Algae Scrubber Basics

My scrubber, a horizontal unit, well almost, it drops about an inch and a half over its length, is 2"x2"x19" long, lit by 2 9-watt real watt 660 LED light strips and runs 24/7 on a moderate populated tank. The screen is mortared and is 2"x14". NO3 is typically 0 and PO4 is 5ppb usually. Question: why does my screen grow a 1/4" algae mat at the inlet and virtually no growth on the last 2" of the screen? I lean towards thinking it is an insufficient nutrients. Any other ideas or experience? Thanks, jimbo
 
My scrubber, a horizontal unit, well almost, it drops about an inch and a half over its length, is 2"x2"x19" long, lit by 2 9-watt real watt 660 LED light strips and runs 24/7 on a moderate populated tank. The screen is mortared and is 2"x14". NO3 is typically 0 and PO4 is 5ppb usually. Question: why does my screen grow a 1/4" algae mat at the inlet and virtually no growth on the last 2" of the screen? I lean towards thinking it is an insufficient nutrients. Any other ideas or experience? Thanks, jimbo
How do you find the horizontal unit? I'm planning one for my nano with similar dimensions (maybe slightly shorter) fed by the main drain.
 
It's a DIY ATS that spans the top of the tank (10G temporary) across the back with its left (inlet) end on top of the rim and the right end (exit) about one half inch below the water line. Pump (small Eheim) feeds through the bottom with exit slit on the right end. Screen laws flat on the bottom with light on top. Cleaning is lift light, lift screen, scrape, drop back in and replace lights. Total maybe one minute. Dead silen and uses a total of 20 watts. Whole unit lifts out cause the pump is attached to the bottom. Not sure if it is too efficient or not. It is the only mechanical filtration. No skimmer or external pads. Two fat clowns, a few softies and lips and a ton of zoas populate. Running on kalkwasser.
 
It's a DIY ATS that spans the top of the tank (10G temporary) across the back with its left (inlet) end on top of the rim and the right end (exit) about one half inch below the water line. Pump (small Eheim) feeds through the bottom with exit slit on the right end. Screen laws flat on the bottom with light on top. Cleaning is lift light, lift screen, scrape, drop back in and replace lights. Total maybe one minute. Dead silen and uses a total of 20 watts. Whole unit lifts out cause the pump is attached to the bottom. Not sure if it is too efficient or not. It is the only mechanical filtration. No skimmer or external pads. Two fat clowns, a few softies and lips and a ton of zoas populate. Running on kalkwasser.

Thanks, that sounds pretty much like what I've planned, except for the way the water is fed in. Just need to get building :)
 
why does my screen grow a 1/4" algae mat at the inlet and virtually no growth on the last 2" of the screen?

Because of the high air/water interface turbulence where the water hits the screen. It's not the nutrients; they would measure the same at both ends.

IP65 is just resistant to low pressure spray from any direction

At most. The one I bought just had a rubber washer sealing the glass; any spray into the top of the washer would leak into it and down on to the wires.
 
Weekend growth pics:
 

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....

At most. The one I bought just had a rubber washer sealing the glass; any spray into the top of the washer would leak into it and down on to the wires.

Then it's not properly rated or properly sealed to meet the rating. ;)


IP60 Protected from total dust ingress. Not protected from liquids.
IP61 Protected from total dust ingress. Protected from condensation.
IP62 Protected from total dust ingress. Protected from water spray less than 15 degrees from vertical.
IP63 Protected from total dust ingress. Protected from water spray less than 60 degrees from vertical.
IP64 Protected from total dust ingress. Protected from water spray from any direction.
IP65 Protected from total dust ingress. Protected from low pressure water jets from any direction.
IP66 Protected from total dust ingress. Protected from high pressure water jets from any direction.
IP67 Protected from total dust ingress. Protected from immersion between 15 centimeters and 1 meter in depth.
IP68 Protected from total dust ingress. Protected from long term immersion up to a specified pressure.
IP69K Protected from total dust ingress. Protected from steam-jet cleaning.
 
"Because of the high air/water interface turbulence where the water hits the screen. It's not the nutrients; they would measure the same at both ends."

SantaMonica, can you offer a bit of rudimentary information on what is "...turbulence" and how it can be corrected/controlled? Thanks, Jimbo
 
"Dynamic Aquaria" is a whole book on it. It's about getting rid of the boundary layer; here's how you do it with bubbles, but any turbulence helps in a similar fashion:
 

My comment might be too late but it's not a huge deal...side drains are very inefficient. The issue seems to be related to flow dynamics.

