Algae Scrubber Basics

[Floyd R Turbo]

It's not that they don't work, it's that there are too many aspects of them that need to be addressed, so they're more difficult to build.

In particular, the oscillating function seems to be particularly important to making them effective. A simple horizontal slanted channel will work and will grow algae, but it won't be as effective as it would be if you made it a dumping-style horizontal scrubber. Also, they are inherently single sided.

A horizontal screen for 1 cube/day of feeding needs to be 4x as large, so 48 sq in minimum. 8x8 would be good.

Then, the flow needs to be no more than 3/4" deep over the screen, and the lighting needs to be at a minimum 2 W / sq in of surface area, or about 100W of CFL. Preferrably more, as much as 200W total.

For LEDs you would go by the "high light" configuration of 1 660nm 3W @700mA for every 4 sq in, or 12 LEDs. That refers to 3W LEDs on star PCBs. If you go with a stock fixture, it's kind of a case by case basis, and there will be a little rolling of the dice. I would go with the 50W one instead of the 20W one.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Horizontal or vertical? I don't think either are bad. For space I believe vertical Is the way to go yet if you have the room then the horizontal. It looks like most bug aquariums use the horizontal scrubbers.
Bryopsis is a little difficult IMHO. If that is what you have.

This is what my tank looked like a few months back. I have found out that bryopsis is neither light or nutrient dependent. It does need nutrients in the beginning but once it goes asexual you have to go another route because it will
Multiply even in the cleanest tanks.

Oh, the evil Tapatalk tags issue continues to strike.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2292517

Anyways.

Inland Aquatics is famous for using dump bucket scrubbers. Other than that, I don't really know of any major aquarium that uses an algae scrubber currently, if you know of one, please share. My guess is that if there are ones out there using them, they have been using them for much longer than the vertical waterfall scrubbers have been around.

All that being said, there is no true comparison testing to prove which one is actually better. Honestly the success rate with vertical scrubbers and all that has been learned being applied "backwards" to the horizontal scrubber might reveal some surprising results. I'm still waiting for that grant so I can quit my job and become a full time algaeologist :dance:

 

[daytek]

To the guys that are using this kind of light,how are you finding them so far ?

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

4999

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

5000!!

I was hoping to have the "Algae Scrubber Basics" revised for post 5000 but alas, I have not had enough free time to get it done. It's in the works though...

 

[BCool]

To the guys that are using this kind of light,how are you finding them so far ?

I may be the only one, I haven't had it up long enough to give a great review. I can tell you that it has a great flood, not much spotlighting and I do not have burn spots on my screen. The growth seems to be even.

I can try to take an updated picture of the screen tonight so you can see the growth pattern.

I am using it on a new tank (still cycling) so I don't have a seasoned screen or any growth comparisons to show. Also, it doesn't really look like I have the nice green algea yet. Mine is more of the brown stuff. I wish I could be more help, but the light seems to be great. I think it's worth a gamble, especially is you have been using compact flourescents and want to try LED's.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Plus it looks like it is waterproof not to mention built like a tank

 

[daytek]

Plus it looks like it is waterproof not to mention built like a tank

Thats true looks like it was made for the job :lmao: Is the light okay for a AS


Wavelength : Red 660nm;Blue 445nm

 

[daytek]

I may be the only one, I haven't had it up long enough to give a great review. I can tell you that it has a great flood, not much spotlighting and I do not have burn spots on my screen. The growth seems to be even.

I can try to take an updated picture of the screen tonight so you can see the growth pattern.

I am using it on a new tank (still cycling) so I don't have a seasoned screen or any growth comparisons to show. Also, it doesn't really look like I have the nice green algea yet. Mine is more of the brown stuff. I wish I could be more help, but the light seems to be great. I think it's worth a gamble, especially is you have been using compact flourescents and want to try LED's.

Yes please,would love to see some pictures of it in action

:thumbsup:

 

[BCool]

Plus it looks like it is waterproof not to mention built like a tank

Very true!

 

[JustinGr]

In regards to dump, horizontal or vertical screens, Inland has several new styles they are making. The racer has it horizontal and no dump, they have two dump tray now, and some vertical styles. LED lit, Halide Lit, T5 lit, etc. Morgan and crew are working hard on new designs for all style of systems. For the money and space for people that can't dedicate a sump or space in a sump, the racer ATScrubber is the way from what I have seen.

I use the large ATScrubber sump style, but I have 3 fish in a 75 reef, and the bio load is not enough to support a large screen, so I use a fraction of the screen and it makes a big difference.

 

[daytek]

Thats true looks like it was made for the job :lmao: Is the light okay for a AS


Wavelength : Red 660nm;Blue 445nm

I should have said,i know the red part is fine,its just that blue part Im not sure about




.

