Bought my first two clowns - one died in QT

Civicman86

New member
Well I purchased my first two clowns on Sunday. Did a proper acclimation and they seemed to be doing well. This morning before work i checked on them and all seemed to be fine
Went down tonight to relax and watch them for a bit and found one dead and stuck to the filter suction pipe.

Got the fish out and inspected him. He had lost most of his color and his eyes looked very washed. No other visual signa that I noticed.

I immediatly took an ammonia reading which is still at 0. The other fish looks to be doing well, although he wont eat the new spectrum flakes I had put in (i assume this could be normal for newer fish?). He darts towards the flakes as if he is going to eat it l, then turns away.

Anyways, should I chalk this up to just a weak fish? I didnt check nitrates but can...figured ammonia was the real parameter to check first. Maybe he was being bullied? Last night they were inseperable as they swam around the tank like wing men.

Real question is should I get another small clown to try to get a pair or just leave it at one?

The tank is a 10g. Has a cheap HOB filter (using filter flosss from the main tank as a source for bacteria) and small 80gph pond pump pointing straight up to ripple the water. All params were good before putting fish in. 0 ammonia, 0 nitirite, and very small amount of Nitrate (just enough to see a color difference).

Thanks.
 
Anytime you have a death or something go wrong, check all your water parameters.
What test kit are you using to test your water?
How did you do the acclimation? drip?
What kind of clowns?
Where did you get your fish from? Regular LFS?
So other than not eating properly your other clown looks ok? I would never buy a fish from an LFS if the fish isnt already eating. ( I always ask them to feed the fish in front of me)
You can definitely get another clown, but I suggest going over everything once more to eliminate something that went wrong in your tank as a suspect, otherwise the new clown might meet the same fate.

What size is the main tank by the way?
 
Anytime you have a death or something go wrong, check all your water parameters.
What test kit are you using to test your water?
How did you do the acclimation? drip?
What kind of clowns?
Where did you get your fish from? Regular LFS?
So other than not eating properly your other clown looks ok? I would never buy a fish from an LFS if the fish isnt already eating. ( I always ask them to feed the fish in front of me)
You can definitely get another clown, but I suggest going over everything once more to eliminate something that went wrong in your tank as a suspect, otherwise the new clown might meet the same fate.

What size is the main tank by the way?

I'm using an api kit. I will check all params this afternoon and post back with them. Clowns came from a lfs (they only sell saltwater). Main tank is a 75g with 20g sump.
 
How did you acclimate?

Is this a QT tank or your display?

Typically if its a QT tank you match salinity with the bag, float for 10 minutes to adjust temp, then dump the fish in, that's a proper acclimation procedure. Drip acclimation can actually kill the fish with ammonia. As soon as you open the bag to air, ammonia starts to build up.

Sometimes fish just die for no reason. If your ammonia was 0 nitrites can be slightly elevated(not as dangerous as ammonia), and for fish our test kits don't go high enough for nitrates before they become lethal.

Have a read through this for proper acclimation procedures and why drip acclimation isn't recommended anymore.
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1959576
 
How did you acclimate?

Is this a QT tank or your display?

Typically if its a QT tank you match salinity with the bag, float for 10 minutes to adjust temp, then dump the fish in, that's a proper acclimation procedure. Drip acclimation can actually kill the fish with ammonia. As soon as you open the bag to air, ammonia starts to build up.

Sometimes fish just die for no reason. If your ammonia was 0 nitrites can be slightly elevated(not as dangerous as ammonia), and for fish our test kits don't go high enough for nitrates before they become lethal.

Have a read through this for proper acclimation procedures and why drip acclimation isn't recommended anymore.
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1959576

This is really only for fish that are shipped and been in a bag for longer than say 10 hours. When the bag is sealed and the pH changes, ammonia toxicity is lowered -yada -yada-... long story :lolspin:

For a fish that was bought through the LFS, likelihood is that it only spent an hour or 2 in the bag. (buy fish, drive home, acclimate to temp). Certainly not enough to cause the process above and cause the fish to create enough ammonia in the bag for drip acclimation to be dangerous.

Though I do prefer the floating the bag and just put cups of tank water into it for a good hour,maybe 2 until the salinity matches. It's just much quicker though and it seems to not cause harm to the fish. I take longer (closer to the 2 hour mark) with more sensitive fish and I "drip" with invertebrates. ONLY if LFS bought though.

