Caribbean Biotope Seagrass Tank

This is inside the partitioned left end.

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The small black output is from the canister filter, which is running. The large white plumbing is from the Reeflow pump, which is not running. I'm anxious to try it out, but not until everything is well rooted.

It occurred to me, I could put bio pellets in the canister…
 
I've used mosquito netting. That blocks the big ones but the gnats get in. I have a giant shower curtain (really) but it's not completely sealed and bugs are great at finding gaps. I can't seal the garage - wife needs to park or the tank goes...

I had a school of chromis but they fought to the death (who knew?).

I can't completely block the tank - still need fresh air and a way to remove the humidity from the surface. My LFS recommended a monster fan to keep the bugs from being able to land on the DT or sump water surface. Still considering that option.

Hey, if you ever run out of plant food - open a window. LOL

Have you tried meshes? Like the kinds we use for filter socks? A mesh with, for example, 100 micron sized openings should be able to keep gnats out (though I must admit that I have never tried to measure gnats in microns, so maybe I am overestimating their size...)
 
Thanks, BlueFyre. So far, so good!

I think I've seen a little new growth in some of the grasses. The red macros are holding up well, with some die off. The Botroyocladia (red balloons) seams to be the most fragile, losing balloons every time I mess with it. I'm done with moving it now, so maybe it will recover. Also the Caulerpa Racemosa (var. Peltata) has broken up a bit. These two plants have released lots of 'pioneers' around the tank. With luck, some will grow into new plants!
 
I had another idea. What if I skipped the external refugium altogether, and instead put it in my unused overflow.

Downside is I have to raise my water level a half inch or so, which will put it around a half inch from the top of the tank. Theoretically, it shouldn't be a problem, as I have a Spectrapure auto top off setup that works pretty reliably. Plus all my water is in the tank-no sump. But one half inch doesn't leave much room for error. And the cabinet's 'hood' comes down a couple of inches below waterline, so fish swimming at the very top and front of the tank will be hidden. It doesn't have the capacity of the vessel I was planning to use, but since the whole tank is already like a refugium, it should be fine.

Upside is the simplicity-no pumps or plumbing to fail. It would seem that as overgrown as refugiums can get, it would be a constant battle to keep its plumbing clear of obstruction. I think it would look pretty cool and natural to have chaeto and ulva growing into the tank at the top! I imagine the ulva would be constantly cropped by herbivorous fish, so it shouldn't get out of hand. Excess Chaeto would need to be pruned by me. I bet it would be very productive, so close to the light, so I'd get some nutrient export. Probably could trade for store credit at my LFS (local fish store).

With the coast to coast width, pods would have plenty of room to get out and back into it. It would simulate lagoonal shallows. I just wish I'd placed the overflow about an inch lower…
 
Honestly, I see a dedicated refugium/sump as an asset. The ability to add/remove/modify with flexibility and without impacting the DT is so valuable.

If I could, I'd make my sump as big if not bigger than my DT. It's like an iceberg, you see the peak, but there's a lot more going on underneath.
 
Thanks, JLynn. I'm not going to get too excited about the minimal growth, because it was probably fueled by reserves, rather than anything I may have done. Now when/if I get substantial growth, THAT will get me excited!

I've done no water testing, excepting salinity, so I have only my observations to go on. I expect that the nitrogen cycle is progressing, probably rather slowly, with pods and dying plants (and no fish) the main source of ammonia. Plus the plants compete with the bacteria for nutrients. So it may be a rather long process.

What does get me a little excited is that (so far) I have no (green or blue-green or red) microalgae visible. So considering the amount of light I'm using, that's a good sign, I think. I do see some diatoms on the DSB surface and the fake wall-both of which have silica sand for fuel.

I've yet to use my plant tabs. I haven't decided whether to use them now, or keep them ready, like an 'ace up my sleeve'. Maybe I'll add another dose of 'seeding ammonia' for my 'fishless' cycling. It's been about a week since I added the first one.

I've found an online source of Caribbean live rock, that I can get as little as 25 pounds. That will be an ammonia source while it cures, so I think I'll wait a month or two to add it to the tank. This should give it time to amass some 'carrying capacity', and hopefully prevent a microalgae bloom. I could easily cure it outside the tank too, if i want.

In the meantime, I'm thoroughly enjoying the 'can't stop staring at the tank' phase!
 
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I agree with you on all counts, Karim.

However, what's good for my tank may not be good (practical, easy) for me. As I said at the very beginning of this thread, I'm taking into account the most important species in this equation-me. The name of my particular species is 'lazyass aquariast'.

So if I find a way to make my 'job' easier, and it doesn't negatively impact the tank, I'll likely go that route. Since my tank is a large 'display refugium', I think I can pull it off. And there are some real pluses too. I love the coast to coast opening, that allows pods to 'come and go', rather than a 'one way, down the drain and you're out' scenario of 'regular' refugiums.

