asm or octopus skimmer

[RichConley]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10462148#post10462148 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kodyboy
for a 72 gallon tank an ex-1 would be fine, an ex-2 is not needed.
A DAS ex-1 would be a much better skimmer than an octpus nw150, the nw150 is non-recirc and its pump is not nearly as good, even with the old pump it is still not as good as a DAS ex-1, bigger or not.

KodyBoy, an EX-1 is a clone of an APF600. I ran an AP600, and it couldnt keep up with my 58g tank. I can't see how it would even come close to running a decently stocked 72. Its just too small.


I've run both a NW150, and the AP600, and IMO, yeah, the AP600 may work as well out of the box, but with about 10 minutes worht of meshmodding on the octopus, and the AP600 can't even come close.

 

[glassbox-design]

if fed from your overflow i see no reason why a ex-1 of apf600 wouldnt keep up with your tank, but who knows.

and rich, your mods are hardly in the same league for your average aquarist. :lol:

 

[kodyboy]

Rich,
I think your modding expertise probably equals $100-$200 of skimmer cost so keep that in mine for the poor people (like myself) who are not nearly as good at modding

 

[RichConley]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10466715#post10466715 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Flint&Eric
if fed from your overflow i see no reason why a ex-1 of apf600 wouldnt keep up with your tank, but who knows.

and rich, your mods are hardly in the same league for your average aquarist. :lol:

No, but a simple meshwheel is a 10 minute job that anyone can do.

 

[kodyboy]

but the meshmod (yes that is simple) will not make it an equal to the DAS ex-1. Now recirc it and change some plumbing and it is a different story, but that takes far more expertise. In addition you probably need a better pump.

 

[torino06]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10467167#post10467167 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kodyboy
but the meshmod (yes that is simple) will not make it an equal to the DAS ex-1. Now recirc it and change some plumbing and it is a different story, but that takes far more expertise. In addition you probably need a better pump.

what exactly is "the mesh mod"??????

 

[kodyboy]

A meshmod is when you remove the pins/needles of a typical pinwheel/needlewheel impellar and replace them with mesh, usually enkmat or some other stiff fibrous plastic. Some people just weave fishing line in and around the needles and or pins or just add the enkmat to the pins without removing them. Do a search on RC and you will get lots of threads.

 

[jgs107]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10474881#post10474881 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by torino06
what exactly is "the mesh mod"??????

do a search for the mod.basically its when you trim off all the stems on your pump wheel and zip tie 3M scrub pad to the wheel.works pretty good for someone who doesnt know a whole lot about modifying things

 

[RichConley]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10467167#post10467167 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kodyboy
but the meshmod (yes that is simple) will not make it an equal to the DAS ex-1. Now recirc it and change some plumbing and it is a different story, but that takes far more expertise. In addition you probably need a better pump.

A 30+ scfh single pass 6" skimmer is going to easily handle a 15 scfh recirc. IMO, the mesh mod makes it a MUCH better skimmer than an EX-1.


Recirc skimmers are nice, but recircing doesnt make up for inadequate air draw, and small size.


I dont know what your fascination is Kody, its like every month you pick a different skimmer, and every post you make is about how awesome that skimmer is. Last month it was some HOB skimmer, now its the EX-1.

Theyre nice skimmers, but dont have all that much capacity, because theyre small.

 

[kodyboy]

rich so you are saying that with just a meshmod your are getting 850+ lph out of an octopus pump? From what I have been reading even the older pumps had a hard time pulling that and the newer ones do not even come close. If you are getting 850+ lph out of a simple meshmod then it is pulling lots more air and is better.

I keep finding better and better skimmers DAS (if you are not modding) is a really good skimmer for the money, with good pumps and good workmanship.
I still regularly promote the typhoon for smaller tanks as a good, cheap HOB, and often promote other cheaper skimmers (odyssea ps160, ps75, via-aqua sk200 etc.) for people who do not have much cash but want a unit that will work reasonably well out of the box.
I used to like the aquaeurousa skimmers, and they still have their strengths, but the whole rusty pump issue soured me on them.

