Weeds

The tank is looking really good and maturing so nicely. Maybe the barnacle blennies know that valentine's day is coming up soon. I have never seen either of my barnacle blennies doing any sort of dance so perhaps I do not have a pair. They have 3 hide holes between the two of them and I can find them in any of the 3.
 
Thanks Dawn. Things are humming along well. I still have some pest macros I've yet to get rid of, but other than that, I'm pleased.

On the barnacle blennies' mating dance, you'll know it when you see it. The male's front half of his body turns almost black and he moves up and down in an exaggerated fashion. It's funny looking! They seem to do it either early in the morning or later in the day. I agree, if you haven't seen it yet, there probably not male and female. If they don't fight over holes, you likely have two females.

Now I'm off to ski with my moose friends!
 
Some pics from over the weekend:

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Seagrass. After having 5-6 manatee grasses reach the water surface a couple weeks ago, I now have none. I'm pretty sure the cause is the new light being a touch brighter than the old one. It should recover.


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Patch reef. The red grapes look a little bleached too.


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From the end. My blue bulb died, so there's no supplemental light there. I'm going to take my time replacing it, to see if the reds like it better.
 
Some pics from over the weekend:

Seagrass. After having 5-6 manatee grasses reach the water surface a couple weeks ago, I now have none. I'm pretty sure the cause is the new light being a touch brighter than the old one. It should recover.

Patch reef. The red grapes look a little bleached too.

My blue bulb died, so there's no supplemental light there. I'm going to take my time replacing it, to see if the reds like it better.

Kewl a new experiment .
 
Thanks lapin. I think they're getting a little too much light. We'll see how it goes. The touch of blue was nice, and provided a transition to the metal halide light.
 
I am sorry to hear about the manatee grasses. Such a small change resulting in a big impact! I admire how you take these setbacks so patiently. I need to learn some of that myself.

Good luck on observing the red macros minus the blue bulb. My experience says that they will still grow but I can not say whether it will be worse or better than when you had the blue light on.
 
Thanks Dawn. It's not too big a deal. I didn't lose plants-just a few blades. Losing blades happens constantly, so when I show off some reaching the surface, I know it's only temporary. Oddly enough, I think the old, malfunctioning ballast may have lead to the tall blades. I've read that manatee grass grows taller in less ideal lighting, which is what I had. So the blades grew taller in the intermittent light, then got cooked when I fixed the light. Kind of ironic!

I'm guessing the red macros will grow a little slower, which is fine. I just wish I could get them to show a deeper red color. I may try adjusting (bending) the metal halide reflector to decrease some of that light reaching the reds.
 
You never know when you're going to stumble onto new, potentially game-changing information.

The other night I was perusing RC, looking for something interesting. I came across a thread, "Id please and thanks" in Reef Discussion. It was just another 'What is this growing in my new tank?' type thread. Typically, these discussions follow a familiar path, with the same, old answers provided.

The first guy to weigh in suggested the OP get his nutrients under control and keep his lights out, while his tank cycled, to avoid algae problems, both now and down the road.

I decided to jump in and offer my advice as well, which differed from his. I said an algae phase is unavoidable and better to let it happen sooner than later, so as to get it over with more quickly. I pointed out my previous experience with my own tanks. In v1 I fought to keep nutrients low in the first months, and it only delayed the inevitable algae phase, stretching it to the eight month mark. In v2, I let algae have it's way right from the start, and I got through it in four months.

This started a back and forth with him, (Scrubber steve is his name), mcyver and me. I admit, I was resistant to his ideas. They completely apposed my own. But the more info he provided, the more it made sense to me. Needless to say, we pretty much hijacked the thread for a little while. If this interests you, checkout the thread to get more details.

Here is the (basic) gist of what Scrubber steve is saying: Algae of all types have associated bacteria that 'help' the algae. If we let algae run amok in the formative stages of our aquariums, we're encouraging these algae-friendly bacteria to get established, to the detriment of nitrifying bacteria. This can lead to more virulent algae that's harder to get rid of, down the line. On the other hand, if we try to discourage algae during the cycling phase, by keeping nutrients low and the lights out, the 'good' nitrifying bacteria can get established first, making it difficult for algae-friendly bacteria to move in. If done well, an algae phase could be completely avoided. KABOOM!

Could this really be true? I don't know, but the science behind it sounds good to me, and I'd sure like to see it tested. This has applications to reef tanks obviously, and really any other tank where algae isn't welcome, but could it be applied to a planted tank like mine? My first inclination is to say no, since accepted methodology is to get plants in from the start, deemphasizing nitrifying bacteria, which competes with plants for nutrients. But maybe some variation of this method could work in a planted tank. After all, I'd like to avoid an algae phase too!

I suggested he start a new thread promoting this method, and I invited Scrubber steve to visit my thread and discuss more. So Scrubber steve, can your method be applied to a marine planted tank?
 
