Yet 1 more Vodka Dosing Experiment

[inkandtonerman]

I have not posted very often, but i have been reading everything i can on this forum to steal as much beneficial information as possible from you fine folks. My sincerest thanks to everyone for sharing your expertise and knowledge base. The information i have found in RC has truly enhanced my reef-keeping experience as a whole.

With the intent of giving back something to the forum, i will continually update this thread with my own Vodka Dosing experiment i am starting tonight. Hopefully my fellow newbies will find this thread helpful and be less intimidated to ask "dumb questions" as i am at times on threads started by much more experienced reefers. Like most newbies i don't even know all of the lingo yet myself, so i will be typing critical terms out longhand to keep the information flow as clear as possible for us less experienced hobbyists.

Current Setup:
75gal glass tank w/ single built-in corner overflow
15gal sump. not lit.
Red Sea Berlin Protein Skimmer
3 Wavemakers
External Magnum Canister Filter - for both carbon and phosphate removal media (i use PhosBan GFO)
4 Compact Actinics
6 Blue LED Moonlights
2 Halides - 250W 15K HQI

Current Residents:
1 Fiji Blue Damsel
1 Purple Dottyback
1 Tomato Clown
1 Lawnmower Blenny
1 Six-Line Wrasse
1 Goby (i do not recall what kind. he hides in the largest live rock holes and only comes out to feed. very cool though)
1 Banded Coral Shrimp
1 Cleaner Shrimp
1 Sally Light Foot Crab
2 Emerald Crabs
Many assorted snails and hermits make up my cleanup crew.
6 Green Mushroom Corals
2 Red Mushroom Corals
6 Polyps of Orange Head Zoos
2 Kenya Tree Frags
1 Green Goniopora
6 Orange Ricordeas
3 Green Ricordeas

Current Problems:
Ridiculously high nitrates - color is as dark red as the 250ppm value on the "high level" scale of my Red Sea NO3 test kit. my actual nitrate level could be even higher than 250, but i have no way to tell as 250ppm is the highest level measured on my test kit. lets just say my starting nitrates are depressing and leave it at that.

Hair algae - small hair algae problem. is not getting any worse believe it or not, but is not getting any better either. Every Sunday i go to town with my toothbrush and siphon hose. Between my efforts and my clean-up crew, we seem to keep it in check. But it is far from visually appealing.

Kenya Trees not opening - i have 2 Kenya Tree coral frags. neither of which are opening. i have both in a medium light, medium flow area of the tank and neither will open. problem has been going on almost 2 weeks since i brought them home. i have read that they like to close up normally for a few days, then almost always bounce back, but it has been about 2 weeks and they are still closed. 1 of them opens a very little bit, but that is all.

Current Water Quality Parameters:
Temp - 76deg Fahrenheit
Calcium - 425ppm
Alk - could not test current alk tonight. new test kit in transit.
pH - 8.2
Phosphate - .1ppm
Nitrate - at least 250ppm. see above.

Experiment Starting Notes:
I plan to dose exactly matching the regimen detailed by Nathaniel A. Walton (Genetics) and Matt Bjornson (Stony_Corals). I am not sure if i am allowed to post the link to their article on reefkeeping*dot*com, so i did not, but i will be happy to PM it to you if you need it. Great read.

I estimate my net water volume (NWV) to be 60gal give or take, so according to the dosing instructions my starting dose is .26ml. I am using a syringe with .01ml precision to correctly measure each daily dose.

I will be adding 7ml of MB7 (MicroBacter 7 from Brightwell Aquatics) simultaneously with every daily vodka dose. I like the idea of introducing beneficial bacteria to seed the organic carbon source i am now adding, so i have decided to add this variable to the experiment.

Conclusion:
Well, i guess that is it. Day 1 just started when i added my first vodka dose 2 minutes ago. Now seems like a perfect time for The Lord's Prayer...

Date.............Nitrate Reading........NO3 Kit Level........Vodka Dosage
3/28/2011.............>250....................High Scale...............(.26ml)
3/29/2011

 

[jimmy frag]

i think you may want to double cheeck your test kits. i find it vary hard to believe the cleaner shrimp would servive such high levels of nitrates, not to mention the goniopora

 

[inkandtonerman]

thank you Jimmy for your input. i am using the Red Sea brand NO3 test kit. it is approx 18 months old, but the caps were very tight on both reagent bottles.

can you recommend a reliable brand NO3 test kit so i can double-check my figures? i will post the results of my 2nd test as soon as the new kit arrives.

 

[Enzel]

I would try with an Elos NO3 test kit.

 

[HV1990]

that seems like a small bio load. What is your feeding schedule like

 

[HighlandReefer]

I agree that you shoud get another opinion on your nitrate kit. If your nitrate level is above 100 ppm, vodka dosing is going to take a very long time. To reduce this time, you would need to do a bunch of 15-20% water changes to reduce your nitrate level down to more manageable levels for vodka dosing.

 

[HighlandReefer]

FWIW, in a 75 gallon total water volume system, five 15 gallon water changes would reduce 100 ppm nitrate down to about 34 ppm which is much more reasonable.

