The inwall 380 starfire reborn
- Thread starter JohnL
- Start date
Eileen,
I know what you mean. I sort of regret the recent lighting change attempts that we have been through. But if we can get 2 bulbs to burn like the first one, then it will have been worth it (unless we get stuck paying for 3 bulbs just to get 2 that work
). Our corals seem to be adjusting to the new light also as I would swear that I see different colors from them each day (and each one being cooler than the day before). Although that may jsut be the lamp itself burning in to it's final spectrum. Right now it is relatively blue, but with more of a white component to it (so the tank doesn't look so dim, like some 20k tanks we have seen).
Jonathan,
I was actually advised just the opposite, although my person belief is to use a separate diffuser. I have an old Red Devil skimmer (that not only has a high O3 resistance rating, it also has an ozone reactor "conversion kit" that Red Sea will send to you). But that one is sized for a much smaller tank (even as an O3 reactor), so I don't think it will do us much good. Scott has repeatedly told us to go ahead and inject directly into the skimmer as he knows exactly what goes into them and what materials he uses. He even went so far as to state that the type of acrylic he uses is more O3 resistant than what most skimmer manufacturers use (I honestly forgot if it was exrtuded or cast that he said was better). Plus we are only going to be injecting 100 or so (I forgot the unit of measure here) of O3 and he said that was not enough to really make any difference, even long term. But I will be happy to show you how we inject it
. I already know where and how, just a matter of doing it. There is already a drain fitting in the inlet plumbing of the recirc pump, just upstream from the main air injection site (from the alita pump). I will force feed air through the O3 reactor using a small sweetwater 10 pump (@ 10w power draw) and into that secondary injection site. I chose to do this rather than injecting into the main air injection piping to avoid the possibility of back feeding any air through the O3 generator into the fish room. Pictures will speak the words for me soon enough.. hopefully after this weekend, although I do not plan to turn on the generator for at least a week after the new skimmer body goes in, probably longer. Once I am comfortable that the new body is broken in and we get a baseline for our tank and skimming ability, then I will add in the O3. I am a big proponent of not changing too many variables at once, unless we know 100% what each one will do (or the difference it will make). We will need to tune the skimmer (once the new body is in place) and I want to tune it w/o the O3 flowing
I know what you mean. I sort of regret the recent lighting change attempts that we have been through. But if we can get 2 bulbs to burn like the first one, then it will have been worth it (unless we get stuck paying for 3 bulbs just to get 2 that work
). Our corals seem to be adjusting to the new light also as I would swear that I see different colors from them each day (and each one being cooler than the day before). Although that may jsut be the lamp itself burning in to it's final spectrum. Right now it is relatively blue, but with more of a white component to it (so the tank doesn't look so dim, like some 20k tanks we have seen).Jonathan,
I was actually advised just the opposite, although my person belief is to use a separate diffuser. I have an old Red Devil skimmer (that not only has a high O3 resistance rating, it also has an ozone reactor "conversion kit" that Red Sea will send to you). But that one is sized for a much smaller tank (even as an O3 reactor), so I don't think it will do us much good. Scott has repeatedly told us to go ahead and inject directly into the skimmer as he knows exactly what goes into them and what materials he uses. He even went so far as to state that the type of acrylic he uses is more O3 resistant than what most skimmer manufacturers use (I honestly forgot if it was exrtuded or cast that he said was better). Plus we are only going to be injecting 100 or so (I forgot the unit of measure here) of O3 and he said that was not enough to really make any difference, even long term. But I will be happy to show you how we inject it
. I already know where and how, just a matter of doing it. There is already a drain fitting in the inlet plumbing of the recirc pump, just upstream from the main air injection site (from the alita pump). I will force feed air through the O3 reactor using a small sweetwater 10 pump (@ 10w power draw) and into that secondary injection site. I chose to do this rather than injecting into the main air injection piping to avoid the possibility of back feeding any air through the O3 generator into the fish room. Pictures will speak the words for me soon enough.. hopefully after this weekend, although I do not plan to turn on the generator for at least a week after the new skimmer body goes in, probably longer. Once I am comfortable that the new body is broken in and we get a baseline for our tank and skimming ability, then I will add in the O3. I am a big proponent of not changing too many variables at once, unless we know 100% what each one will do (or the difference it will make). We will need to tune the skimmer (once the new body is in place) and I want to tune it w/o the O3 flowing Jonathan,
Scott and I didn't really talk SCH, just wet necks and briefly collection cup washout systems. I would be more than happy to give you a call sometime and chat up the topic if you wanted, but I am not sure how much I would have to offer
Slight lighting update. The new AC bulb is set to arrive today from Premium. I just missed out on 4 slighting used AC bulbs for $50 each plus shipping here on RC. Such a deal, plus they were all fully "tested" (not like he would have any that didn't match color wise over his tank for the 3 months that he used them). NYVP picked them up, so I would expect some updates to his thread once he gets them. They should look great over his tank.