I'd love to hear more thoughts on this idea!
 
I'm a member of the same species. I've only done one water change since starting my tank three months ago even as I battled hair algae.

I have an end to end too (8ft), but being lazy works better with the sump. It's less work IMO.

In terms of pod / plankton mobility, you're right. Even though I've seen pods blown threw my return without harm. The best case would be a same level sump (sideways instead of above/below). That was the design for my outside tank but the TX weather disagreed with my boldness.
 
Good to meet a fellow 'species'. And don't forget we're also 'cheapass aquariasts' too! One other species characteristic I have is a love of 'low tech' solutions, or as I like to call them, 'elegant solutions'.

I do have a 'side sump', with the partitioned left end of my tank. It's not a refugium, but it gives me room for heaters, etc. And again, given my display will have refuges built in, I think I can do without a separate vessel, which for me, is less work/worry.

So, the question is whether this 'solution' is beneficial for my tank, as well as beneficial for me. No additional plumbing, lighting or pumps-that's all good for me. Maintenance should be very easy. Remove Chaeto right from the top of the tank, shake out pods, and bag it for store credit. I think that's about it!

I'd love to hear thoughts on the functionality (or lack thereof) of this 'coast to coast overflow conversion to a built in refugium' idea. Looks good for me. Is it good for my tank?
 
One thing you might not have considered is that, this way, the chaeto and ulva will get MUCH less flow, which would (theoretically) greatly decrease their capacity to remove nutrients. In turn, that would decrease their growth, which would decrease your potential profits.

Also, when you keep it AIO, you make it more difficult for yourself if, in the future, one or more of your fish starts to bully the others/is a victim of mass bullying. If you have a separate refugium, then in that situation, you can easily separate out the problem fish or victim fish by putting them in the refugium until you can either sell them or set up a separate tank for them.

External refugiums have another use, too: you can easily put your trimmings from the DT in them and propagate your (display quality) macro algae to sell online.

Lastly, consider the plankton. The overflow for your tank may be large, but it is small compared to the size of the external refugium. I don't know how large you were planning on making that refugium, but I suspect it is at least 10g larger than the overflow, and probably a whole lot more. This decrease in volume means that the amount of plankton you can potentially produce is exponentially decreased! And while you might consider it a benefit to have plankton picked off through predation with no effort on your part, it makes it more difficult to know how much your fish have been eating and whether or not they have been eating at all. Not only that, but it makes it much easier to over and underfeed your fish with store-bought foods. Underfeeding is bad for obvious reasons, and overfeeding just might be worse, because that can easily wreak havoc on your water chemistry and potentially cause an algae bloom or, at its most drastic, crash your system.

...Oh, and it means you will lose flow in your DT, because that is one less pump. I imagine you have your pumping scheme all figured out, and having to change it to compensate for the loss of flow could be a headache-inducing problem. So, for the above reasons (and probably some others that I haven't thought of yet), I suggest that you don't scrap the external 'fuge.

On a different note, I was just watching Jamie Cragg's MACNA talk, and he mentioned that they use yeast to feed their bacteria, which I thought you might be interested to know. And if you haven't already watched the recording of his speech, I highly suggest you do so ASAP! It is a really fantastic presentation, and it was so interesting to learn more about the work they are doing at Project Coral.
 
All good points. Thanks, JLynn. Let me address each. But first let me say, I'm not arguing which method is better. I am 'exploring' the idea that given my tank (already a large refugium), what are the pros and cons of this reduced refugium idea.

On the reduced flow; yes it will be less, but not as much as you'd think. I have raised my water level up to the height needed to try it. The powerhead in the fake root 'blows' water down the length of the overflow, including inside it, so there will be some flow. Also, the purpose of this refugium is more for pod production than nutrient uptake (my DT will do that), so if Chaeto production is low, that's just less work for me.

I don't know what AIO means, but I do plan to have a quarantine tank running continuously.

I never had trouble without a refugium for my fresh water planted tank's excess plants, which was extremely productive. I'd prune, throw 'em in a bucket, and head to the fish store. Or I'd simply compost them. But it would be a plus, for sure. I guess I could use the quarantine tank for that.

I agree plankton production will be decreased. But I see no difference between my knowledge of how much is fed to the tank with either method. And I don't expect either method would produce so much food as to pollute my tank. I think of it as 'snacks' for the fish, between my 'manual' feedings.

Water flow will not be reduced in the DT. Increased actually. I was planning to use my canister filter as my pump for it (an external refugium), but now it'll just stay exactly as it is, for CO2 injection, different media, and additional flow. I'm sure I will have to throttle down my Reeflow pump, once I am able to turn it on. No plumbing scheme changes will be necessary.

Where might I find this MACNA presentation?