Size is helpful, but by no means the main marker for skimmer performance. Good pumps, decent flow design, neck size etc. all play a factor. Out of the box an octopus nw200 is not better than a das ex-1, it is bigger, just not better. With mods it can be, but many people do not want to mod their equipment.

 

[RichConley]

I'm getting 1500 lph out of my OTP3000. If you can't get 800, you really screwed up. 800 out of a OTP 2000 isnt even all that hard. I've seen 800 out of an OTP1000, although that takes some real knowledge.

Out of the box an octopus nw200 is not better than a das ex-1, it is bigger, just not better.

I completely, 100% disagree. I've run both. On the same tank. At the same time. It was pretty damn clear which one was working better.

 

[kysard1]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10475685#post10475685 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RichConley
I'm getting 1500 lph out of my OTP3000. If you can't get 800, you really screwed up. 800 out of a OTP 2000 isnt even all that hard. I've seen 800 out of an OTP1000, although that takes some real knowledge.



I completely, 100% disagree. I've run both. On the same tank. At the same time. It was pretty damn clear which one was working better.

You obviously haven't ran the OTP 2000 that they are shipping now. It is absolutely nothing like the old pump.

 

[kodyboy]

if you can get that sort of air out of those pumps more power to you, and if you can why in the world does octopus not make them that way in the first place?

 

[dhnguyen]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10477380#post10477380 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kodyboy
if you can get that sort of air out of those pumps more power to you, and if you can why in the world does octopus not make them that way in the first place?

when was the last time you bought a skimmer that you thought worked perfect right out of the box and couldn't use an improvement or 2?

 

[kodyboy]

An improvement or two is not two to four times the base performance, that is an overhaul!

 

[JCTewks]

I beliave that all but one or two skimmers sold can be modified in one or more ways that will make them far better skimmers than they are stock. Most skimmer manufacturers don't put all of the R&D that they should into there skimmers...If they'd just read through the DIY forum of RC

But really, you can take an ER and mod it to get more air, and better skimate...or a DAS, BM, H&S, Deltec, etc....go on down the line. Heck I just modded a Lifereef VS34 venturi driven skimmer to get 50SCFH....and it was only 5SCFH stock...talk about poor design, 5-10SCFh into a 6"X36" body, and rated at 200g system...HA, now that's poor R&D if you ask me.

I would much rather spend under $500 on a skimmer and do a few mods and get to perform like a $1000 skimmer ainstead of wasting all that cash upfront.

 

[SlowCobra]

Companies sell things planning on longevity and proven performance to coincide with that longevity. That certainly does not mean there is no room for improvement. And that improvement does not necessarily mean that you are shortening the life-span of the product.

 

[JCTewks]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10478386#post10478386 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SlowCobra
Companies sell things planning on longevity and proven performance to coincide with that longevity. That certainly does not mean there is no room for improvement. And that improvement does not necessarily mean that you are shortening the life-span of the product.

I really think that most companies want to get a product on the shelf that looks like it kicks butt, and hype the crap out of it until everyboy wants one....they don't really care about longevity or"proven" performance. There are definite exceptions though.

And I agree that most mods do not shorten a products life...some may actually make it last longer. If you can mod a pump to have more air and less watts with the same PF, then your newly modded pump will prob last longer than a stock one.

On a slightly different rant...Most skimmer ratings and performance numbers are exaggerated, if not flat out lies!!

 

[JCTewks]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10477380#post10477380 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kodyboy
if you can get that sort of air out of those pumps more power to you, and if you can why in the world does octopus not make them that way in the first place?

If they made them that way in the first place...that's a lot of labor, which, even in china, means a pricier product for you, the end-user.

 

[SlowCobra]

On a slightly different rant...Most skimmer ratings and performance numbers are exaggerated, if not flat out lies!!

They aren't lies, just figures that the engineers obtained in a perfect world in perfect settings using a scale slightly different than the rest of us. :eek2: