Caribbean Biotope Seagrass Tank
- Thread starter Michael Hoaster
- Start date
JZinCO
New member
Michael. I've been looking up options for lighting the 'next tank' with led. In case you decide to tinker again, here are my thoughts.
I'm more than likely to continue using marsaquas or reef breeders on my next tank.
But, I've personally been interested in the Aquaticlife Halo pendant led for lighting as an alternative to the kessil caliber lighting. I also might try the 21ledusa 10,000K 50w flood lamps. Might be worth looking it as they are cheap, returnable, and more similar to less-blue MH color temperatures.
MGP, I like your little hack there. I've been using 6500K 60w (actual not equivalent) flood lamps for my mangrove and macroalgae in the sump. I find I prefer the spread of rectangular flood lamps over par38 flood-style bulbs (even when sold with the same degree lens).
I'm more than likely to continue using marsaquas or reef breeders on my next tank.
But, I've personally been interested in the Aquaticlife Halo pendant led for lighting as an alternative to the kessil caliber lighting. I also might try the 21ledusa 10,000K 50w flood lamps. Might be worth looking it as they are cheap, returnable, and more similar to less-blue MH color temperatures.
MGP, I like your little hack there. I've been using 6500K 60w (actual not equivalent) flood lamps for my mangrove and macroalgae in the sump. I find I prefer the spread of rectangular flood lamps over par38 flood-style bulbs (even when sold with the same degree lens).
Right on, McPuff. I checked out their whole line on their website - very impressive stuff.
Thanks Kevin! I'm lovin' the new bulb. The tank's looking good except for the UV rig I have going. Maybe I could swallow my pride and post a pic or two. We'll see.
Thanks for your thoughts, JZ. I'll check those out. It's been fun shopping LED lights, even if I'm not ready to buy. I think it's a good idea to get familiar with what's available.
Thanks Kevin! I'm lovin' the new bulb. The tank's looking good except for the UV rig I have going. Maybe I could swallow my pride and post a pic or two. We'll see.
Thanks for your thoughts, JZ. I'll check those out. It's been fun shopping LED lights, even if I'm not ready to buy. I think it's a good idea to get familiar with what's available.
McPuff
New member
Just checked these out. Look pretty cool and very small footprint. I could easily do 6 of these for my 300 for just about $350. I have sent an inquiry to the company, but it seems like a good option potentially. I may just buy one for my lagoon to test it out. The warranty is pretty great, just not sure if they are dimmable at all. These are the kind of reef lighting solutions I'd like to see more of. In my opinion a reef light does not need to cost three arms and 5 legs to be effective. Black box LEDs have shown this. More industrial solutions may not look as elegant but if they get the job done then I'm happy (my lights are/will be hidden anyway). :0)
JZinCO
New member
Yeah, the lamps are a few $ more than typical HD home-security lights but the price differential is because less common LED chips cost more. This company has the same markup as typical retail, which is likely less than markup for specialty hobbies (we're paying for product development costs plus parts and labor).
Honestly though, I don't know anyone who has ran basic lighting like this so it is risky in that sense. Ask the vendor is they are UL rated, because that would be a step above marsaqua.
Hope I'm not derailing. It's just I prefer a whiter color temp and I find there are few lights out there that aren't crisp with high color rendition at a <$300 range. On top of that I will have a 72x30 footprint to cover so I'm not sure if fixtures with 24x24 light spread will do. Or maybe with a 30" surface-to-sandbed depth they might spread enough? But still I need enough PAR to grow sea grasses. I find it confusing and frustrating so it's funny that you enjoyed your window shopping Michael. Michael, did you find any LED fixtures that caught your eye?
sam.basye
New member
Those led flood lights are the cheap generic ones you can buy on eBay for half of what they're asking in 21led. They're really bright, but not sure how long they'll last. I bought a 100w (2 x 50w chips) flood light for my landlords house and one of the drivers failed after a few months of use (4ish hours of use a day). It caused one of the LED's to flicker/strobe.
JZinCO
New member
Sam, I think youre referring to a different company's lights. I couldn't find any other companies with this style housing using chips with >6500K temp. And 21ledusa's options range from 10w to 50w.
Still good to know, and it should be noted that others often replace the drivers on this style of light with a more reliable driver. Again not defending 21ledusa. They do have mixed reviews (as do all of the chinese fixtures) but I'd rather criticize particular companies because a competitor might use different components, even if from the same factory.
Still good to know, and it should be noted that others often replace the drivers on this style of light with a more reliable driver. Again not defending 21ledusa. They do have mixed reviews (as do all of the chinese fixtures) but I'd rather criticize particular companies because a competitor might use different components, even if from the same factory.
Derail away! I welcome the discussion. Since I've been looking around for this stuff, it's nice to find some right here on my thread! It's also cool to hear different points of view regarding cheap versus pricey lighting solutions.
I often lean towards the cheap side, but for this kind of thing, I'm feeling myself gravitating towards the fancy stuff. Having quality components like circuitry, controllers, reflectors, lenses, heat sinks, fans, and the LEDs themselves is a lot to consider. I also like the ability to change or replace components to get it 'just so', as well as being able to keep it running for years. I don't like to just throw stuff away and replace it. I've got a hot tub I've had for seventeen years. I've repaired and replaced components many times to keep it running. I get great satisfaction from that.
A few have caught my eye, but I'm not ready to buy anything. Plus I bounce back and forth between looking for something to replace my metal halide in my current tank, and looking for a setup for my next tank.
I often lean towards the cheap side, but for this kind of thing, I'm feeling myself gravitating towards the fancy stuff. Having quality components like circuitry, controllers, reflectors, lenses, heat sinks, fans, and the LEDs themselves is a lot to consider. I also like the ability to change or replace components to get it 'just so', as well as being able to keep it running for years. I don't like to just throw stuff away and replace it. I've got a hot tub I've had for seventeen years. I've repaired and replaced components many times to keep it running. I get great satisfaction from that.
A few have caught my eye, but I'm not ready to buy anything. Plus I bounce back and forth between looking for something to replace my metal halide in my current tank, and looking for a setup for my next tank.
SereneAquatic
New member
For your next tank, do you have a plan of action for how you will go about populating it? I'm curious about the order that you would work in since there is not already an existing ecosystem in place. Would you start with the micro level and work up, macro down, or a mixture that work in concert to keep things balanced?
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sam.basye
New member
Here's a link to a very similar one for half the price:
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/332266192577
The only difference I see is the front metal cover screws into the front side instead of the backside. And chip color options..
From my experience, the quality is all the same for the "œChinese" ,for the lack of a better word, low buck lights. I'd make an exception for the black box versions as they are pretty good quality-wise. I've owned a few of the reefbreeders knockoffs and they are very good for the money.
You're right about the company being able to put the units together them-self with better internals, but it's a crap shoot when it's not specifically listed which leads me to believe it's generic.
I ended up with a similar model that had 2 50w chips. They're great for the price; on eBay, but not sure how well they'd do over an aquarium.
Build quality break down:
I took the broken one apart to identify the issue to see if I could easily fix it. The power supply was what died. They ended up giving me a refund. I think I paid $47 for two 100w flood lights (w/o plugs). I'll have to check.
The housing is a piece of molded aluminum
The reflector is a very thin molded aluminum- thinner that a pie pan and very shallow; maybe 1" high
Glass front cover is dyed black around the clear opening and has a silicone lip piped along the upper surface edge that creates the seal when the metal rim is screwed into the unit.
Generic LED screwed to the housing and power supply glued to housing
External hardware all slowly rusted living outdoors after 6mo.
Light never leaked or condensated and was never more than warm to the touch which I couldn't believe because LED's get hot!
