Working on horizontal Algae Scrubber - Thoughts Wanted.

[iced98lx]

I know, horizontal isn't as good, but hear me out.

I have some space, and frankly, I don't wish to deal with the slat in the pipe, going for a bit lower upkeep (Seen too many spray/clog/etc) which will hopefully include not having a skimmer. The new design (bubbler) looks good, but I'm not yet convinced of where that will go. I am building this for a build that is not running yet, so there is plenty of time to convince me i'm crazy (and I'll listen, promise) but I wanted to build a scrubber that could grow as I add fish (being a new tank) and coral. It must not rely on another pump if possible (save power) and must not be able to plug the drains of the tank and cause an overflow (Yuck).

Here is the idea:

I have my tank in the wall, with two drains, primary drain pipes into a section of vinyl gutter, backup drain goes strait to the sump. The gutter (5 inches wide) is perfect for a two bulb fluorescent fixture or (most likely) a DIY all red LED solution. I put my mesh in the gutter, with a decent slope on the gutter. Water flows down the mesh, grows algae. I add on more mesh and lights as I up the feeding of the tank (adding more fish, coral, etc).

thoughts? I thought about making it so that the mesh is slightly elevated above the bottom of the gutter to allow flow on top and bottom of the gutter. Seems easy to clean (close main drain, allowing tank to drain into sump directly, scrape algae down and catch it at the bottom of the gutter), fairly idiot proof (no clogging slots, no pumps to go out) and fairly light on the budget (no pumps, minimal lighting costs with LED's, etc).

 

[Devaji108]

humm I am new to the ATS club but I like it. you are using what you have...oh wait it's not up and running yet.
also would just got with the DIY LED setup lot less space.
good luck and post some pics

 

[srusso]

The issue with a trough design is how long it needs to be... They work and grow algae well, but don't filter as well as the water fall design. That's the real thing we are all trying to do, get the most filtering out of the smallest amount of space... LEDs are the way to go

 

[SushiGirl]

PaulB has a trough-style one, you could do a search here.

 

[srusso]

PaulB has a trough-style one, you could do a search here.

Yes, PaulB uses a tough design, it however is not his only filter on the system. To be honest I believe he may have recently removed it from his setup, if I am not mistaken.

 

[iced98lx]

Thanks guys a quick search didn't yield PaulB's example, but I'll look more later. I know I'll need 4->5x the length in a trough, but the idea that it wont' clog (I know, most people don't have any issues) or cause problems for my tank is what is appealing. I have the space to spare (fish room) and am going for the least possible problems from the start. I haven't built or bought anything for an ATS so I can easily just say forget it and go with the waterfall design.

My real question, if sized appropriately, can a trough style ATS function as my sole filtration source in a 180g mixed reef DT with another ~~150 gallons of fuge & Sump? I want to have a Mandarin without doing massive supplements to what the tank already provides it food wise (also don't want to starve the poor guy).

While a skimmer/bubbler has it's obvious advantages, based on research a properly functioning and sized ATS should be able to handle the waste my tank will produce.

I plan to start with an oversized run (10 foot is not out of the question) and add mesh and lights as my feeding increases (add fish/etc).

Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate it!

 

[Paul B]

The gutter (5 inches wide) is perfect for a two bulb fluorescent fixture or (most likely) a DIY all red LED solution. I put my mesh in the gutter, with a decent slope on the gutter. Water flows down the mesh, grows algae.

I have the same design and it has ben working for years.

Thanks guys a quick search didn't yield PaulB's example

Thats because my name is Paul B

It's the white thing in the back.

This is an old picture before the LEDs

And so is this

 

[srusso]

Thanks guys a quick search didn't yield PaulB's example, but I'll look more later. I know I'll need 4->5x the length in a trough, but the idea that it wont' clog (I know, most people don't have any issues) or cause problems for my tank is what is appealing. I have the space to spare (fish room) and am going for the least possible problems from the start. I haven't built or bought anything for an ATS so I can easily just say forget it and go with the waterfall design.

My real question, if sized appropriately, can a trough style ATS function as my sole filtration source in a 180g mixed reef DT with another ~~150 gallons of fuge & Sump? I want to have a Mandarin without doing massive supplements to what the tank already provides it food wise (also don't want to starve the poor guy).

While a skimmer/bubbler has it's obvious advantages, based on research a properly functioning and sized ATS should be able to handle the waste my tank will produce.

I plan to start with an oversized run (10 foot is not out of the question) and add mesh and lights as my feeding increases (add fish/etc).

Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate it!

Looks like you maybe the first to find out!

 

[srusso]

Thanks for posting Paul, you still have the trough in service?

 

[iced98lx]

I have the same design and it has ben working for years.


Thats because my name is Paul B

It's the white thing in the back.

This is an old picture before the LEDs

And so is this

Knew I couldn't be the first to give it a go. Do you run a Skimmer?

 

[srusso]

This picture is of one week of growth for a well built T5 water fall algae scrubber. With LEDs this type of growth is even easier to produce. Whereas a good set of T5's and reflectors where needed in the past, LEDs seem to do it much easier. I have my first set coming in the mail so I can test for myself. Current rule of thumb for LEDs are 5:1 ratio red ~660nm to blue ~450nm.

(fyi, I believe the algae was rinsed to make it look nice for the picture. ;-) )


BUT I cant blame you for wanting to try... I have been doing my own "testing" since day one, almost 2 years ago now.

 

[iced98lx]

This picture is of one week of growth for a well built T5 water fall algae scrubber. With LEDs this type of growth is even easier to produce. Whereas a good set of T5's and reflectors where needed in the past, LEDs seem to do it much easier. I have my first set coming in the mail so I can test for myself. Current rule of thumb for LEDs are 5:1 ratio red ~660nm to blue ~450nm.

(fyi, I believe the algae was rinsed to make it look nice for the picture. ;-) )


BUT I cant blame you for wanting to try... I have been doing my own "testing" since day one, almost 2 years ago now.

not saying in any way that I am improving on the design. the waterfall ATS is obviously efficient, and a great way of doing things, just trying to meet my personal needs. Right now it's something that can easily grow from a dead system (ghost feeding) to a 180 gallon mixed reef (end goal). I'm checking out a possible slight modification to the waterfall style to avoid some of the pitfalls I've read about, since the two sided design allows for so much better algae growth. I know I'm not re-inventing the wheel here, but there seems to be some room for innovation.

 

[neptunestender]

a possible innovation for the trough style would be ( like you said) raise the screen off the trough plus make the trough from a clear material and add leds to the bottom giving you a twosided trough. just a thought although it would increase build cost might pay off in the long run.

 

[iced98lx]

a possible innovation for the trough style would be ( like you said) raise the screen off the trough plus make the trough from a clear material and add leds to the bottom giving you a twosided trough. just a thought although it would increase build cost might pay off in the long run.

originally part of the design trade off was that I'd sacrifice the two sided growing for the ease of upkeep and lack of potential water issues with the single piece gutter, but now I'm thinking a U channel made of strips of acrylic could work out and allow lighting from both sides. but that led me to a better vertical method that may solve some of my perceived issues. There is just a TON of reading on this subject on RC and beyond, so I'm still making sure I understand where a softie + fish tank will and in the world of skimmerless tank upkeep, and going from there.

 

[Cloudburst2000]

I also think Inland Aquatics makes a trough design ATS though they say it's not a 'true' ATS because of the design. I saw one of their hang-on-the-side trough designs at INDMAS in April.