WIth all of the lighting talk I had been mulling over various lighting options. I noticed that the lighting over some parts of our tank was less than optimal as far as coverage. Several options came to mind and I had even started designing an LED lighting solution using 1 Watt LEDs off of Ebay and some T5 reflectors (basically mounting the LEDs into the long reflector and using the whole unit as a supplemental lighting solution to fill in the darker areas along the front of our tank). That was moving along just fine until I noticed a couple of the corals along the front left of our tank had some very nice coloration... on the back side of the corals *sigh*. All of these corals were higher up on the rocks and towards the front. There were similar corals on the right side, but most of them were further back. So I changed gears a little. I have no problem with using LEDs to supplement, but now I was going to be looking to them to provide growth and color which in my mind would require alot more LEDs (more than I wanted to spend $$ on). I could be mistaken in this thinking, but I have already shifted my focus in another direction. I know that Jonathan will say to just hook our light mover back up. And if I could get it to be controlled how I want it then I might. But with using the AC Jr the best I can do is turn it on and off at 1 minute intervals, which is far too long. And light movers are typically 5 or 10 RPM units (I think I got those right) and I am pretty sure ours is the 10 RPM one. So in one minute it travels all the way from the front to the back and back to the front again. Doesn't do the back corals much good to only get 1 min worth of light. I would like to have a slow progression from front to back spanning the day, but that is currently not possible with our setup. So I am off to our next option. And this was inpired by many tanks/threads that talk about lighting the rockwork and coral not the tank. The latest read being Invincibles, which is what started me down the current path I am on. I originally thought about the MH spots (Marine Depot has several IC ones for sale in various wattages), but that got me to thinking "Why limit the light to a single point. It seems like a waste" Since we are in In Wall we don't have to worry about what the lighting looks like (and why we use LA IIIs). We have a spare LA III mini (and PGS is a short drive away to pick up a second one) and I was thinking of pushing the current lighting back and putting two 175 lights in the front corners (although with the LA III minis they would cover alot more than just the corners). I did a run cost assessment and it came out to about $20 a month more to run those. (because then I only need the VHOs for dawn/dusk where now I am using them also to fill in the front and corners.). If this works out I am also considering runnining the halides staggered where the 175s come on an hour before the 400s (and go off an hour before they do also). Sort of like the sun rising and setting, although not the same gragient level the actual sunrise/sunset give us from front to back (East to West).
Anyways, I am still rolling this all around in my head trying to figure out the best approach. I will try to do one of those nice Visio style diagrams (that I always see on other threads) to show our current and proposed lighting with relation to our rockwork and corals .