At 550, Carbon is the big one. Plants need it more than ANY other nutrient. In nature and in aquariums, it is most often the limiting nutrient for plants. Carbon Dioxide (CO2) is plants' preferred form of Carbon. Many fresh water planted tank keepers dose CO2, to get luxurious plant growth. It is just as helpful for marine plant keepers. A simple way to dose CO2, is to rent a 5 lb CO2 tank, top it with a regulator, and run airline tubing to the intake of a pump or a canister filter or reactor.

Hi Michael; have read up to this point in your very long thread :) & saw the above.
As that's as far as I've read of the thread so far, & that goes back in time somewhat, you may have already discovered, & know all about the following information I'll add?
But others might find it interesting.

Cheers

Photosynthesis and the Reef Aquarium: by Randy http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-10/rhf/index.php

some extracts

Freshwater aquarists caring for brightly-lit planted aquaria have long known the importance of CO2, and often add carbon dioxide directly to the aquarium water in one way or another to supply those tanks' substantial need for this material.
Reef aquarists, on the other hand, might have just as much or more photosynthesis taking place, but rarely worry about adding carbon dioxide.

Why?

That's one of the topics to be detailed in subsequent sections of this article. The answer is not that seawater contains more CO2 than does freshwater, but rather that seawater contains other chemicals that can, in some cases, be used to supply carbon dioxide.

When a gas phase carbon dioxide molecule enters water, it is initially hydrated to carbonic acid.
The carbonic acid that is formed when carbon dioxide hydrates can then very quickly equilibrate into the water's carbonate buffer system, converting into both bicarbonate and carbonate by releasing protons (H+):

Consequently, carbonic acid, bicarbonate and carbonate are in equilibrium with each other at any given point in time. The primary factor that determines the relative amount of each species at equilibrium in seawater is the pH, with a small temperature effect as well.

At most pH values attained in a reef aquarium, however, bicarbonate is far more prevalent than carbon dioxide.

Figure 1 shows data calculated for all three species as a function of pH in seawater. From this graph, it is clear that if getting carbon dioxide itself is limiting at pH 8.2, it might be more efficient to get it from bicarbonate because so much more is present.
In fact, roughly 200 times more bicarbonate than carbon dioxide is present in seawater at pH 8.2.

Figure1.jpg



Obtaining Carbon Dioxide from Bicarbonate: Direct Uptake
An alternative way to obtain carbon dioxide via seawater bicarbonate is to take up the bicarbonate
through protein transport mechanisms across the cell membranes, and then once inside the cells
where it is needed, carbonic anhydrase converts it into carbon dioxide and hydroxide ion.

also

Obtaining Carbon Dioxide from Bicarbonate: Carbonic Anhydrase

Obtaining Carbon Dioxide from Bicarbonate: Proton Pumping



.
 
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Just sat down to start reading this thread more thoroughly (Lots to read). Started at page 1, again. It's akin to reading a book. I don't know the ending or how things transpire on the way there.

Very interesting & a real challenge. Completely different to your typical reef tank. Sort of system that could be work out great, or go terribly wrong with a few restarts necessary. But I see you've had a similar tank previously by your post #1, so you have a great advantage.
 
Back in the dirt"¦

Starting up my new ecosystem requires a foundation for life. A suitable substrate for the sand bed creatures and the seagrasses is required. To support biodiversity, I will provide a variety of sand grain sizes, dirt, mud, shells and rubble - just as I've seen in Nature. It will not be a sterile, dead sand bed. It will be messy and wriggling with life.

How will this new substrate differ from the previous one? It will have more dirt and mud in it. In my experience, the grasses and the creatures enjoy it.

I managed to save a number of spaghetti worms from the old setup. I'll be adding live sand and live rock. I'm really hoping to get the bottom of the food chain established early. I believe this will help with stability, in an unstable phase of the tank's life.

Other members of the crew include two species of reproducing snails (Cerith & Mini Strombus), a fighting conch and a sea cucumber. Right now they're in my holding tank. I'll add some serpent stars and pods as well.

This an important step. Laying the foundation for life. Yay!

The environment your reproducing reminds me of the Minnamurra River, where I live. One end of the river is greatly influenced by the sea, & the other end by grazing land & natural bush. Gets plenty of plant & tree matter, & soil washing into it. Water movement from incoming & outgoing tides only.

There's lots of mangroves growing, starting about a couple of hundred yards from the mouth. Lots of sea grasses starting at the same area.

Talking about substrate, where the sea grasses & mangroves are the sand is a darker color, & digging down its black. When walking in these areas at low tide your feet sink down about 6" to 8". Very squishy. I guess it very aerated by the organisms mixed through it.

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Welcome mndfreeze!