 

[BCool]

Check post 4492

Optional: Supplementation with 440-450nm Royal Blue. These have a much higher radiant flux level than the Deep Reds, so it is rather easy to overpower the screen and cause photosynthetic saturation (I have inaccurately called this "photoinhibition" in the past) which prevents algae from actually growing. I recommend wiring blues in a parallel configuration within the series string of reds so that they act as a current divider and run at 350mA.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

In regards to dump, horizontal or vertical screens, Inland has several new styles they are making. The racer has it horizontal and no dump, they have two dump tray now, and some vertical styles. LED lit, Halide Lit, T5 lit, etc. Morgan and crew are working hard on new designs for all style of systems. For the money and space for people that can't dedicate a sump or space in a sump, the racer ATScrubber is the way from what I have seen.

I use the large ATScrubber sump style, but I have 3 fish in a 75 reef, and the bio load is not enough to support a large screen, so I use a fraction of the screen and it makes a big difference.

I spent some time talking with Derek of Beef's Reef a while back and he told me the same, that Morgan is constantly working on projects. I just went to their site and I see their product quick descriptions and prices but no pictures, not even on the forum which doesn't really look to be active for the past year. So I guess you have to live near Terre Haute to see their products. Not even a cruddy cell phone camera pic for a $700 scrubber, really? I think I can see the reason why he claims it has taken 20 years trying to get his product into the mainstread without success - zero marketing!

He claims (as does Adey) that turf algae boasts 10 to 100 times the nutrient absorbing capacity of other algaes. I'm willing to bet a lot of $$ that information is based on 30 year old data, because that's all we have, scientifically.

...and we probably will never have that data, because there is no money in it for anyone.

 

[herring_fish]

Inland Aquatics is famous for using dump bucket scrubbers. Other than that, I don't really know of any major aquarium that uses an algae scrubber currently, if you know of one, please share. My guess is that if there are ones out there using them, they have been using them for much longer than the vertical waterfall scrubbers have been around.

The history of the coral reef exhibit began in 1980 at the Smithsonian Institution's National Museum of Natural History in Washington, DC.

The Station, a facility of the National Museum of Natural History, is part of the Smithsonian Institution in Washington, DC. It move to Fort Pierce, from DC, in 1998.

http://www.sms.si.edu/SMEE/behindthescenes.htm

I got a tour in the mid 90.s and they were using great big horizontal scrubbers . They had bump buckets splashing on them to get turbulence which reduces matting, increases growth rates and gets rid of detritus from the screen.

I first used this style scrubber in the early 90's and then built a dump bucket style scrubber that I still use today. I got the design from the book Dynamic Aquaria which was written by the curator of the exhibit.

Won't Floyd's 3D scrubber work?

 

[herring_fish]

I think that flood lamp might work for my scrubber. I like it because I want to reduce heat where ever I can.

I have a 48" by 6" one sided screen, 3 inches deep. I would have the light(s) about 2 or 3 inches off of the water with no glass in between.
Would I need two of the high watt output versions?

By the way, my first scrubber use a 300 Watt outdoor flood lamp that was halogen. We have come a long way baby.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

They had bump buckets splashing on them to get turbulence which reduces matting, increases growth rates and gets rid of detritus from the screen.

The reduction in matting discussed here is referring to what happens when you don't use a surging system - the water takes the path of least resistance around the growing algae. So the surge is needed in a horizontal to make it effective.

The vertical screen has this effect also, but it is much more self-correcting. The algae mat grows and pushes water around / away from the growth, but additional growth in the now higher flow area will force the water away from it. Plus, water can only flow down and through the mat, it can't just go around it like it can in a raceway.

As far as detritus goes, I think again this is a horizontal issue as detritus would tend to settle on the horizontal mat and form a layer of muck without agitation. Not an issue with a vertical screen, only seen this issue with doubled-up screens which trap detritus (which is why you don't want a 2 layer screen)

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

I think that flood lamp might work for my scrubber. I like it because I want to reduce heat where ever I can.

I have a 48" by 6" one sided screen, 3 inches deep. I would have the light(s) about 2 or 3 inches off of the water with no glass in between.
Would I need two of the high watt output versions?

By the way, my first scrubber use a 300 Watt outdoor flood lamp that was halogen. We have come a long way baby.

We haven't seen pics of your scrubber lately, I know you revamped it a while back and had some issues, is it still kicking?

Yes I think these fixtures would be perfect for yours.

 

[lewk]

If I could make room for a 1-cube vertical ATS, would two 10 watt versions of those lights suffice, one on each side? I realize that's hard to say, since we don't know much about these lights, but in theory...

 

[herring_fish]

A basic vertical scrubber shouldn't build up any detritus.
Basic vertical and horizontal scrubbers have the same potential problem with matting, although the horizontal style is much worse. That is why you shouldn't delay harvesting algae when needed. Matting normally comes from a lack of turbulence.

A simple surge of water speed does not help either basic H or V style scrubbers because the same path of least resistance is not changed much by faster water.

The 3D style scrubber doesn't have as much of a problem with matting because the strands go out and away from the screen instead of lying flat and parallel to each other as they align with the water flow direction. That is why, I would think that with a 3D scrubber you can be less strict in a prompt harvesting schedule and still get await with it.

My new light fixture got rebuilt and that works well but my zero algae growth issue apparently is not a lighting problem. I am thinking that it is a nitrate limitation problem.