The Ultimate DIY Rocks!
- Thread starter JohnL
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Insane Reefer
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'Morning Joe.
I get that way sometimes
Cool - I have a feeling that might have been a problem later on...
I've never been a fan of styrofoam or expando-foam in tanks, but a lot of folks swear by it, so you might want to do a little more research on that to decide for yourself. I understand that crabs and whatnot like to pick at foam. If you are concerned about the weight, make most of that upper reverse slope into larger tunnels and caves - a whole little system of them. Have the openings point a bit downward, and reduce detritus getting into the tunnels. Or just use a "form" and cast around the "hollow" that would make - maybe you can take advantage of the hollow formed at the top were the wall will be thickest and use it as a refugium...
First, for this project, you will want to read other posts about casting large sheets like this onto glass (assuming this is a glass tank?). I've heard that the heat of hydration has been known to crack aquarium glass - not sure if it has ever done so on glass as thick as yours will probably be, but it is something to consider. I think that might be why a lot of folks cast over foam (though I think a sheet of plexi in there to form a layer between the cement and glass would work well - silicone the plexi in)...
Next, you might consider a fast set cement for this project. There are two main advantages to using a fast set in this instance: almost no cure time and a very low pH after like day 7 (if not sooner), meaning almost no kure time - Mr Wilson uses it a lot in his builds and has great success with curing and kuring of those systems. The down side is that fast sets are considered impermeable, unlike normal portland, which actually wicks moisture into itself. You can get water to flow through it, using proper techniques, but it isn't the same as being permeable and permeable is why cement works for filtration. They also have a ridiculously short work time, but that can be helped some, by admixtures, and/or constant mixing (i.e. a second pair of willing hands or a cement mixer), but we are talking about extending your work time from 10-20 minutes to maybe 30 minutes. Be prepared to work fast, and in smaller batches.
I'm thinking you might do well with the Perlcrete (O'l Skool, but use perlite to replace 1/2 of the larger aggregate, like coral and/or shell). You can reduce the weight significantly (and increase porosity) using the perlite in the mix. Since you are casting in place and they won't be moved around, the pieces don't need to be so strong, so perlcrete should work well. Barring the perlcrete, I'd say use the regular Ol' Skool recipe.
Certainly on the damp - you aren't getting this in a sauna :lol:, so regular cement curing practices will hold true. Plastic will help seal it and keep the moisture in, and maybe spray it down once or twice during the cure, if it looks like it needs it. You've done this before, having worked with cement, so easy-peasy.
If you elect to use normal portland, you might try letting it "air-kure" before going straight to the kure. That is a LOT of water we are talking about changing, and may have to be changed often at first. It seems to me that I get a lot less in the way of particulate leechants when I let the rock age a bit before messing with it, and that might be nice considering what a mess the calcium makes at the water line in a kure bin. Ask Goldmaniac what a chore that can be - he just cleaned his bins out, lol.
Your wife and my hubby should meet - he drug me over half of town yesterday, looking for a new side table...
LOL
Excellent
NP
Insane Reefer
New member
Hey there, Eznet2u :wave:
Welcome to the thread
Yeah, I sort of realized that might be the case after reading a description on another site. And then hitting Wiki to learn the the technical difference.
Something like this, could maybe work, if coupled with WHAT IT IS's idea of heat lamps or the like...
Thanks for the confirmation - A1amap will probably end up reporting the same.
eznet2u
Active member
Insane Reefer
New member
Hey Eznet2u
If I can't remember seeing a persons name before, I try to be nice and welcome them - make them feel at home as it were. I'm sure that there are a lot of lurkers, that watch the thread, but never actually participate, which is sort of a shame, since we can all learn from each other and help each other out, but they will post, or not, as they see fit.
Glad you decided to speak up
Those steamers are awesome - I got to look at the McCulloch Heavy Duty Steam Cleaner at "Harbor Freight" yesterday on my drag around town. The only real "problem" I see with any of these steamers (or most of the things I've looked at) is that they mostly have a 45 minute to 1 hour and 15 minute run time on a fill. For me, that means that every hour, for 8 hours, I will have to refill the tank. Not a huge deal, but it would be better if I only had to refill once or twice.
My dad called me last night, and said I could have the deep freezer in the rental unit he has. It is sort of a shame as it still works well (30+ years old too), but he is tired of having to clean manky food out of it when a renter leaves and forgets to clean it.
So now I just need to decide what unit to buy that will perform as I wish it to. And if I can't find one, possibly mod'ing something, like the bucket idea...
If I can't remember seeing a persons name before, I try to be nice and welcome them - make them feel at home as it were. I'm sure that there are a lot of lurkers, that watch the thread, but never actually participate, which is sort of a shame, since we can all learn from each other and help each other out, but they will post, or not, as they see fit.
Glad you decided to speak up
Those steamers are awesome - I got to look at the McCulloch Heavy Duty Steam Cleaner at "Harbor Freight" yesterday on my drag around town. The only real "problem" I see with any of these steamers (or most of the things I've looked at) is that they mostly have a 45 minute to 1 hour and 15 minute run time on a fill. For me, that means that every hour, for 8 hours, I will have to refill the tank. Not a huge deal, but it would be better if I only had to refill once or twice.
My dad called me last night, and said I could have the deep freezer in the rental unit he has. It is sort of a shame as it still works well (30+ years old too), but he is tired of having to clean manky food out of it when a renter leaves and forgets to clean it.
So now I just need to decide what unit to buy that will perform as I wish it to. And if I can't find one, possibly mod'ing something, like the bucket idea...
Rysam
New member
I have one of these from a failed christmas present.
http://www.target.com/Shark-Steam-Blaster-Jr-S3210R/dp/B000F3VFTC/ref=sc_ri_2/602-4797536-9707847
Thanks mom.
i may try to rig it up to a remote reservoir and cooler. i havent looked at it in years so i have no real good idea if it will work. i'll post again if i even still have it and can find it.
http://www.target.com/Shark-Steam-Blaster-Jr-S3210R/dp/B000F3VFTC/ref=sc_ri_2/602-4797536-9707847
Thanks mom.
i may try to rig it up to a remote reservoir and cooler. i havent looked at it in years so i have no real good idea if it will work. i'll post again if i even still have it and can find it.
Insane Reefer
New member
LOL, KH. Glad to see I'm not the only lazy monkey
Let us know how it goes
Let us know how it goes
Insane Reefer
New member
Ok!
I just won this on eBay
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110238716874
I got a better shipping price for it than listed - I have a grand total of $14 in this. The seller was sort of stupid though. This is a Hankscraft humidifier. The seller should have put that in the title. Hankscraft humidifiers are selling used, on eBay for $25-$75 (based on "Completed Item Search), when they actually have "Hankscraft" in the title. So I figure if this isn't enough for powering the rock sauna, I can sell it back on eBay for a small profit
I'll post what I learn about it once it arrives.
I just won this on eBay
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110238716874
I got a better shipping price for it than listed - I have a grand total of $14 in this. The seller was sort of stupid though. This is a Hankscraft humidifier. The seller should have put that in the title. Hankscraft humidifiers are selling used, on eBay for $25-$75 (based on "Completed Item Search), when they actually have "Hankscraft" in the title. So I figure if this isn't enough for powering the rock sauna, I can sell it back on eBay for a small profit
I'll post what I learn about it once it arrives.
leebo_28
New member
it was white cement called quikwall ..It has little fibers i sifted out with a flour sifter.
http://www.quikrete.com/ProductLines/QuickwallSurfaceBondingCement.asp
http://www.quikrete.com/ProductLines/QuickwallSurfaceBondingCement.asp
Insane Reefer
New member
I've gotten the deep freeze. Does anyone here know anything about refrigeration at all? If so, would you PM me? I have a few questions about possibly changing out the "cold" parts on this and putting in "heat" parts like what might be used in a sauna or the like. Basically automate this a bit and have a bit more control. But I would need to talk to someone who knows about this sort of thing before I even thought about attempting to do so, and then get my dad, who is an electrician, to help me.
Leebo
Great work on the rocks. It goes better and easier each time you cast, so you are off to a good start.
The Quikwall might have something to do with your problem with the setting. Quikwall is a fast set cement, and not meant to have retarding agents (which salt would be), added to it. There might be a specialty admixture for slowing fast set cement, but it isn't meant to use the agents regularly used on regular portland cements. Let us know how the strength turns out on those. Now on the upside, Mr Wilson reports alomost no kure time on the fast sets - so once the salt is out, in theory, they should be good to go. But certainly do a pH test first - better safe than sorry.
And thanks for sharing pictures
Leebo
Great work on the rocks. It goes better and easier each time you cast, so you are off to a good start.
The Quikwall might have something to do with your problem with the setting. Quikwall is a fast set cement, and not meant to have retarding agents (which salt would be), added to it. There might be a specialty admixture for slowing fast set cement, but it isn't meant to use the agents regularly used on regular portland cements. Let us know how the strength turns out on those. Now on the upside, Mr Wilson reports alomost no kure time on the fast sets - so once the salt is out, in theory, they should be good to go. But certainly do a pH test first - better safe than sorry.
And thanks for sharing pictures
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Insane Reefer
New member
There are also several brands of white portland cement, more suited to our purpose (get type II or V if you can). Three brands that I know of are Riverside, Federal and Lehigh - there may be others. You can usually find it at real masonry supply places - not at the big box stores.
Insane Reefer
New member
Yeah, unfortunately it is considered a "specialty", even at the masonry supply places. My town has a population of around 90k, and I managed to find white at two places. One was the place that real masons go to get their supplies, the other was a rock and brick patio/drive supply place.
White is simply a visual preference choice - grey works just as well, if not better; if I had to choose between white fast set and grey portland (and thankfully I don't), and I was going for filtration rock, I think I'd go with grey portland. Not that there is anything wrong with fast set cements (and ther eare even some benefits); but it is probable that it doesn't have the capability to house as much bacteria, lacking much of the microscopic "pore" space that normal portland has.
Rysam
New member
sorry about the first few. apparently one of the kids left some evidence on the lens. those are my favorite 3 rocks. 2 are with portland and salt only and 1 has portland,arag sand,and salt. they are certainly stout rocks. and they seem to be quite porous. they have been soaking for about 2 weeks and the ph is still off of my test kit. no surprise there.
