What Formula (Drops Per Gallon) Do You Guys Use For Cupramine?

[nuxx]

Hey everyone,

Going to start our Gem Tang on Cupramine tomorrow.

So far he's been through three rounds of Prazi and has had Paraguard dosed everyday during that treatment as well.

I was planning on doing the following when adding Cupramine:

Day 1: 1 Drop per gallon.
Day 3: 1 Drop per gallon.
Day 5: 0.5 Drops per gallon.

Was thinking that would get me in the effective range for treatment, but not be overly strong like the 20 drops per 10.5 gallons (2x) Seachem suggests.

Curious what everyone else doses with Cupramine and has had success with.

Thanks! :beer:

 

[LED Jack]

Nuxx, with your size tank I would not worry about ick and would just add him to your display. If the fish is not stressed ick won't be a problem. And surely with you tank size the Tang will be happy and less stressed than it has since collection.

 

[nuxx]

Nuxx, with your size tank I would not worry about ick and would just add him to your display. If the fish is not stressed ick won't be a problem. And surely with you tank size the Tang will be happy and less stressed than it has since collection.

Too risky :eek1:

 

[Dmorty217]

Too risky :eek1:

No kidding... If you haven't used cupramine before I don't think I would use it for the first time on the tang if that's what your doing? Want me to ask Caribfan how he uses it, he has put all his fish in his DT thru Cupramine?

 

[billdogg]

Why not go with TTM instead? No dosing potentially toxic copper on an already difficult fish, and proven to be 100% effective.

 

[Breadman03]

Why not go with TTM instead? No dosing potentially toxic copper on an already difficult fish, and proven to be 100% effective.

Agreed.

 

[GimpyFin]

I'm jealous of you guys and your gem tangs. One of my favorites. IMO, Mardel coppersafe works well if you do want to use copper. I've used it off and on and never harmed or lost a fish with it including a flame angel I still have almost 3 years later. 5ml per 4 gallons of water.

 

[snorvich]

Why not go with TTM instead? No dosing potentially toxic copper on an already difficult fish, and proven to be 100% effective.

This.

 

[CStrickland]

I think the dosing shredule they give is just a staring point. What you're really after is the right concentration of copper. I know cupramine is not supposed to soak into the rocks like other copper, but there will still be variables that make it hard to predict what concentration you'll end up with from dosing X drops per gallon. If you ease into it by ramping up slowly, that's exposing the fish to copper for longer than necessary. And the effective start date will still be when you reach therapeutics levels. It seems like six of one and half dozen of the other. Keep in mind that low doses of copper will mask symptoms but not relieve some diseases. So under dosing can be worse than not at all because it's a risk without reward.

 

[sreefs]

Like was said TTM

 

[nuxx]

Personal experience with TTM is that it adds too much stress.

I like having a fish in a large QT and keeping stress levels down and eating.

I think I'm going to go the 1 drop per gallon for 3 days (full drop the last day instead of 1/2) spread out over doses days 1, 3 and 5.

Also remember guys, 95% of the fish you buy have been in holding tanks with copper at some point

 

[reefgeezer]

Copper is touchy... too little does no good and worse yet may just mask problems... too much is toxic... it binds to carbonate based materials so the levels can drop very quickly. At the very least get a copper test kit to ensure you can keep levels in the proper range.

If he's already been in isolation for a while, why not just wait the for a total of 72 days without using anything? This is as close to 100% as it gets and 0 stress.

 

[nuxx]

If he's already been in isolation for a while, why not just wait the for a total of 72 days without using anything? This is as close to 100% as it gets and 0 stress.

If he's not stressed and eating well, he might not show signs of ich.

 

[reefgeezer]

If he's not stressed and eating well, he might not show signs of ich.

I respectively disagree. IMO, a fish will appear to be eating well & not stressed... until he doesn't... regardless of the presence of Ich on his body or in the system. We just assume that the infestation started when the first symptom is noticed. Many factors determine how long it takes an Ich infestation to show itself i.e. temp, salinity, population density, and yes, within reason, the health of the population. However, if Ich is present in a closed system, I believe it will show up within its maximum life cycle. If I remember correctly that's 72 days.

What could happen if you use copper incorrectly is a masking of the presence of Ich until such time as the fish is in your DT or subsequent and seemingly unexplainable death from damage done by a copper overdose.

I'm not arguing against the use of copper, just its use without a test kit and aggressive monitoring of copper levels.

 

[nuxx]

No problem John I fully understand.

I have the thought of I'd rather deal with a fish passing away from improper copper level (even the Gem), than risk what I have in my tank.

I have a few Copper test kits, but honestly they don't seem to work very well IMO.

I've tried TTM twice and both times I felt the fish were far too stressed out.

I used to QT with 3 rounds of Prazi and 30 days of treating with Paraguard each day. Ich has never popped up (knock on wood) in years. Now there is just too much to risk to even continue that.

If a fish doesn't make it through copper, it's not going in.

I've also heard of a few local hobbyists doing TTM and having it not work. Same with fallow period and hypo. Yes probably user error, but there is lots of room in TTM and hypo for error.

Trust me, I'm parasite paranoid. I QT inverts and coral for 72 days fishless.

 

[Sapelo]

I agree on the TTM but to answer the question that was asked, I agree with CStrickland. It's all about getting to a "treatment level" and holding it there. Also remember that you need a seachem test to check since cupramine is a seachem product.
(And yes, I'm sure you knew that, I added it more for the benefit of readers who did not.)

 

[nuxx]

I agree on the TTM but to answer the question that was asked, I agree with CStrickland. It's all about getting to a "treatment level" and holding it there. Also remember that you need a seachem test to check since cupramine is a seachem product.
(And yes, I'm sure you knew that, I added it more for the benefit of readers who did not.)

Sure thing I have their kit and a few others