A death that quick on a fish means that it was either already about to die, or it got a huge shock somehow. Bad acclimation being number 1, bad food... Another possibility is the QT being contaminated with something (though toxins would have probably killed both). So yeah, sometimes fish just die :/

Keep an eye on the surviving fish, definitely check those parameters though.
 
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I have had this happen in the past too. The fish most likely didn't starve to death if he was recently just put in the tank. Fish can go days without eating. That being said, if they are not eating the food you are serving, find out what food your LFS was using. Your new fish will most likely go for it after a short while. LRS and Marine S are 2 that I am able to get all of my newly purchase fish to eat.
Good luck.
 
Clowns can come in with brook, velvet, and/or uronema. Also did the fins look like they were ragged? Some possibility that he was killed by the other clown. If they are not already a bonded pair, there is no guarantee they will become a bonded pair.
 
So the fish were purchased and acclimation process started roughly 30 minutes after being bagged. I let the bag float for 10-15 mins to match temps with the QT tank NOT the DT. I then added roughly a 1/4 cup of water at 6 minute intervals from the QT to the bag for approximatly an hour (stopped when I had a little more than double the water than starting with. QT salinity matched the DT salinity - is this not the correct process?

The QT and all equipment is brand new. I used 90% RO/DI water and the remaining 10% was from the DT (also a new tank that was recently finished cycling). I took a small amount of filter floss from the main DT and put it in the filter housing of the QT.

The fins did not look ragged nor did he have any other visual indications of being beat up. And as I said that, at least when viewing, they were never aggressive towards each other. If this happens again in the future Ill snap a picture. Maybe some of the more experienced eyes can see something that I'm overlooking??

They came from a tank where there were probably 20 clowns (false perc) together. We randomly just picked two.

Ill check params as soon I get home this afternoon. I hope that it was just a fish that was already sick. It just sucks that it had to literally be the first fish (well 1 of 2) that was purchased for my setup.

Thanks everyone for the replies. Ill post an update after doing all the tests.
 
It sounds to me like you did everything right. My guess would be that you just chose the wrong fish.

To entice them to eat - frozen brine are almost always a sure thing, especially if you soak them in Selcon for a few minutes before feeding. I prefer NLS pellets over flake. It comes in several different sizes so you can get pellets appropriately sized to the fish.
 
I would wait atleast several weeks before buying another clown to make sure this one is healthy, then u csn purchase a smaller one and to try psur it.
 
I'd go ahead and get another ---it'll be coming from the same tank, so anything fish B was exposed to, fish C will be exposed to. Pick a healthy one with perfect fins and gills. Put them in together: do TTM. If they get sick, treat both. If they both survive, good: you've got a pair.
 
It sounds to me like you did everything right. My guess would be that you just chose the wrong fish.

To entice them to eat - frozen brine are almost always a sure thing, especially if you soak them in Selcon for a few minutes before feeding. I prefer NLS pellets over flake. It comes in several different sizes so you can get pellets appropriately sized to the fish.

I would agree and would not hesitate to get another one if you wish. I would suggest the new clown to be smaller than your current one if possible.
 
Sorry to hear about your clownfish :sad2:

Thanks everyone for the replies. Ill post an update after doing all the tests.

Please do! I'm curious to know what your pH, Specific Gravity and Nitirites are!

Billdogg is right - clownfish don't particularly like flake food (at least mine don't care for it that much, anyway). Get some high quality frozen food (brine, miss, Rod's Food) to entice him to eat.

You CAN get another clown (most do just fine in pairs) when you're SURE all your water parameters check out okay. I personally wouldn't do it before then.
 
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crappy luck...i qt/ttm my first 2 clowns in a 5g home depot bucket lol

my clowns will eat flakes but they arnt really excited about it. they prefer pellets and frozen mysis or brine, shoot anything frozen really.
 
Sorry to hear about your clownfish :sad2:



Please do! I'm curious to know what your pH, Specific Gravity and Nitirites are!

Billdogg is right - clownfish don't particularly like flake food (at least mine don't care for it that much, anyway). Get some high quality frozen food (brine, miss, Rod's Food) to entice him to eat.

You CAN get another clown (most do just fine in pairs) when you're SURE all your water parameters check out okay. I personally wouldn't do it before then.


Ok so here are the params on the tank...

