CARBON usage, methods, advice.....

[SCIFI_3D_zoo]

I've been rinsing this stuff for quite awhile and I'm still not comfortable putting it into my tank yet. I wanted to get more information first. (I got the Acq.Pharm.Inc. one in a cardboard milk box container.)

1st.. how do you guys rinse carbon? I just put it in my bag to rinse. And it's messy and it sucks. My fingernails are still black.

2nd.. are some brands better than others? One company was trying to say being more dusty is a sign of a better quality carbon. Can't find that now.. saw it on MarineDepot. ESV says the hardness of their products decreases dust.

What about.. is carbon necessary? I know there are a lot of benefits but it's not detrimental to not use it in a fully stocked reef is it? Assuming of course you have a lot of other means of filtration, skimmer, etc.

I'm reading about all the dangers. Could burn your corals with UV light by de-yellowing the water. If you haven't used it in awhile start with 1/3 doses. That's another question to ask. Also.. I read another one say not to use any additives with ENZYMES b/c it could break down your carbon.

3rd... How often do you guys use it? I can't find it now but I just saw one product say to use it for a few days only every month. Most say 3-4 weeks. But to use it continuously forever. I think in the past I was running it 30 days every 3 months. Not all the time.

Ah.. I found it... KENT MARINE "IMPORTANT: You can use as any other carbon, but best results will be obtained by using any carbon for only 3 days per month or so. (This is because any carbon will continue to remove trace elements long after it is totally plugged with organics.) Use only enough to remove the color from the water."

SEACHEM MatrixCarbon:
"While all carbons contain phosphate, regardless of false claims to the contrary, MatrixCarbon has the lowest leachable phosphate content of all major carbon brands tested. "
.... they also claim their carbon typically lasts 3-6 months??

 

[bertoni]

1. I use a metal food strainer.

2. I use SeaChem Matrix, but the ROX0.8 has gotten good reviews.

3. I put a cup or so in the reactor, and try to remember to change it out once a month or so. I doubt the carbon will last 3-6 months because of fouling and loss of adsorption site, but I don't know of any data on what the "best" dosing scheduling might be.

 

[coralfragger101]

I have found an effective way of rinsing carbon that doesn't get your hands all black.

Get yourself a large mouthed quart mason jar.
Take a filter bag and cut it so you have a single flat piece.
Dump carbon in mason jar.
Secure filter material over top of jar with a rubber band.

I use RO/DI water for rinsing. You can add the water through the filter material and just turn it over to empty. I rinse until the water is clear. I normally then let the carbon sit in RO/DI water (still in the mason jar) for a couple of days (changing the water once a day). This will help remove phosphates from the carbon. Since I'm using RO/DI water which has nothing in it this will not use up any of the carbons ability to pull organics.

 

[rishma]

I do what what bertoni does. The Matrix takes very little rinsing.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

how do you guys rinse carbon?

I just run the media bag in tap water until it runs clear.

What about.. is carbon necessary? I know there are a lot of benefits but it's not detrimental to not use it in a fully stocked reef is it? Assuming of course you have a lot of other means of filtration, skimmer, etc.


It may make the water clearer, may bind some organics (toxins, etc) that are not skimmed and may help export excess metals that are bound to organics.

I use carbon 24/7.

 

[Michael]

cant see the problem to be honest scifi, i stick it under the tap until it runs clear, its fizzing by then usually and ready to go in the tank or reactor, ive never had black fingers or clouding problems with carbon, honestly, there just isnt a problem with it, suprised you have trouble, hope it goes ok from now on

 

[Michael]

double post again

 

[SCIFI_3D_zoo]

Well... I'm sure some brands clean easier than others. I'm just getting sick of rinsing it and... I ain't putting it in my tank even if just a little bit of dust is coming off of it. Just wanted to make sure there wasn't some more simple methods out there. It's taking so much water I think tap water is best... then a final RO/DI rinse.

Kent Marine is saying on their website also that their product Matrix will last 3-6 months under normal conditions.

SeaChem talk about how it can remove trace elements... and how Purigen may be better to use. This is what KENT was talkinga about. Long after all organics are absorbed carbon will continue to remove trace elements. That's why they said to just run it for 3 days only. I'll have to email them and verify this.

I don't want to hurt my corals though running it once in awhile if I should be doing it 24/7. Or maybe it's ok if you run it 1/3 of your dose to not shock the system. I'm sure these companies would rather us use it all the time and sell more of it. But I'll email them and see what they say. **Their website doesn't work and I can't find an email via Google either.**

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Kent Marine is saying on their website also that their product Matrix will last 3-6 months under normal conditions.