If your nitrate level were 200 ppm, it would take eight 15 gallon water changes to reduce it down to about 35 ppm nitrate. 35 ppm is around the high end for safe nitrate levels for many coral according to some research.

 

[bertoni]

You could try testing some RO/DI water and perhaps some freshly-mixed saltwater as a form of sanity test for your kit. I agree that a second opinion would be good, too.

 

[inkandtonerman]

i think you may want to double cheeck your test kits. i find it vary hard to believe the cleaner shrimp would servive such high levels of nitrates, not to mention the goniopora

Spot on Jimmy. I stopped by the LFS on my way home from work, grabbed an API brand NO3 test kit, and tested as soon as i walked in the door.

Correction on first post - NO3 level - is actually 20ppm.

I feel so much better now. I realize 20 is still very high, but at least i am on the color chart now! Start point 20... goal 0.

 

[inkandtonerman]

that seems like a small bio load. What is your feeding schedule like

I feed a very small amount 2-3 times a day. I alternate between:
Formula 1 Flakes
Formula 2 Flakes
Frozen Cubes (another complete formula)
SweetWater brand Zooplankton
Live Rotifers

Do you think i am feeding too much? too little?

 

[bertoni]

How much live rock is in the system? That could be an issue. Also, that skimmer gets fairly poor reviews. A better skimmer might help. I would guess that you're feeding too much for the filtration currently in the tank.

 

[HanoverFist]

Don't forge to rinse those frozen cubes. Thaw in ro/di and strain them through a net. Don't add the water they were frozen in to your tank.

 

[inkandtonerman]

How much live rock is in the system? That could be an issue. Also, that skimmer gets fairly poor reviews. A better skimmer might help. I would guess that you're feeding too much for the filtration currently in the tank.

There is well over 100 pounds of quality live rock in the tank w/ almost complete purple/pink coralline growth on all light-exposed surfaces.

Although i have also read that others have not rated the Berlin skimmer highly, i have steady dark brown liquid in the cup, so it must be doing something right! I had to replace the pump once, but other than that, i have no complaints on the skimmer. I am looking forward to seeing the black sludge in the skimmer cup that others who dose vodka have described once their dosing regimen is into it's 2nd or 3rd week. If i don't see a sharp increase in skimmed waste by the end of week 3, i too will question my skimmer and begin researching a suitable high-end replacement.

 

[tmz]

The api test kit is a good choice for higher ranges. As you get down under 5ppm ,the salifert works well,ime.

20ppm is not bad and I think it's ok to start vodka dosing at that level but a bit lower would be better.
You could use some vinegar in lieu of some or all of the vodka. If you wish to just use 8ml of vinegar to replace 1 ml of 80 proof vodka to make up for the dilution difference; 80 proof vodka is 60% water and white vinegar is 95% water.
What's in the canister filter. Sponges and denitrifying media like bioballs or ceramic media can contribute to nitrate in the waer column.
In my opinion there is no benefit to the MB 7 bacterial supplement. The aquarium will generate it's own endemic sustainable bacterial population once the organic carbon is introduced.

Running gfo is good. Skimming is important for aeration and organic exp[ort. Running some granulated activated carbon for organics export is very good.

 

[mightymizz]

The api test kit is a good choice for higher ranges. As you get down under 5ppm ,the salifert works well,ime.

Not to thread hijack, but it is SO difficult to read the Salifert test results looking through the tiny amount of water? Any tips?

 

[Ann Marie]

Looking forward to hearing more about your tank. I just started vodka dosing last week.

Last night, I asked my family if they noticed anything different with my reef tank. My husband asked if I had just cleaned it because it looked so clear. I hadn't and wasn't sure if I was being biased on the actual clarity because of hearing reports of clearer water or if it was true that my water was clearer. I tried to form the conversation questions open ended without any prompting.

Have you noticed anything new with your tank?

 

[tmz]

A wise man once told me if you drink the vodka you're tank will look better. Seriously, many report increased water clarity when dosing.

 

[HV1990]

I would feed once a day. If your tank has been up for some time their are plenty of critters in there for them to munch on. Fish will graze all day.

I could feed once and hour and my fish would act like they are starving.

 

[inkandtonerman]

Looking forward to hearing more about your tank. I just started vodka dosing last week.

Last night, I asked my family if they noticed anything different with my reef tank. My husband asked if I had just cleaned it because it looked so clear. I hadn't and wasn't sure if I was being biased on the actual clarity because of hearing reports of clearer water or if it was true that my water was clearer. I tried to form the conversation questions open ended without any prompting.

Have you noticed anything new with your tank?

Hello Ann Marie. I would say that the water is the clearest i can ever remember it being. That is a tough metric to judge because i regularly use activated carbon in my canister filter, but i must admit i can see clear through the long length of the tank, side to side, with absolutely zero cloudiness or yellowing.

Update: Day 3 and NO3 still at 20ppm.

 

[bertoni]

The Gonipora might have some issues with the nitrate at 20 ppm, but the other animals will be fine. I'd likely cut back feeding a bit, and ignore the nitrate as long as the animals are healthy.