Salinity: 1.024 (store water was 1.023)
PH: 8.2
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 5
Ammonia: 0

I went ahead and purchased another fish. There were not many to choose from but ended up with one slightly larger than 'fish b'. My thought was he may be older/stronger and less likely to be bullied and i didnt see the recommendations on here to go smaller. 'Fish b' is pretty small himself..

They are now both in the tank and ver similar to before they hang out right next to each other. 0 aggressive behavior so far.

Also i ended uo purchasing some new spectrum 1mm pellets and brine shrimp mixed with some algea (cant remember the exact name). Both fish would eat the brine. 'Fish b' was not interested in the pellets but the new one was.

Ill post back in a few days for an update. Thanks again everyone for the insight!!!!
 
get some selcon to soak the fish food in...you can also try entice or the garlic stuff to soak food in...might get the picky eaters to eat.
luckily I've never experienced any of the problems some people have during qt..almost all my fish ate fine and were active..
i did have a yellow watchman gobie that wouldn't eat during qt/ttm. he would nibble mysis here and there but for the most part he was just freaked out. after like a month i decided just to toss him in the main tank and hope for the best. he's a fat *** now
 
Ok so here are the params on the tank...

Salinity: 1.024 (store water was 1.023)
PH: 8.2
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 5
Ammonia: 0

I went ahead and purchased another fish. There were not many to choose from but ended up with one slightly larger than 'fish b'. My thought was he may be older/stronger and less likely to be bullied and i didnt see the recommendations on here to go smaller. 'Fish b' is pretty small himself..

They are now both in the tank and ver similar to before they hang out right next to each other. 0 aggressive behavior so far.

Also i ended uo purchasing some new spectrum 1mm pellets and brine shrimp mixed with some algea (cant remember the exact name). Both fish would eat the brine. 'Fish b' was not interested in the pellets but the new one was.

Ill post back in a few days for an update. Thanks again everyone for the insight!!!!

Parameters are ok. Clownfish are very hardy fish when healthy. Frozen food is the best kind of food IMO.
I always feed Emerald cubes or mysis cubes. (PE mysis is great too). Soak them in garlic extract and go from there.

Always ask the LFS to let you see the fish eat before purchasing in addition to inspecting their bodies for anything out of the ordinary. I always pick the ones that go for the food more readily.
 
Well something is not right with the tank or fish. The new fish i purchased died tonight (came in the room and he was laying on the bottom gasping). This afternoon he was doing great and eating. Fish b is still alive and appears to be doing well. Inchecked params again and all are the same.

My only thought right now is oxygen or disease? Not sure why it would only affect one of two fish bith times.... im running a hob filter (floss for media only) and a small jaabeo pp 333 pump pointed straight up to get sone surface ripple. Since this i have lowered the tank water level so the hob filter water falls into the water causing bubbles. I also moved the pump up to surface level to aggitate more aggressively.

For now im pausing on another fish and will most likely try another store (i love the chocolate percs this place has though). This is pretty frustrating right out the gate. I just hope fish b survives through it all and makes it to the DT.

What else should I be doing? I didnt medicate right off the bat becuase i read it can stress fish further. Should i start medicating day 1? Should I shorten acclimation time?

I took photos this time of the fish after passing. Ill post them tomorrow to see if you all see anything odd.
 
Well something is not right with the tank or fish. The new fish i purchased died tonight (came in the room and he was laying on the bottom gasping). This afternoon he was doing great and eating. Fish b is still alive and appears to be doing well. Inchecked params again and all are the same.

My only thought right now is oxygen or disease? Not sure why it would only affect one of two fish bith times.... im running a hob filter (floss for media only) and a small jaabeo pp 333 pump pointed straight up to get sone surface ripple. Since this i have lowered the tank water level so the hob filter water falls into the water causing bubbles. I also moved the pump up to surface level to aggitate more aggressively.

For now im pausing on another fish and will most likely try another store (i love the chocolate percs this place has though). This is pretty frustrating right out the gate. I just hope fish b survives through it all and makes it to the DT.

What else should I be doing? I didnt medicate right off the bat becuase i read it can stress fish further. Should i start medicating day 1? Should I shorten acclimation time?

I took photos this time of the fish after passing. Ill post them tomorrow to see if you all see anything odd.

take pictures of your set up as well. Maybe do a big water change
 
Here are the pics of the fish and setup...

Keep in mind this was after i lowered the water level and moved the pump. I had the water level just below the output of the hob filter and pump in the bottom pointing up. There was quite a bit of surface movement between the two so i felt it was ok.









 
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