So, now that we've discussed the differences between the two 'methods', can we now just talk about this 'built in' idea?
 
More thoughts on the built in refugium:

One thing I realized is, if I try it and it doesn't work, no biggee. I can just go back to my original plan, and go external. So why not give it a try?

Probably the biggest limitation is the size. It's about 5 feet wide by an inch and a quarter deep, by five inches high. Not much space. I'll probably put about an inch of substrate in the bottom too. In my favor, the plants won't need to be confined to it. They can creep out into the display, which I think will look cool. I think the plants I've chosen (chaeto and ulva) will be okay with it. Will it provide a suitable place for pods to eat and procreate? Pods are tiny, so there should be enough room for them. Will there be enough food? I presume it will be encrusted with microalgae, plus pods love ulva. And that close to the light, it may even grow phytoplankton!

A fish could get in there, and I might never know. That's why I built it with clear end panels, so I could see down the length of it. But now it's covered in foam. I could make a window, but the plants inside will block the view anyway. So, some visual inspection will be needed, from above, and taking fish counts occasionally will help.

I guess the first thing I should do is put some plants in there and see how they do. If they thrive, it's on to step two. If they die, it's back to the original plan. Seeing them in place will also help me to visualize other possibilities I haven't thought of.
 
Another thought, and this one's kind of big. If the pods can come and go as they please, what's to keep them in there at all?

Would plentiful food do it? Would they feel protected/refuged in there? Can they find their way back if they leave? I think if I can provide them with proper conditions for them to flourish, it will work. If not, I've just added more pods to my tank…
 
New Growth Pics

New Growth Pics

This one is blurry, but you can make out the bright green new growth on the caulerpa racemosa.

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Given the newness of the tank, I'll take it as a good sign.
 
Three things to note in this one.

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Diatoms on the sand and rock, new growth in the seagrass indicated by bright green lower blades, and the chaeto balls are growing, or at least expanding.

Also, I think I found a hitch hiker. It's a small wormlike creature on a seagrass blade. Looks kind of spikey/warty. If I had to guess, I'd call it a baby sea cucumber! If I can find it again I'll try to get a pic.
 
AIO is short for all-in-one tank. Typically this refers to tanks like Innovative Marine Nuvo or Fluval Spec, but I figured it was appropriate here, as well.

You can find the talk on ************ or on... I think it is Bulk Reef Supply's youtube channel. I have been watching them as ************ puts them up, so I'm not sure about where to find it directly on youtube. Basically, this year's MACNA talks were all filmed and Bulk Reef Supply (?) has been posting them in groups of three every week. ************ has been posting them as well. All of them have been pretty great, but Jamie Cragg's one is my favorite so far. He is one of the people working on propagating corals via sexual reproduction, and they are the first people to date to purposefully induce a spawning in a coral. That was achieved last year, and this year will mark their second set of successful spawnings. It is all breaking-edge stuff, and it is so exciting! From the looks of it, it is something a dedicated aquarist could do at home. Maybe someday soon we will be trading captive bred corals!

Another thought, and this one's kind of big. If the pods can come and go as they please, what's to keep them in there at all?

Would plentiful food do it? Would they feel protected/refuged in there? Can they find their way back if they leave? I think if I can provide them with proper conditions for them to flourish, it will work. If not, I've just added more pods to my tank"¦

I hadn't thought of that. And you know, I don't know that anything would keep them there... Copepods are not particularly smart (understandable, given the size of their brains), and I don't know if they are capable of remembering things like where food is, much less where safety is. To the best of my knowledge, unless food or danger is in their immediate vicinity, they don't really notice it (and sometimes not even then). Amphipods are a somewhat different matter; they instinctively head for shelter, as they are not pelagic creatures. Copepods are both pelagic and benthic, so they can head for shelter, but I don't know if they would remember to go back to a refugium. I think they would probably just head for the nearest shady/sheltered spot, which may or may not actually be safe.
 
In my experience, there is little you can do in an open flow system (no nets or filter bags) to contain pods. They go where the flow goes. The largest populations are in mesh structures that protect them from the movement of the water and traps food for them (Chaeto, open sponges, etc...).

Experinentation is great, but if the ratio of DT to control environment (sump/refugium) is very large, your control will likely be limited. My DT to sump was ~ 2 (380:180). It was frustrating to do simple things like water changes. For this and other reasons, I added an 80 gallons aux sump bringing my ratio to 1.5 which is manageable. The ideal IMHO is still 1.

Foolproof is 2... But wow. It could hold everything in the DT in case of a disaster and allow an orderly recovery. Of course, that begs the question of which is the DT?
 
Tank is looking great!

How is the foam holding up and I'm interested to know if it has changed color or not - other than diatoms or algae.

Is is completely covered in the resin? Are there any parts of the wall that are exposed to air above the water line? - color difference?

-Sam
 
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