Negotiation is just a tool to find market value. Firm prices are inefficient in second hand markets because the market value is unstable and possibly unknowable ahead of time.
I wish I was this concise... haha. 100% agreed
Negotiation is just a tool to find market value. Firm prices are inefficient in second hand markets because the market value is unstable and possibly unknowable ahead of time.
Negotiating 101 man.
The party that names the price first loses.
asking prices can be perceived as not fair by one or both parties as can be initial offer prices. If someone rejects a deal from the pool of potential buyers/sellers, they're only shooting themselves in the foot by ignoring market value.
And that's life. If I don't think it's fair that I cannot find a house I want in my town because the prices are "too high", in my opinion, that's fine but I won't find a seller that is 'fair' to me. It may not be fair to me in my eyes but objectively the market value is the fairest because it is agreeable to a majority of buyers and sellers (who effectively create the market value)
Yep.
I always list a price with "OBO", like say $100 OBO. If someone emails me and says, "What's your best/lowest price?", I just reply with "$100 Or Best Offer".
That said, I NEVER get mad at lowball offers. Lots of people do, and they need to be thicker skinned. Like people who list "NO LOW BALLS!" in their ad. I just skip over those if I'm a buyer. If I get a lowball offer, I reply nicely that the lowest I would take is $x. I have sold several times to people who initially offered ridiculous amounts but later came up to something reasonable.
How about the sob stories?
Insert sob story here:
My car is in the shop.
I don't get paid till next week.
My kid needed money for school.
We can't afford to pay full price because of x.
Sob stories annoy me and I never respond to them. I consider them a scam. If they're not a scam, I prefer them to keep their money. They obviously should be spending it elsewhere.
How about the sob stories?
Insert sob story here:
My car is in the shop.
I don't get paid till next week.
My kid needed money for school.
We can't afford to pay full price because of x.
Sob stories annoy me and I never respond to them. I consider them a scam. If they're not a scam, I prefer them to keep their money. They obviously should be spending it elsewhere.
I agree, which is why I try to start in what is to the best of my knowledge, a fair market value. Like I said, that is a moving target which is why the negotiations are necessary. I tend to view someone selling something at exorbitantly high starting price as dishonest. Maybe they would sell if for a price I like, but id rather start with someone that shows they have a better idea of what its worth. If I am shooting myself in the foot because they would have sold it for the price I wanted, that's ok with my. If its rare, and i really want it, I might try to deal. In the other case, I might be the one who is wrong on the price, but then so might the other 3 people who have a better price listed. In which case, inherently the high baller is wrong.
Mostly are. In health care when you collect someone's H&P and they start giving you some sob story, most of the time they are drug seeking.
Negotiation is an inherently antagonistic practice. Its something for third world countries.
Tell me what the price is and I'll pay it. If you expect negotiation, that means the price youve asked is more than you really expect to get. That makes you a scammer, and I'm not longer interested in dealing with you at any price. Its an inherently antagonistic move: "lets see how much I can fleece this guy for!"
I refuse to haggle over price because I'd like to pretend we're civilized human beings. I may just ask for your price to sidestep the entire dishonest thing and cut to the chase.
Plain and simple..
You ask $100..
I might say.. "well would you take $75?"
and you say "sure"... (because you would have taken $60 so $15 more is great and that benefits you)
and now I'm thinking.. "crap.. what if I said $60"...
So by asking what is the lowest you'd take I assume I'm going to get the lowest price and not risk offering more than you would have taken as a bottom..
agreed. I guess if they ignore a perceived low-ball, either I did low-ball or they have unrealistic expectations. In either case the deal fails, just as if I, as a buyer, ignore any initial sale offers that are exorbitant. So I concede your initial point partially.
It's just, that in a thinly traded, local niche hobby market, the "fair" market value (as defined by what buyer and sellers will trade at) is not knowable until the trade has been made. If we did have a market with more buyers and sellers, then yeah it would make it easy to define a high/low ball offer (e.g. the bottom quartile of buyer's offers and the top quartile of seller's offers).
Interesting thread. I've sold stuff here, on car forums, and on ebay. This crowd is pretty good, but every group has its low ballers and tire kickers.
Ebay is the worst for low-ballers. You'll post something for sale lightly used for $175 when it's $250 new, and you get people asking you if you'll take $90 for it. Give me a break!
My buddy bought a Deep Blue tank at wholesale and decided not to use it. He threw it up on craigslist still wrapped in cellophane on a half pallet for exactly what he had paid for it, not looking to make a dime and trying to get retail for it. The only guy that offered him full ask would only pay that if my buddy delivered it to him 3 hours away. So many offers for 1/3, 1/2 what he was asking. Crazy.
My worst reefer experience was when I broke down my tank and was selling off livestock. I lined up several serious buyers and scheduled pickups. The last guy to pick up had committed to a good chunk of my livestock and had agreed to come the day I broke down. I had bagged all of his fish and corals, and when he showed up, he gave me this sob story about how he got pulled over on the way down and had to pay a fine so he couldn't afford to take everything. At this point, my tank is already drained, so I'm scrambling to find more buckets and splitting up water so I can keep the stuff he couldn't take so I could at least trade it in for pennies on the dollar at the LFS.
It's unfortunate, but a select few people can ruin it for everybody else. Nobody gets the benefit of the doubt unless they are well known members that other well known members know on a personal level.