Don't believe it. That's like saying your calcium supplement treats 7,000 gallons, without saying how much it raises calcium in those gallons.

SeaChem talk about how it can remove trace elements... and how Purigen may be better to use.

Again, unsupported assertions. Carbon binds trace metals largely BECAUSE they are bound to organics that bind to the carbon, not because they bind directly from seawater. Purigen is binding organics. There is no evidence that it binds less (or more) trace metals).

FWIW, removing trace (and possibly) toxic metals may be beneficial or detrimental. It depends on who you ask.

 

[SCIFI_3D_zoo]

What about the other SeaChem quote about running it for 3 days only?? Right in the middle of my post.

Can't running carbon all the time be hard on clams and some other corals? And I wonder how hard it can be on sps if you don't run it consistently... every month... 24/7... every other month.. quarterly, etc.? So much conflicting info out there. RIght now I'm still not gonna mess with it. And I'm gonna go back and compare data from all the TOTM and other articles. I mean.. the latest TOTM... he doesn't even have a Fuge.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I don't believe that either. Many people use it 24/7. I do.

How is it hard on them?

And I'm gonna go back and compare data from all the TOTM and other articles. I mean.. the latest TOTM... he doesn't even have a Fuge.

There are many paths to success.

 

[SCIFI_3D_zoo]

I remember reading that somewhere... running carbon 24/7 could be hard on some inverts/clams or something?

 

[Michael]

yep theres alot of us running it 24-7, i cant remember not running it 24-7, ive had not problems ever to be honest, perhaps its because ive had no problems i just love the stuff, it may not be doing anything but because ive had no problems and all my tanks have always looked crystal clear i have to assume carbon is partly responsible, if not it certainely does not hurt or damage anything, i personally beleive it combined with skimming is great for the marine aquarium, and carbon run 24-7 in freshwater is great for that as well, if its not broke dont fix it, so i intend to keep running it 24-7

 

[SCIFI_3D_zoo]

What brand do you use... and how often are you changing yours out?

 

[Michael]

i use d&d, i agitate it or wash it every 7-10 days and change it with new every 4 weeks ish, sometimes i use cheap stuff as well, i just keep an eye on the phosphate reading, the small stuff is best for the reactor, however i do use the d&d in there as well, however sometimes i use the d&d in a sock in the sump too, basically it alters depending on what im doing with the phosban, if running that i use the carbon in a sock, if not running the phosban i stick the carbon in the reactor, but theres always some going all the time

 

[SCIFI_3D_zoo]

Speaking of socks... how often do you guys change filter socks in your pumps? Every few days, weekly, etc. Do you use one all the time?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I usually recommend that folks change carbon about once a month. 2 weeks if you are more aggressive or do not skim or use a small amount. Mostly, when to change carbon is guesswork.

I do not use any filter socks.

 

[BigJay]

Given the relatively low concentration of trace elements (thus the word "trace"), they are by definition less likely to get picked up in the carbon adsorption process. Any trace element that does get removed will just get replaced by fresh seawater during regular water changes.

It's also my understanding that larger molecules are more likely to get "stuck" in carbon first. Trace elements are smaller than the more complex and abundant organic molecules present in a marine aquarium such as carbohydrates, sugars, fish excrement, dissolved food, slime, chemical toxins from corals, soap residue from your hands, etc.

Randy wrote a really nice article about organics in a marine aquarium here: http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-10/rhf/index.php Thanks Randy, I learned quite a bit from it.

Just thinking about it makes me want to change my carbon out, and I run it 24/7 as well. :eek1: I buy the huge buckets of the good lignite carbon from bulkreefsupply for almost nothing, and I change it out every couple of weeks.

 

[gkyle]

I run carbon (bulk kind) in large media reactors continuously, switching one out every three weeks, rotating schedule. I run GFO (again bulk) in a third reactor that also has some carbon to keep the GFO from caking up. All I do to rinse is dump it in and direct the output of the reactor into a sink until it runs clear. I run ozone to keep the water clear and a bit more pure, an I run the carbon primarily to help with chemical warfare.

Basically, I just do whatever Randy says because he seems a bunch smarter than me

 

[watergator]

I just rinse it in tap water and add it to a filter sock in my sump. My water definitely appears more clear when I add carbon. I only use about two cup fulls for 200 gallons...

Also, check out the Tank Of The Month. Under Filtration, he mentions that he uses carbon & why.