Bad batch of Instant Ocean? Alkalinity through the ROOF!!!
- Thread starter Megalodon
- Start date
Megalodon - Yes they called my house, but I was off doing all the wedding plan things so it will have to be later this morning when the world wakes up on this side of the planet.
Do me a favor, have an extra cup of coffee this morning and wait till I am able to call them. I would prefer you don't get them in a cranky mood before I have the chance to see if this can be smoothed out and find out if they were able to determine what, and maybe where the problem is.
It sure would be nice if they can replace my cleanup crew and 6 line wrasse, but I will wait with patience to see what our talk will produce.
Thomas
P.S. If anyone is reading this in the wee hours of the morning and you have any suggestions on what to ask, I'm all ears, you know like. Have you been able to determine if this was truly a bad batch of salt? Is there a lot number conected with it?.. blah blah.
Do me a favor, have an extra cup of coffee this morning and wait till I am able to call them. I would prefer you don't get them in a cranky mood before I have the chance to see if this can be smoothed out and find out if they were able to determine what, and maybe where the problem is.
It sure would be nice if they can replace my cleanup crew and 6 line wrasse, but I will wait with patience to see what our talk will produce.
Thomas
P.S. If anyone is reading this in the wee hours of the morning and you have any suggestions on what to ask, I'm all ears, you know like. Have you been able to determine if this was truly a bad batch of salt? Is there a lot number conected with it?.. blah blah.
NewMariner
Reef Tank Aficionado
Thomas you might ask those things, and if they have narrowed it down to the new buckets or old buckets........
I'm Canadian so I know I'm not subject to such laws. Here we believe, if it's a fact and it isn't in the courts, we can say it. I thought America was the same but I guess it's a bit lawsuit-happy down there so that's fine. Nuts, but fine.
Actually, I'm perfectly happy stating anything that I know to be a fact. That was the whole point of my disclaimer: I stated everything that I knew to be a fact, and also stated which things I did not know to be a fact, but had only heard from others.
Actually, I'm perfectly happy stating anything that I know to be a fact. That was the whole point of my disclaimer: I stated everything that I knew to be a fact, and also stated which things I did not know to be a fact, but had only heard from others.
MiddletonMark
Premium Member
Randy, I thought your posting [and help] on this was perfectly done. It's as close to a scientific write-up as any post on RC I've ever seen has been.
Great job, as you verified [very well, I might add] the problems these guys had with their buckets. I think everyone had to stop and say `Well, these guys were doing it right - and the salt was the problem certainly not the human' plus it seemes very carefully tested on your part.
Maybe you have it written up here, but it might be a good idea just to have a little sticky on the Reef Chem section on `how to post test results' as I learned a lot about from yours.
Plus the differentiation between what you could verify and not ... perfectly done IMO.
--
Megalodon and Thomas ... let us know how it works out for you.
If IO totally stiffs you, maybe that's a good thing for us all to know. I hope they'd give you something for your livestock - but doubtful. At LEAST I'd hope they give you some [verified good] salt for free or something to offset this.
Please let us know - and kudos to you both for taking the time to send Randy samples, deal with all our questioning of your methods - and for going the extra mile to save the livestock you can. Thanks too to Randy for doing us all this service.
Great job, as you verified [very well, I might add] the problems these guys had with their buckets. I think everyone had to stop and say `Well, these guys were doing it right - and the salt was the problem certainly not the human' plus it seemes very carefully tested on your part.
Maybe you have it written up here, but it might be a good idea just to have a little sticky on the Reef Chem section on `how to post test results' as I learned a lot about from yours.
Plus the differentiation between what you could verify and not ... perfectly done IMO.
--
Megalodon and Thomas ... let us know how it works out for you.
If IO totally stiffs you, maybe that's a good thing for us all to know. I hope they'd give you something for your livestock - but doubtful. At LEAST I'd hope they give you some [verified good] salt for free or something to offset this.
Please let us know - and kudos to you both for taking the time to send Randy samples, deal with all our questioning of your methods - and for going the extra mile to save the livestock you can. Thanks too to Randy for doing us all this service.
Reply from Instant Ocean-Aquarium Systems
Reply from Instant Ocean-Aquarium Systems
I just got off of the phone with Aquarium Systems.
I talked to Bob Studt the cheif tester of my sample of salt. It seems that they really were not able to test it or rather that once they started to test it they saw what was happening and saw no point in continuing. There was no disscution as to whether or not I may have been at fault, and very little admittence as to how wide spread this may have been. I gave him all the pertinant information including dates listed on the bucket and where I purchased it. I explained the alkalinity reading to Bob in exact numbers. He agreed that the high alkalinity was a problem. But he had not had exact numbers. Who really knows?
I seems that my salt sample resulted in a company meeting, with employees and managment, as they became quite concerned with what was happening. I was told that they had a retraining of employees as a result.
Here is what they are going to do for me.
1. Replace the salt
2. Replace my clean up crew and 6 line wrasse.
So I am going to give IO another try as they will replace the salt, however, lesson learned, always check the first batch of a new salt.
Glad to report a happy ending.
Thomas
Reply from Instant Ocean-Aquarium Systems
I just got off of the phone with Aquarium Systems.
I talked to Bob Studt the cheif tester of my sample of salt. It seems that they really were not able to test it or rather that once they started to test it they saw what was happening and saw no point in continuing. There was no disscution as to whether or not I may have been at fault, and very little admittence as to how wide spread this may have been. I gave him all the pertinant information including dates listed on the bucket and where I purchased it. I explained the alkalinity reading to Bob in exact numbers. He agreed that the high alkalinity was a problem. But he had not had exact numbers. Who really knows?
I seems that my salt sample resulted in a company meeting, with employees and managment, as they became quite concerned with what was happening. I was told that they had a retraining of employees as a result.
Here is what they are going to do for me.
1. Replace the salt
2. Replace my clean up crew and 6 line wrasse.
So I am going to give IO another try as they will replace the salt, however, lesson learned, always check the first batch of a new salt.
Glad to report a happy ending.
Thomas
That's great that there looking into the problem, and good for you that they've agreed to reimburse you. That's more than I expected. 
MiddletonMark
Premium Member
Good news!
And moreover, it's great they took you very seriously; almost beyond expectations that they replaced your livestock.
Thanks for the updates, I hope this is the last such story we all hear. Nice follow up!
And moreover, it's great they took you very seriously; almost beyond expectations that they replaced your livestock.
Thanks for the updates, I hope this is the last such story we all hear. Nice follow up!
toddpolish
New member
wow, 7 pages dedicated to this unfortunate occurance. Well, I haven't read every reply, but read a couple pages, and well...something has been happening to me too regarding IO. It seems that nowadays every time I mix up new salt to do water changes (~8gallons) and airate it for 24hrs, I get that chalky white film on the sides and bottom of my bucket too.
The last time I did a water change(less than 2weeks ago), the container I used to mix the water in was extremely filmy white on the bottom, so I added everything in the container except the bottom layer to the tank. The next day, my Tomato clown was dead. This is not the first time that this chalky white stuff has appeared after mixing. A couple of times before this, I've added the water to the tank, it clouded up, then a couple hours later, it was clear again.
Not sure if this had anything to do with my tomato clown dying, but my other fish survived (scooter, firefish, sixline, and gramma).
I have a 200g bucket of IO and this is the 2nd bucket I've used since I started this hobby. I have another brand new 200g IO bucket that I'm almost ready to open. Hope this one turns out different.
I do not check ALK on my mix. I will tonight when I mix up more saltwater (I'm curing LR in separate containers and have been doing many water changes).
The only things I test for when making a new batch of salt water is TEMP and Salinity. I would have assumed everything else to be ok. hmmm....
(I took pics of the filmy white stuff on my powerhead and container the day my clown died and can post later tonight)
just thought I'd add my experience.
The last time I did a water change(less than 2weeks ago), the container I used to mix the water in was extremely filmy white on the bottom, so I added everything in the container except the bottom layer to the tank. The next day, my Tomato clown was dead. This is not the first time that this chalky white stuff has appeared after mixing. A couple of times before this, I've added the water to the tank, it clouded up, then a couple hours later, it was clear again.
Not sure if this had anything to do with my tomato clown dying, but my other fish survived (scooter, firefish, sixline, and gramma).
I have a 200g bucket of IO and this is the 2nd bucket I've used since I started this hobby. I have another brand new 200g IO bucket that I'm almost ready to open. Hope this one turns out different.
I do not check ALK on my mix. I will tonight when I mix up more saltwater (I'm curing LR in separate containers and have been doing many water changes).
The only things I test for when making a new batch of salt water is TEMP and Salinity. I would have assumed everything else to be ok. hmmm....
(I took pics of the filmy white stuff on my powerhead and container the day my clown died and can post later tonight)
just thought I'd add my experience.
Wow, Very interesting thread, Im glad the company is doing something about this, both internal and for the customer. Just a note for others, the barcode number listed earlier is as an above poster said, its a product identifer, there is usually another alpha numeric that will be the batch/date code.
