate it.

161 PAR reading in the sand. You have to remember this is in a tank with 150 some odd pounds of live rock in it so that could explain the difference in my readings and those in the IC forum.

Also PAR out lamps measuring 3/4 inches away from the lamp

4 month old Aquablue 1085

3 hour old Aquablue 1120

month old GE 6500 1311

Month old D and D Actinic plus 961

The Apogee sensor overestimates the wavelenfth in the Yellow?orange spectrum where the GE lamp has a signifigant spike and underestimates the blue where the Aquablue has its major spike and the majority of it's output. I think these lamps would be very close if measured with a spectrometer. I like the GE because it has a spectrum that is more towards blue than the ATI sun.

 

[PRC]

That's great stuff Grim, keep it coming.
Actually it's not the armaments I'd be worried about, but those vicious beagles. That one looks like a real killer.
I agree on the comparitive testing, I think you'd need to test full setups in air for it to be accurate. Could get pricey.
I actually had thoughts of the dark side this weekend when one of my IC 660's died on me. Troubleshooting with six retrofit T5's is way more of a pain than I'd think it would be with three 250DE MH's. Those endcaps are definitely not what you'd call user friendly. Now if I can just get Icecap service to return my call...

 

[The Grim Reefer]

What you have to watch out for is my attack Cockatoo.

I did fire up a T6 atinic on a normal ballast. Pretty impressive for being driven at less than half the watts it should have. I guess I am going to hotwire a lamp to an ice cap, Endcaps, we don't need no stinking endcaps.

Oh, my will is in the top drawer of the computer desk should anybody ask

 

[PRC]

Attack Cockatoo, now that's a scary thought...

I hear the power connector sockets from computer power supplies (they call them something, starts with "m" I think?) fit fluorescent pins nicely. A little heat shrink and you can actually make some decent waterproof low-profile "endcaps".

This has Mad Scientist written all over it. Guess I should put some sort of disclaimer in here in case you blow something up. Oh well.

 

[lrsafari]

Not sure about making my own endcaps.....

But the computer connectors (I seem to remember) are called: "Mogul".

Scott

 

[sjm817]

Think it's "Molex".

Grim, be careful...we need you! :eek1:

 

[lrsafari]

Thank you......molex is correct. Mogul is a different type of socket, if I remeber correct. Automotive maybe?

Quietly going back to work...

 

[horkn]

yep, molex is what you are speaking of...


grim, all the enamels i have access to are not flexible at all...

i really thinkt he tool dip stuff would work. the t5 hos dont get that hot...

but i will see if i can find those elusive plastic clips... after i find some free time....

 

[The Grim Reefer]

Enamels as in endcaps? Yeah, well I have crossed over to the dark side, the 72" halide fixture is on the living room floor as we speak. I HAVE SINNED!!! Forgive me bretheran of the T5 faith.

My living room looks like an aquarium lighting store, reflectors, T12, T5, T6, PC's, Ballasts, shop fixtures and a ton of cardboard and packing material along with and "the beast", 450 watts of 20K halides (of course the PC Actinics gotta go) and moon lights. Hopefully the wife will help with a little aquarium work after work tomorrow, cant wait to see how 150 watt halides stack up against T5's.