In my experience, ulva seems to need to be driven hard, with high light and high nutrients.

Ulva is what grows on my scrubber screen- naturally seeded.

Not sure but I'm guessing Enteromorpha (ulva) intestinalis. There's lots of varieties. I think I've had a few, & its changed somewhat, or evolved over time.

Super awesome for nutrient export, & easy to grow & non invasive. It's my only filtration besides some floss & occasional GAC.

I can even keep growing it with no3 & po4 levels reading zero, although thats only on hobby grade kit, & I do feed the tank a fair amount.

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You never know when you're going to stumble onto new, potentially game-changing information.

Here is the (basic) gist of what Scrubber steve is saying: Algae of all types have associated bacteria that 'help' the algae. If we let algae run amok in the formative stages of our aquariums, we're encouraging these algae-friendly bacteria to get established, to the detriment of nitrifying bacteria. This can lead to more virulent algae that's harder to get rid of, down the line. On the other hand, if we try to discourage algae during the cycling phase, by keeping nutrients low and the lights out, the 'good' nitrifying bacteria can get established first, making it difficult for algae-friendly bacteria to move in. If done well, an algae phase could be completely avoided. KABOOM!

Could this really be true? I don't know, but the science behind it sounds good to me, and I'd sure like to see it tested. This has applications to reef tanks obviously, and really any other tank where algae isn't welcome, but could it be applied to a planted tank like mine? My first inclination is to say no, since accepted methodology is to get plants in from the start, deemphasizing nitrifying bacteria, which competes with plants for nutrients. But maybe some variation of this method could work in a planted tank. After all, I'd like to avoid an algae phase too!
This is also along those lines You will need to insert reef 2 reef and...... threads/algae-release-useful-proteins-carbohydrates-and-metabolites.359116/

https://www.*********.com/threads/a...roteins-carbohydrates-and-metabolites.359116/
 
I don't think I've seen that article before, Steve. I have read about bicarbonates and figured they'd pretty much help out where they can with no help from me. And I presumed the plants wouldn't have to work as hard to get CO2, if I just gave them CO2. But the article raised this point that I found interesting:

6. Keep the carbonate alkalinity up to at least 2.5 meq/l (7 dKH; 125 ppm calcium carbonate equivalents) to provide adequate bicarbonate for photosynthesis. Higher alkalinity may even be better, especially if the pH is also high, limiting carbon dioxide itself as a CO2 source for photosynthesizing organisms. This suggestion is likely already followed by most reef aquarists, but perhaps not by some with fish-only or related types of aquaria that also rely on macroalgae for nutrient export.

It sounds like my seagrasses might appreciate access to more bicarbonates.
 
Steve, thanks for pointing out the similarities between my tank's substrate and your local river. That's really what I'm going for, providing a fertile substrate for the seagrass, as well as worms and other detrivores. I'm attempting to close the loop with detritus, allowing it to settle out, so it can be consumed and processed down the line to the grasses. It works pretty well, though I occasionally tidy up to keep things looking good enough for display. I have one fat and happy cucumber, which tend to gradually starve in cleaner tanks. I'm considering adding a detritus-eating fish as well, so I'll have to watch and see if it can support both.
 
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Ulva is a great utility plant. I've kept some in my tank from the beginning. I often suggest it to others over chaeto. Makes sense to use it in a scrubber. I'm considering using Enteromorpha intestinalis in my display. It looks like it would move well in the current.
 
Interesting thread lapin, thanks. I followed the progress of a few folks attempting the Triton method. I've also read about plants' chemical warfare, know as allelopathy. I didn't read the whole thread, but I got the impression Mr Farley wasn't fully on-board with Triton. I wasn't either, but I can't remember all the reasons. Mostly I didn't like how it made users too dependent on the company for testing and maintaining the suggested levels. Too proprietary for my taste.
 
I did my usual tidy-up/export over the weekend. No pics this time. Not enough change to show anything.

My turtle weed was getting overgrown with caulerpa again, so I picked up the rock it's growing on to remove it. This usually triggers the turtle weed to die back, then gradually grow back. While I had it in my hands, I got the idea to try something different with this plant that has confounded me so far. Since I haven't had any luck transplanting any of it to the back wall, where I want it to grow, I thought maybe I could attach the whole rock to the back wall. There is one rather large hole on the back wall that I thought the turtle weed rock just might fit into. It did! So now I have turtle weed high up on the back wall. I noted today that there is some expected die off, but also some new growth as well. If the plant stays happy there, maybe, just maybe it'll grow and spread out on the wall. That would be great!

Also, after reading the article that Scrubber steve posted, I am trying to increase alkalinity to boost bicarbonates. I want to see if this improves seagrass growth.
 
Wow, I have missed a lot of good stuff here the past week that I have been MIA. I will go back and reread the article that Steve posted and try to understand as much as I can.
 
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