Apparently they do not put batch numbers on the buckets, I asked about that, really was not given any other answer on it other than the companies that bulk order the IO salt may place their own lables on them. There was one on mine for Petsmart with a date of 07/??/03 can't remember exact date and am not at home right now.
Strange though you would think that they would use a batch number.
Thomas
Strange though you would think that they would use a batch number.
Thomas
EnglishAl
In Memoriam
This a question for Randy.
In light of the problems reefers have been having with IO salt (and potentially other brands) what tests should we now be doing when mixing salt to verify that we have a good batch? I've seen many posts at RC about checking water parameters, but only for PH and temperature.
Perhaps for the benefit of us all you could post a regimen for mixing and testing our water prior to adding to our tanks. Being a newbie I know I for one would paste this to my fish room wall!!
Cheers
Alan
In light of the problems reefers have been having with IO salt (and potentially other brands) what tests should we now be doing when mixing salt to verify that we have a good batch? I've seen many posts at RC about checking water parameters, but only for PH and temperature.
Perhaps for the benefit of us all you could post a regimen for mixing and testing our water prior to adding to our tanks. Being a newbie I know I for one would paste this to my fish room wall!!
Cheers
Alan
Megalodon
Clowning Around
I'm sorry...
I'm sorry...
That wasn't directed to you Randy. I would never judge you... you're one of my favourite scientists. I was actually referring (a little too vaguely) to some of the electronic communications I got advising me in friendly ways to maybe watch what I was saying for legality purposes. I thought nothing on here had been slander or liable against any companies and was all in fact fair comment.
Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢m very pleased with the outcome of Thomasââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢ situation. I just woke up from bed so I'm going to phone Aquarium Systems soon. So I phone that 1-800 number in Ohio and ask for Bob Studt? Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢m thinking this may have to wait until Randy receives my salt sample via mail in a week. Thanks all.
:rollface: :rollface: :rollface: :rollface:
I'm sorry...
That wasn't directed to you Randy. I would never judge you... you're one of my favourite scientists. I was actually referring (a little too vaguely) to some of the electronic communications I got advising me in friendly ways to maybe watch what I was saying for legality purposes. I thought nothing on here had been slander or liable against any companies and was all in fact fair comment.
Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢m very pleased with the outcome of Thomasââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢ situation. I just woke up from bed so I'm going to phone Aquarium Systems soon. So I phone that 1-800 number in Ohio and ask for Bob Studt? Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢m thinking this may have to wait until Randy receives my salt sample via mail in a week. Thanks all.
:rollface: :rollface: :rollface: :rollface:
In light of the problems reefers have been having with IO salt (and potentially other brands) what tests should we now be doing when mixing salt to verify that we have a good batch?
To avoid this particular problem, I suggested this in a stickied thread in my forum:
If you are using Instant Ocean, please be aware that there is the possibility that some bad batches of Instant Ocean may be on the market.
If you are using Instant Ocean (as I do), I'd advise you to look at the water before you use it. Shortly after mixing (say, 30 minutes), it may be very cloudy. Over time this cloudiness settles out to a large amount of white silt on the bottom.
If you see this happen, don't add it to your tank. I would, however, appreciate hearing about it if it happened to you.
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=251507
As discussed above, this problem is relatively easy to see because of the precipitation and the fact that we can easily measure alkalinity. Suppose magnesium were too low, or strontium too high, or bromide too high, etc etc. Then we'd be stuck (and maybe we get stuck all the time )
To avoid this particular problem, I suggested this in a stickied thread in my forum:
If you are using Instant Ocean, please be aware that there is the possibility that some bad batches of Instant Ocean may be on the market.
If you are using Instant Ocean (as I do), I'd advise you to look at the water before you use it. Shortly after mixing (say, 30 minutes), it may be very cloudy. Over time this cloudiness settles out to a large amount of white silt on the bottom.
If you see this happen, don't add it to your tank. I would, however, appreciate hearing about it if it happened to you.
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=251507
As discussed above, this problem is relatively easy to see because of the precipitation and the fact that we can easily measure alkalinity. Suppose magnesium were too low, or strontium too high, or bromide too high, etc etc. Then we'd be stuck (and maybe we get stuck all the time
)
That wasn't directed to you Randy.
No problem. I just didn't want people to think I was a wimp (even though my attorney wife always suggests that I should be far more cautious)
No problem. I just didn't want people to think I was a wimp (even though my attorney wife always suggests that I should be far more cautious)
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