What critter will keep the sand clean?

[nodea717]

Here is the entire excerpt from which you qoute... This is when you are starting new DSB, and in that situation... I agree.

Considering a complete live sand DSB and is mature, gobies and even sand sifting stars will not negatively affect a DSB.

Read my previous post, I specifically said that a "clean up crew" is not needed when your system is esablished correctly. Now, if you are one that has to have two hundred snails and two hundred crabs to "clean" your system, you might have other issues.

Within a week, you should notice bubbles in the sediment next to the glass indicating the sand filter is working, within a couple weeks small tube traces should be visible in places in the sediments near the walls, and small bug populations should be evident. After a two week wait - and more time is desirable - fish may be added. UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES SHOULD YOU ADD "SAND-SIFTING" ANIMALS SUCH AS BURROWING SEA STARS OR SOME GOBIES. These animals are "sifting" the sediment to eat the sand critters that you need to have thrive. From this point, gradually add more animals up to the desired level.

There are many "guru's" that will contradict each other, thats just the way it is in this hobby. I am speaking from years of experience with DSB's and sand bed dwelling animals. I assure you that a properly established DSB will support the animals as well as function properly in nitrate reduction.

 

[Whisperer]

Amen!

 

[nodea717]

Here are some recent qoutes to consider on the subject...

What does most of the reef life we house do most of the time? Seek out or make "food". What could be more preferred than having some foodstuffs available at times your predatory livestock is in the search mode? Live Sand can be a great source of live foods; for some fishes (Callionymids/Dragonettes <show Synchiropus>, many Gobiids <show Amblygobius>...), the difference between success and starvation

Robert Fenner...

Other notes from various references...

"Without the grace of Live Sand, there go these fishes": The family Callionymidae (Mandarins/Dragonets/Scooters/Psychedelic Gobies) that includes the Green/Spotted Mandarin, Synchiropus picturatus, and gobies of the genus Amblygobius (a Hector’s Goby, Amblygobius hectori) rarely live well or long without the live feedings afforded by adequate Live Sand. Each Mandarin specimen requires a good four square feet of established LS. Most Amblygobius starve to death in captivity.

Of great use with and in need of Live Sand are various "surface" animals that turn over the substrate. Some exemplary "sand sifters" are gobies of the genera Valenciennea, the "Sleeper Gobies" (pictured Orange-Spotted Sleeper Goby, Valenciennea puellaris)(great jumpers), Istigobius (one to a tank, they’re scrappy with congeners) and various kinds of hermit crabs <shown> and Serpent Stars (here a Ophioderma rubicundum out for a stroll at night in the Caribbean).

Many fishes use sand for a grist mill as well as habitat for their gut fauna. Here are two notable examples; a Pacific Sailfin Tang, Zebrasoma veliferum, and the most common aquarium member of the Rabbitfish family, the Foxface, Lo vulpinus.

Food for thought if you will... keep :reading:

Focker Out...

 

[bertoni]

Considering a complete live sand DSB and is mature, gobies and even sand sifting stars will not negatively affect a DSB.

That's not at all true, in my opinion and experience, as well as that of others. My yellow watchman goby cleaned out the sandbed in its tank. For a very large tank, that might be true, but our tanks are usually far too small for a sandsifting animal and a live DSB.

I'm not sure what the quotes from Bob Fenner are supposed to demonstrate, but the quote on mandarin fish is just wrong, as is demonstrated by many successful tanks with mandarin fish that don't have that much open sand. I don't believe the other quote, either, in the context of a live DSB in a typical tank. The tang quote seems neither here nor there.

As far as the "recency" of the quotes, animals don't evolve all that rapidly, and Dr Shimek is a specialist in many types of ocean sand habitats.

 

[nodea717]

No, animals dont evolve all that rapidly... but our knowledge of the animals we are always investigating does. It's science. Everything is a balance, if the DSB is not mature (or you feel the DSB will be destroyed) then don't add the animal. I guess its that simple.

 

[bertoni]

Bob Fenner does not have a background in marine biology, as far as I know, nor is he a part of the research community, nor does he have any references for those quotes, as far as I have seen.

Edit: To be fair to Mr Fenner, his quotes are taken a bit out of their context, so I might be misreading his views a bit.

 

[EWC88]

I loved my diamond goby but one day I couldn't find him don't know were he went but kept my bed cleaned...BUT did also messy my tank up by putttin sand everywere

 

[JJ21]

would a twinspot goby do the same thing? sift the sand? can they survive with crushed coral as a substrate?

 

[drummereef]

I can say assuredly that the diamond goby I kept in my tank was not a good decision. I have a deep sand bed 4-5 inches deep established for over 10 years. It's just not a good choice for smaller tanks like my 40g. Just my opinion.

 

[bertoni]

If you would like to have a goby fish, I don't see any reason not to add one. The sand sifters will all kill a DSB, but that can be okay, as long as the live rock, refugium, etc, can handle the nutrient load. Given that people keep many of these goby fishes in bare-bottom tanks, I don't think a substrate is that crucial.

 

[steve9k]

drummereef -- my phosphates measure 0 (though, as I understand it, that could be becuase it's all locked up in the algae!). I replace 5 gal. every week (that's about 25% per month) with RO/DI water.

I've been battling algae problems since I set up the tank -- no piece of advice seems to solve the problem (DSB, refugium, mangroves, feed every other day, increased circulation -- I've tried them all). I agree with the comments about treating the disease, not the symptom, but so far that just doesn't work for me. Over the past several months I've managed to get my nitrates from over 40 to about 5 or less, and the algae on the rocks has diminished considerably, but I can't seem to do much about the sand (or the glass, for that matter).

 

[rafa316]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10169127#post10169127 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Tahlequah
Here is a pic of my goby and his sand... I do have to remove some sand from my lower rock but only about every 3 days or so and it isnt very much.

what kind of goby is this?

 

[chrisqueenz]

It looks like a diamond goby.....

 

[chrisqueenz]

Oh yea, you want clean sand? Go with a diamond goby.. By far the hardest working keeping your sandbed clean!

 

[nodea717]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10200822#post10200822 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by steve9k
, but I can't seem to do much about the sand (or the glass, for that matter).

How much circulation do you have in the tank? Increasing circulation will usually solve the sand/glass issues.

Don