why does everyone thing 8 t5s is too much light?

[nemo g]

ive seen post after post advising new t5 users to stay away from 6 bulb and definitely 8 bulb teks if there are going to do any lps and shrooms.

where did this fear come from?

ive got an lfs with a 75g and a 6 bulb tek light, with nothing in it but softies. xenia, cloves, shrooms, ricordia, sponges, star polyps, and others.

if all this can live with a 6 bulb tek, as well as live under halides, why is everyone so adamant that 8 an bulb tek is way too much for anything less than sps???

hmmm...

Hobby Exper

 

[nemo g]

nobody?

 

[eclecticvibe]

I think that you can use that much light. You just have to be careful to acclimate the animals to the light if they're not used to that much lighting originally. If you expose them to the light all at once, they're likely to be shocked and bleach. Same story goes for halides. While the bulbs may be more than you need, I don't think they're too much for the tank. Of course tank depth and the animals that you're keeping figures into the equation as well. It's all relative I guess.

 

[David Grigor]

There are lots and lots of variables involved. From the reflectors you use ( Tek aren't the greatest reflectors so you really can't even compare the number of bulbs used ), the bulb brand and spectrum choices, your water chemistry, heavy skimming, tint to your water, water temps, you name it are involved. Also, important is your particular corals, the corals I have are not the same as yours even if the common names who knows where they have been collected.

Lastly, expectations. A buddy has T5s and loves them however he hasn't used anything else really. When I see his corals I think to myself, the colors look pretty light and/or faded but to him it's normal.

I ran T5s for a year on icecap ballasts over a LPS dominate tank. Having had VHOs prior, over time some corals faded in color, some stopped expanded, while others couldn't have looked better. I ended up switching back to VHOs and very happy with the decision.

In the end, it's your tank, you know what best for it as you see it everyday. There are lots of variables, along with how different people perceive how there corals look. I tend to agree for an LPS dominate tank 6 or even 8 is excessive.

 

[Underwaterparadise]

Acclimation is the key!!

 

[davweaver]

lights

lights

I can tell you about mine........

I had a 75 bowfront with the aquapro lite 2x150 hqi and 2x96 pc.
my mushrooms and lps were happy.

i went to a 125 with 6x80 watt t-5 from reefgeek and my hammer and frog spawn love it...........my mushrooms hate it. I have them set on the ends now and in shaded areas, they seem to do better there.

thats my experience with the t-5

 

[Justin74]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7660133#post7660133 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by David Grigor
There are lots and lots of variables involved. From the reflectors you use ( Tek aren't the greatest reflectors so you really can't even compare the number of bulbs used )

I agree about all the variables. Except the comment about Tek sounds a lil more dismissive of there quality than they actually are. Tek reflectors are a great reflector! Not quite as good as the IC reflector or the Aqualux but still very good nonetheless. And no, I dont have a Tek and am not defending them for that reason alone. But have seen a few comparisons done here by our local reefers and the difference is not that major.

Mostly what people have problems with is the mushrooms and rics as far as softies. With LPS its a lil different. Some dig it and some dont. Like my echinophyllia , calaustrea,and one of my acanthastrea's, I need to shade them partially from direct light or there colors will fade. While my frogspwans will take pretty much what I can give it, as far as light.

Another big difference between peoples experience and setups is what bulbs theyre using. Different spectrums let alone different manufacturers can account for this. For example someone whos been using Zoomeds bulbs wants to switch some of his bulbs to a GE 6500k, his corals and him are going to be in the shock of there lifes. Then there's tank depths, a major factor. You honestly dont want a 6+ bulb config and want to keep softies or LPS if your tank's no more than 12" high. But if its 20+" high your stuff will be great. Apples and oranges

-Justin

 

[nemo g]

thanks for the input justin,

the height seems to be dismissed as well, as i have mentioned that it will be 24". after seeing a 6 on a 75 (21") running all softies i find it hard to believe an 8 bulb on a 24" high tank could possibly be too much.

 

[Justin74]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7677165#post7677165 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by nemo g
thanks for the input justin,

the height seems to be dismissed as well, as i have mentioned that it will be 24". after seeing a 6 on a 75 (21") running all softies i find it hard to believe an 8 bulb on a 24" high tank could possibly be too much.

Youll be surprised. Its bright Even if you went with just 6 instead of 8 Id still recommend the shrooms to the lower half of the tank and some may still need to be shaded from direct light. I turned greenstripes and marbled blue shrooms into white shrooms at mid tank on my 20" tank w/ 6 bulbs Im just now getting to see some green after about 5-6 months now that I put a pure actinic bulb on. I think the lower PAR output may of had something to do with that. Which would be an excellent suggestion for you to consider with your softy tank. Id steer clear of the GE6500k thats just pure mushroom melter, the colors look better with the blu+ and 11k anyway IMO, plus they now have the URI superactinic which sounds like a great addition to any T5 setup. I want one mehself
Have fun man, T5's are good stuff.

-Justin

 

[David Grigor]

The point I'm making is the number of bulbs is no indicator because of so many variables from the lighting itself ( 8 bulbs with one reflectors is not equal to 8 of another and in some cases not even equal to a lesser number of bulbs ), not to mention all the non-lighting variables that exist from one tank to another.

Many people have a tendancy to DISMISS others that have NOT had a possitive experience with T5s and don't think of all of these things or even worse claim there corals are doing great when in reality they haven't had the lighting long enough to even know what the longer term effects will be....

 

[nemo g]

david,

my initial post reduced al the variables to none. i already made the choice to with the tek unit, whether its retro or fixture. so the 6 v 8 bulb discussion already has its bounderies clearly defined.

 

[David Grigor]

My point is there is no way to define ANY boundaries peroid. As the lighting fixture number of bulbs whatever, is only a few of hundreds of variables.

The only way your really going to know if by experience....... plan and simple. You can analyze it do DEATH but your not going to know until you know for your system and the corals you have....

For an LPS dominate tank having used T5s for over a year, I went back to VHOs. Doesn't mean people can't be successful just there are too many variable to determine this and even the defination of successful from one person to another can vary. Like I stated earilier that my buddy has only ever had T5s, he thinks there great but when I see his corals, I see it defferently based on my experience and what they should look like to me.....

 

[Jacob D]

David,

I think an 8-bulb setup is going to produce similar results to a 6-bulb. That said, your experience w/ T5 and your friends light corals is a fairly common issue with T5. I have been using them for over 2 years on my current tank and have seen the same thing with both LPS and SPS (some do 'ok', others become very pale), the few softies that I have actually do really well.

There are not a lot of T5 users with outstanding coloration jumping up and defending the mixed reviews on T5's. If you ask me it's because they just aren't out there in numbers. Sure there are the very few (and becoming infamous) exceptions that you can count on one hand, but more T5 users should be able to achieve better color than they have (without having to be at a TOTM level) and either don't realize that or don't want to.

There's a thread with some decent discussion about color lightening and T5 here: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=852587&perpage=&pagenumber=1


I actually think the AB bulb is partially responsible for the washed out color, be it a spectrum issue, or something else. Right now I'm experimenting with some 3000k bulbs, which sounds odd, but none the less. I can say that the perceived color of the corals looks much better, but time will tell if the coral itself colors up any better.

 

[David Grigor]

Yes, I was using the AB bulbs and also suspected that could be playing a role. Having hated the aethetics of the B+ and the 6k bulbs that didn't leave much until now with the advent of UVL bulbs. Having been a long time UVL bulb fan for VHOs I do have some hope but definately will not speculate. My show tank is back to VHOs as of last Jan., I have a 3 bulb T5 retro on a 75g grow out tank using the 2 Actinic/White and 1 SuperActinics. With my previous T5 experience it wasn't very clear until at least 6 months down the road so I don't plan to make any judgements for at least that long with the UVL bulbs. Hoping will get the effeciency and wattage reduction with T5s but the same color quality of the corals as I have seen with VHOs bulbs.

 

[nemo g]

david, im not sure why your getting so uppity.

of course there are tons of Vairables. but with any scientific query, the attempt must be made to reduce those variables that affect the study.

so, for simple and clear clarification:

we are Only comparing tek lighting, fixture or retro.
- using triad ballasts
- using tek reflectors

and then comparing the 6 bullb unit to a 8 bulb unit in the Same situation, with the Same water quality. thats it. no oher variables.

considering water quality or anything else is pointless because you can do that with ANY lighting. it does not shed any "light" onto which bulb set-up would be best. that would be like answering the "should i get a 150w halide or 250w" questions with "depends on your water quality".

the point here is to decide whether 6 or 8 bulbs can be considered required, sufficient or too much for keeping most lps corals.

if it makes it easier, consider everything else is Perfect, and now you only need the light, which needs to be selected from these two.

 

[JER-Z]

i fried a chalice w/ 4 bulbs...and I have to keep my Acan completely shaded...

I am using the Icecap stuff

 

[nemo g]

4 bulb icecap is about the same an 8 bulb tek.

 

[David Grigor]

I'm not trying to sound uppity..... Just pointing out that is just isn't that simple and honestly can't be answered, because you just can't duplicate there scenerio to be able to translate that to your success and yes all that makes a difference. In your example 150w, 250w could produce the same exact results because of the variables involved. Height of the bulbs, the corals that you comparing etc. all will make a difference . Tank with high nutrients vs. one with very low has also been proven to be a wide margin in results regardless of the lighting.

If you looking for an easy answer and money is not relevant, I would say go with the 8. worst case you can just not turn all of the lights if you see your corals aren't responding to it as you would like ( but seems like such as waste ).

I too fell under the spell that on a 5 bulb setup that all things were wonderful for the first few months which I do believe where most people are so enthusiastic and like to post how great it is. Then a year later those people can't be found. This is why posting lighting questions is just so impossible because you don't get many follow-ups.

For an LPS dominate tank, my experience is that even a 6 bulb can still cause some corals to inflate less and have lighter colors. Whether the bulb spectrums are the cause who really knows and is very difficult to pin down becuase of all the variables involved.

As far as lighting ( and I've used just about everything out there at one point in time ), over the last 11 years, haven't found lighting to show off as wide of a variety of LPS as well as VHOs ( in particular URI/UVL bulbs with icecap ballasts ) do. I'm hoping T5s UVL will be able to accomplish the same results with less wattage and less bulbs than VHOs but too soon to tell ( I'm using 3 bulbs on a 75g as a test my non-show tank ).