Oh, and according to FedEx tracking the new skimmer body will be here Friday. So that is good news as well
Scott and I didn't really talk SCH, just wet necks and briefly collection cup washout systems. I would be more than happy to give you a call sometime and chat up the topic if you wanted, but I am not sure how much I would have to offer
Slight lighting update. The new AC bulb is set to arrive today from Premium. I just missed out on 4 slighting used AC bulbs for $50 each plus shipping here on RC. Such a deal, plus they were all fully "tested" (not like he would have any that didn't match color wise over his tank for the 3 months that he used them
). NYVP picked them up, so I would expect some updates to his thread once he gets them. They should look great over his tank. WIth all of the lighting talk I had been mulling over various lighting options. I noticed that the lighting over some parts of our tank was less than optimal as far as coverage. Several options came to mind and I had even started designing an LED lighting solution using 1 Watt LEDs off of Ebay and some T5 reflectors (basically mounting the LEDs into the long reflector and using the whole unit as a supplemental lighting solution to fill in the darker areas along the front of our tank). That was moving along just fine until I noticed a couple of the corals along the front left of our tank had some very nice coloration... on the back side of the corals *sigh*. All of these corals were higher up on the rocks and towards the front. There were similar corals on the right side, but most of them were further back. So I changed gears a little. I have no problem with using LEDs to supplement, but now I was going to be looking to them to provide growth and color which in my mind would require alot more LEDs (more than I wanted to spend $$ on). I could be mistaken in this thinking, but I have already shifted my focus in another direction. I know that Jonathan will say to just hook our light mover back up. And if I could get it to be controlled how I want it then I might. But with using the AC Jr the best I can do is turn it on and off at 1 minute intervals, which is far too long. And light movers are typically 5 or 10 RPM units (I think I got those right) and I am pretty sure ours is the 10 RPM one. So in one minute it travels all the way from the front to the back and back to the front again. Doesn't do the back corals much good to only get 1 min worth of light. I would like to have a slow progression from front to back spanning the day, but that is currently not possible with our setup. So I am off to our next option. And this was inpired by many tanks/threads that talk about lighting the rockwork and coral not the tank. The latest read being Invincibles, which is what started me down the current path I am on. I originally thought about the MH spots (Marine Depot has several IC ones for sale in various wattages), but that got me to thinking "Why limit the light to a single point. It seems like a waste" Since we are in In Wall we don't have to worry about what the lighting looks like (and why we use LA IIIs). We have a spare LA III mini (and PGS is a short drive away to pick up a second one) and I was thinking of pushing the current lighting back and putting two 175 lights in the front corners (although with the LA III minis they would cover alot more than just the corners). I did a run cost assessment and it came out to about $20 a month more to run those. (because then I only need the VHOs for dawn/dusk where now I am using them also to fill in the front and corners.). If this works out I am also considering runnining the halides staggered where the 175s come on an hour before the 400s (and go off an hour before they do also). Sort of like the sun rising and setting, although not the same gragient level the actual sunrise/sunset give us from front to back (East to West).
Anyways, I am still rolling this all around in my head trying to figure out the best approach. I will try to do one of those nice Visio style diagrams (that I always see on other threads
) to show our current and proposed lighting with relation to our rockwork and corals .Oh, and according to FedEx tracking the new skimmer body will be here Friday. So that is good news as well
jnarowe
New member
so about your light movers...don't they have a delay at each end? Mine stop over the back and front to give equal lighting exposure. Because it is a short distance traveled, the center corals end up with more net light I think, but not by much. Am I missing something? Maybe how your aquascaping is designed?
There is a delay but it is only a minute or two tops. There is an adjustable pot on the side of the mover and that is how one adjusts the end delay. To be honest I have not been very happy with the consistency of it's operation. Maybe I need to have it rebuilt ? But I really don't like having it move front to back all day. The lighting rack was not really meant to do that. The refelctors rattle at the end of each movement, which is quite annoying (it stops rather abruptly when it hits the end of it's travel and we only have the reflectors hanging from the one center bolt/hook hole)
jnarowe
New member
yeah mine stop abruptly too. Keeps the fish on their toes! I really don't mind all that but I do like the coral growth and how they get light from multiple angles. Seems more natural to me, but I doubt there is any scientific backup for that. Since mine are on individual tracks, they move at different intervals as well.