A bottom drain with a straight shot down where the pipe terminates under the waterline will work a couple different ways, but primarily it will try to siphon. So if the incoming flow is too low for the volume the drain can handle but high enough to close off the pipe, it will gurgle and flush. Adding a valve will allow you to tune it so that it won't siphon and flush or gurgle, but you have to get it dead on perfect without a secondary drain (and it has to stay balanced perfectly, tricky)

my experience is that a side drain doens't work quite the same but admittedly I never put a control valve on a side drain, so theoretically it should be tunable, but the entire opening would have to be sumberged, or you would have to have a drain on the other side that is roughly at the same level (maybe 1/4 to 1/2 diameter higher), so that the "balanced" flow water level in the box was maintained even though it was not covering the entire bulkhead opening, the siphon would "start" actually inside the pipe at the elbow. Hard to explain in writing but the valve on the side drain would control the level in the side drain pipe so that it was at the same level as inside the box, or maybe only slightly below it, maybe 1/2 way up the opening of the bulkhead. The issue is that if you start to get higher and are almost covering up the entire bulkhead inside the box, the water motion will suck water in and you will get microbubbles galore as well as sucking noises. so a 1" pipe size bulkhead is going to be difficult on a side drain, looks like you're using maybe 1.5 or 1.25 so that's better.

I can tell you without a doubt that the high side drain is not going to do anything for you - at all. Trust me on this one, I've made them with a high secondary/emergency drain and it doesn't work like you expect, it'll be like it's not there at all. I've made them with a very low secondary drain (with a primary bottom drain) and even that doesn't work as well as you think. Don't feel bad, there are several manufacturers out there building systems with drains configured like this, low side drain, high secondary, and lots of DIYers following that design, so one would think that this is the way to go - and it's not a horrible idea to have a high secondary drain, because it does offer some level of protection, but it's far from a 100% fail safe. If you have a 100% sudden blockage of the primary drain, the box will quickly fill up and very likely overflow, because side drain flow dynamics really suck.

I would made the secondary just slightly above the level of the primary, maybe 1/2" above it or so. Am I right that those are 1.5" side drains or are then 1.25"? They look larger than 1"

Also use Street Elbows through the uniseals if you want to save yourself some side-to-side space
 
Actually now that I look at that pic again, I would make the current low side drain the secondary and cut a new hole for the primary drain so that it's as low as you can possibly get on the right had side.
 
Excuse my noobishness,

Are the drains there because the ATS is in a "sealed" box; ergo, the drains let water out of the box? I was under the impression the bottom was not sealed
 
The lower the screen is to the water, the less you need a bottom or a drain. And of course if you go under the water (with bubbles) then you don't need a drain either.
 
My comment might be too late but it's not a huge deal...side drains are very inefficient. The issue seems to be related to flow dynamics.

A bottom drain with a straight shot down where the pipe terminates under the waterline will work a couple different ways, but primarily it will try to siphon. So if the incoming flow is too low for the volume the drain can handle but high enough to close off the pipe, it will gurgle and flush. Adding a valve will allow you to tune it so that it won't siphon and flush or gurgle, but you have to get it dead on perfect without a secondary drain (and it has to stay balanced perfectly, tricky)

my experience is that a side drain doens't work quite the same but admittedly I never put a control valve on a side drain, so theoretically it should be tunable, but the entire opening would have to be sumberged, or you would have to have a drain on the other side that is roughly at the same level (maybe 1/4 to 1/2 diameter higher), so that the "balanced" flow water level in the box was maintained even though it was not covering the entire bulkhead opening, the siphon would "start" actually inside the pipe at the elbow. Hard to explain in writing but the valve on the side drain would control the level in the side drain pipe so that it was at the same level as inside the box, or maybe only slightly below it, maybe 1/2 way up the opening of the bulkhead. The issue is that if you start to get higher and are almost covering up the entire bulkhead inside the box, the water motion will suck water in and you will get microbubbles galore as well as sucking noises. so a 1" pipe size bulkhead is going to be difficult on a side drain, looks like you're using maybe 1.5 or 1.25 so that's better.

I can tell you without a doubt that the high side drain is not going to do anything for you - at all. Trust me on this one, I've made them with a high secondary/emergency drain and it doesn't work like you expect, it'll be like it's not there at all. I've made them with a very low secondary drain (with a primary bottom drain) and even that doesn't work as well as you think. Don't feel bad, there are several manufacturers out there building systems with drains configured like this, low side drain, high secondary, and lots of DIYers following that design, so one would think that this is the way to go - and it's not a horrible idea to have a high secondary drain, because it does offer some level of protection, but it's far from a 100% fail safe. If you have a 100% sudden blockage of the primary drain, the box will quickly fill up and very likely overflow, because side drain flow dynamics really suck.

I would made the secondary just slightly above the level of the primary, maybe 1/2" above it or so. Am I right that those are 1.5" side drains or are then 1.25"? They look larger than 1"

Also use Street Elbows through the uniseals if you want to save yourself some side-to-side space

No that is 1" PVC

The top is 3/4"

Part of the reason I went on the side was because I wanted the bottom of the screen to be under water.

Couldn't this problem be solved with a small hole in the drain?
 
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