can my water look clear and still be "dirty"

[sikpupy]

Okay, this is another crazy question brought to you by Sikpupy, but....

Can I have crystal clear water but it still be dirty? Maybe not dirty as in bad dirty, but, heavy in nutrients, like phytoplankton, rotifers, critter eggs etc.

I plan on trying a trickle filter with a mesh that will catch only big particles of detris. I don’t like filter socks, they are too small for collection as far as I am concerned. Does anyone have an idea what kind of media would; could let small things like rotifers through while catching other ...crap? I am not sure if this is even possible, so, thought I would ask.

 

[fishysteve]

I don't think there is a way to filter out live things from "other ...crap" if they are the same size.

 

[stanlalee]

absolutely. visual indication is virtually useless unless the tank is really mucky.

 

[fishysteve]

If you use a fuge with a deep sand bed the other crap that you don't want would be consumed by the bed.

 

[fox2589]

or taken out by the skimmer

 

[Juruense]

What issue are you trying to address exactly OP?

 

[IslandCrow]

You can absolutely have crystal clear water and still have high nutrients. All the algae that tends to grow as a result will tend to yellow your water, but nitrates don't have a color. Enough phytoplankton will of course make your water green (or brown depending on the strain), but there's generally enough stuff in your tank to consume it pretty quickly, and you really don't want so much phytoplankton it turns your water a different color anyway. As for other nutrients, like rotifers, eggs, etc., most of them get eaten pretty quickly, so you should never have so many that it significantly affects water color.

Personally, other than my protein skimmer, I'm not too concerned about physical filtration. You can have your crystal clear water without it. Some carbon in a reactor or a DIY filter sock made out of ladies pantyhose will let stuff like rotifers through, and remove most coloring organics from the water. I feed my tank live rotifers every night, along with oyster eggs, cyclopeeze and occasionally other coral food a few times a week. I swear it doesn't even look like there's water in my tank most of the time.

 

[sikpupy]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14247414#post14247414 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Juruense
What issue are you trying to address exactly OP?

A few things. First, I have a few Goniopora's that need phyto and such as listed in the original post. Second, I want, as everyone else does, nice clean/clear water. Some phyto and some rotifiers and other stuff floating I would "think" (but alas not experienced) my tank would still be clear.

I want to keep as much of the good stuff floating as I can while trying to filter out the bad stuff. Again, not sure if that is possible. I have a MSX skimmer ready to go (off line now) but now I am hesitant on using it if it will strip the phyto and such I want to keep in the tank for the corals (which I dont have much of now). Zoas, gonis, xenia (so I have heard) benifit from "dirty" water, which is my choice of corals.

So, like said, trying to clean the dirty dirt, while keeping phyto rich "dirty" (if I should not really be using that word) water.

maybe 1 week with no filtering but on weekends or something?

 

[Juruense]

You cannot see phyto in the water. Rotifers and pods and such will typically only come out at night

 

[Peter Eichler]

All you're really going to do by using a trickle filter is drive up nitrates, which I doubt is the kind of "dirty" you want. If you're worried about rotifers and phytoplankton you ened to be culturing them and/or purchasing them to feed to the tank since you're not going to sustain and substantial population in closed aquaria no matter what type of filtration you have.

If you want a little higher DOC content that some of the corals you mention may or may not benefit from you're probably better off with limiting protein skimming.

 

[sikpupy]

Hmm, as long as I cleaned the filter once a week, how much nitrates could I develop? Have a 20L with a 204 canister and never had a problem, yet..........just curious.

 

[Peter Eichler]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14250998#post14250998 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by sikpupy
Hmm, as long as I cleaned the filter once a week, how much nitrates could I develop? Have a 20L with a 204 canister and never had a problem, yet..........just curious.

Clean all you want, it won't really matter. Trickle filters create nitratres because of how efficient they are at breaking down nitrite and ammonia, not because they trap dirt. I'm not sure how that ever got stuck into people heads as the cause for nitrates and why not to use trickle filters...

 

[fishIZneat]

Can a woman look pretty and still have AIDS?

:strooper:

 

[fishysteve]

fishIZneat - Nice.
:lol:

 

[sikpupy]

So, basically air/water exchange = high nitrates. So, sounds like I should just drop a tube from my drain into my skimmer compartment with no skimmer, let the crud settle and just vacume it out, with also maybe using a thin sponge (preferably large cell in nature) in between my baffles, maybe shoved an inch down to keep most air off of it? That should filter the water and keep most critters alive? I know there is no 100% win win, but thats all I can come up with this early in the morning, lol.



fishIZneat, inside joke or speaking from experience? :eek1:

 

[IslandCrow]

In nature, most zooplankton comes out at night, and that's why many corals primarily feed at night. Phytoplankton, I'm not too sure about, but here's what I'd suggest. Feed your phytoplankton at night (if for no other reason, that's when your zooplankton are active and feeding). Before you add the phyto to your tank, turn off your skimmer. If you'd like, leave it off all night (though you will miss out on the oxygenation and overall gas exchange it provides). I'm guessing that phytoplankton in a densely packed environment like a home aquarium gets consumed quite rapidly. Also, if you grow your own phytoplankton, it's pretty cheap to add the stuff every night, so even if you only turn your skimmer off for a few hours, you're not going to lose much phyto to your skimmer when you turn it back on. I follow the exact procedure for broadcast feeding rotifers or other coral food.

In short, I feed my corals fairly heavily, but I don't expect any of it to necessarily be in the tank the next day. For the most part, it's going to get eaten by something in the tank or removed by my skimmer. I wouldn't count on either rotifers or phytoplankton multiplying in your tank and providing a constant food source.

 

[sikpupy]

Thanks for the input IslandCrow, I will definitely incorporate that into the regimen. Yes, I plan to start growing some Nano phyto soon.

In a trickle in/out 16" x 12" fuge, what are the chances of keeping happy Phyto, zooplankton, and roti's going? Could we get Phyto, zoo and roties to grow in a DT tank if the tank was not filtered and had no predators? A heavily filled tank with corals and such could devastate such populations but I don’t think my tank of zoos and a goni could make a big dent. But again, I could be wrong . Then again, roti's have veracious appetites I hear. What if we took out the roti effect and started with the phyto first?