I have a second mover that is sitting in a box. I may bring it out to see how it all works with 2 separate movers, but at this time I am more inclined towards putting the 175 watters up there. It would give a more even and complete coverage overall, and that may be worth it. I really need to get that drawing up to show our lighting and rockwork. Anyone know a good program for making those basic shapes/diagrams ? If not then I will use Visio at my office to hammer one out.
Maybe I will look at trying to get those to work. This biggest restriction on that usage is the control of the movement. Maybe I will search on alternative light movers and/or controllers. At our current setup parameters it costs approx $10 per month per hour to run our bulbs (IE: We currently run them 6 hours per day and it costs us $60 per month, if we bumped it to 7 hours per day it would bump the month cost to about $70) So for the cost to run the 175s we could bump the 400s to up to 8 hours per day. I am still undecided about all of this (if you all can't tell ).
).
Milleme
New member
To get the same affect as the light mover you could have the lights come on from left to right at intervals. Once they are all on give the tank a couple hours of full coverage. Then have them turn off one by one at the same interval from left to right. This would give you a sunrise/sunset affect. It wouldn't give the same coverage as a light mover but similar affect. It would also save a little electricity.
Here is a shot taken today just before swapping bulbs (lights had been on for a little over an hour today at the time this was taken) :
and here is one with the new bulb, after about 30 mins burn time
It's going to need some burn in time to completely catch with with the first bulb, but it is definitely an improvement in color and the tank looks great !!! (and not dark at all). We are very happy
Now for the light movers and the new skimmer body this weekend
and here is one with the new bulb, after about 30 mins burn time
It's going to need some burn in time to completely catch with with the first bulb, but it is definitely an improvement in color and the tank looks great !!! (and not dark at all). We are very happy
Now for the light movers and the new skimmer body this weekend
definitely.. Thanks
I don't want to take any FTS until after we get the new skimmer body installed and tuned. Hopefully with the anticipated increase in flow rates we will see a marked improvement in our overall water quality
On a side note we have been contemplating picking up a pair of pyramid bullterflies. I know that they are reef safe, but I wanted to see if anyone had any experiences with them in so far as how they behaved around zoos, clams, feather dusters, etc. So if anyone has any experience, please chime in and let us know
Thanks
I don't want to take any FTS until after we get the new skimmer body installed and tuned. Hopefully with the anticipated increase in flow rates we will see a marked improvement in our overall water quality
On a side note we have been contemplating picking up a pair of pyramid bullterflies. I know that they are reef safe, but I wanted to see if anyone had any experiences with them in so far as how they behaved around zoos, clams, feather dusters, etc. So if anyone has any experience, please chime in and let us know
Thanks
Well, loving the new lights so far . The skimmer should be here tomorrow, the O3 can be connected over the weekend and the Vortec wireless drivers are now released. So that pretty much ties the bow on our planned upgrades through the end of the year... and a bit ahead of our anticipated schedule .
I keep rolling the lighting options around in my head and am now trying to figure a way to make our current light movers work. I need to slow it down since I don't want to see it constantly travelling front to back (hard on the lights, reflector mounts and light rack). Four possible ways come to mind, but I don't have any sources for the parts I would need
1. Modify the light mover itself to replace the 10 RPM stepper motor with a slower, possibly even variable stepper motor. It looks pretty standard, so it is a possibility
2. Modify the controller on the light mover that controls the stepper motor to turn down the speed (maybe with an inline resistor or something ?). I have not even opened it up yet so I couldn't say how feasible this is or isn't
3. Find an external controller that lets me control the on/off of the power to the light mover at a more granluar increment than 1 minute increments
4. Put some sort of delay mechanism in place on the power supply to the light mover, so that even with a 1 minute timer increment (on our AC Jr) there would only be power to the light mover for xx number of seconds. There are timer relays and the like that I could use, but I am trying not to get too complex.
There is only about 6" - 12" worth of travel overall that would be needed and I would like to see it complete that travel about once every 3 - 6 hours, give or take. Such that it would make a complete circuit from front to back (and possibly back front again) once or twice a day.
The other thing is which ever option I choose has to also be cost effective. Buying a $1k+ controller just to get the granularity on the light mover is not cost effective
On the livestock front, I started shopping around for the pyramid butterflies and may be able to order them next week sometime (to hopefully help stem the increasing aiptasia population).
. The skimmer should be here tomorrow, the O3 can be connected over the weekend and the Vortec wireless drivers are now released. So that pretty much ties the bow on our planned upgrades through the end of the year... and a bit ahead of our anticipated schedule .I keep rolling the lighting options around in my head and am now trying to figure a way to make our current light movers work. I need to slow it down since I don't want to see it constantly travelling front to back (hard on the lights, reflector mounts and light rack). Four possible ways come to mind, but I don't have any sources for the parts I would need
1. Modify the light mover itself to replace the 10 RPM stepper motor with a slower, possibly even variable stepper motor. It looks pretty standard, so it is a possibility
2. Modify the controller on the light mover that controls the stepper motor to turn down the speed (maybe with an inline resistor or something ?). I have not even opened it up yet so I couldn't say how feasible this is or isn't
3. Find an external controller that lets me control the on/off of the power to the light mover at a more granluar increment than 1 minute increments
4. Put some sort of delay mechanism in place on the power supply to the light mover, so that even with a 1 minute timer increment (on our AC Jr) there would only be power to the light mover for xx number of seconds. There are timer relays and the like that I could use, but I am trying not to get too complex.
There is only about 6" - 12" worth of travel overall that would be needed and I would like to see it complete that travel about once every 3 - 6 hours, give or take. Such that it would make a complete circuit from front to back (and possibly back front again) once or twice a day.
The other thing is which ever option I choose has to also be cost effective. Buying a $1k+ controller just to get the granularity on the light mover is not cost effective
On the livestock front, I started shopping around for the pyramid butterflies and may be able to order them next week sometime (to hopefully help stem the increasing aiptasia population
).new skimmer body just arrived. All looks well (despite the obvious abuse visisted upon the box by FedEx). I am just glad that Scott packs the way he does . Too bad it will be more than a couple of hours before I can even start swapping out the current skimmer body, but I should be able to have it all done before today is done
I also am contemplating putting the Kalk Reactor back online on the ATO line to the sump. We have the reactor (from PM) and I believe plenty of kalk still, it would just be a matter of connecting it to the RO line going to the sump. After several discussions with some fellow reefers I am starting to think that they have a point about the benefits of dosing kalk with the top off. We used to have it set up that way on our old tank, I just didn't bother to set it up on the new tank yet. But that may also be in the cards for this weekend.
More updates as I get each step completed
Oh, and I may have a line on a pair of pyramid butterflies. If it all works out we should be adding those to our tank next week.
. Too bad it will be more than a couple of hours before I can even start swapping out the current skimmer body, but I should be able to have it all done before today is done I also am contemplating putting the Kalk Reactor back online on the ATO line to the sump. We have the reactor (from PM) and I believe plenty of kalk still, it would just be a matter of connecting it to the RO line going to the sump. After several discussions with some fellow reefers I am starting to think that they have a point about the benefits of dosing kalk with the top off
. We used to have it set up that way on our old tank, I just didn't bother to set it up on the new tank yet. But that may also be in the cards for this weekend.More updates as I get each step completed
Oh, and I may have a line on a pair of pyramid butterflies. If it all works out we should be adding those to our tank next week.