I'm not sure how well the extremely wide reflector would penetrate or work without a lot of spillage unless mounted very close to the water, which could start the rust issue.
The 21led website probably puts them together with various parts which is why they offer different chip colors. It would be very easy to swap out with a different colored chip if you wanted to do it yourself.
My perfectly calibrated Kelvin eye would call their "œ6500" a 10k in the hobby or cool white for the rest of the generic led world. lol
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/332266192577
The only difference I see is the front metal cover screws into the front side instead of the backside. And chip color options..
From my experience, the quality is all the same for the "œChinese" ,for the lack of a better word, low buck lights. I'd make an exception for the black box versions as they are pretty good quality-wise. I've owned a few of the reefbreeders knockoffs and they are very good for the money.
You're right about the company being able to put the units together them-self with better internals, but it's a crap shoot when it's not specifically listed which leads me to believe it's generic.
I ended up with a similar model that had 2 50w chips. They're great for the price; on eBay, but not sure how well they'd do over an aquarium.
Build quality break down:
I took the broken one apart to identify the issue to see if I could easily fix it. The power supply was what died. They ended up giving me a refund. I think I paid $47 for two 100w flood lights (w/o plugs). I'll have to check.
The housing is a piece of molded aluminum
The reflector is a very thin molded aluminum- thinner that a pie pan and very shallow; maybe 1" high
Glass front cover is dyed black around the clear opening and has a silicone lip piped along the upper surface edge that creates the seal when the metal rim is screwed into the unit.
Generic LED screwed to the housing and power supply glued to housing
External hardware all slowly rusted living outdoors after 6mo.
Light never leaked or condensated and was never more than warm to the touch which I couldn't believe because LED's get hot!
I'm not sure how well the extremely wide reflector would penetrate or work without a lot of spillage unless mounted very close to the water, which could start the rust issue.
The 21led website probably puts them together with various parts which is why they offer different chip colors. It would be very easy to swap out with a different colored chip if you wanted to do it yourself.
My perfectly calibrated Kelvin eye would call their "œ6500" a 10k in the hobby or cool white for the rest of the generic led world. lol
JZinCO
New member
Thanks Sam for your thoughts. Certainly alot to consider. Like I said, it gets confusing fast, dealing with all of the variety of fixture setups and price differences. My only experience is: the cheap stuff (e.g. current usa marine orbit) that I discarded within a year and the decent low end stuff (running two marsaqua and two unbranded blackboxes of which one channel died). Looking for something that'll actually last the 50,000 or so hour lifetime of the diodes, while being affordable, is harder than it ought to be.
Might just pony up for the sb reef photon torpedo
https://sbreeflights.com/photon-torpedo/53-photon-torpedo-commercial-led-light.html
Might just pony up for the sb reef photon torpedo
https://sbreeflights.com/photon-torpedo/53-photon-torpedo-commercial-led-light.html
sam.basye
New member
Thanks Sam for your thoughts. Certainly alot to consider. Like I said, it gets confusing fast, dealing with all of the variety of fixture setups and price differences. My only experience is: the cheap stuff (e.g. current usa marine orbit) that I discarded within a year and the decent low end stuff (running two marsaqua and two unbranded blackboxes of which one channel died). Looking for something that'll actually last the 50,000 or so hour lifetime of the diodes, while being affordable, is harder than it ought to be.
Might just pony up for the sb reef photon torpedo
https://sbreeflights.com/photon-torpedo/53-photon-torpedo-commercial-led-light.html
You sir are in the same boat I was in. Lol Except I'm in the little dinghy pulled behind the yacht now. Haha
I had to google how to spell yacht.. Lmao yaght, yaught? ******
I started out making my own led lights over the 5 gal, then bought a used current USA orbit marine led, then a new evergrow it2040 16" black box, then a used evergrow it2060 24" black box where I replaced all the led's, then another used it2040 16" for the new cube and now decided to splurge on a used radion g2 with g3 pro upgrade and reeflink. Haha I might upgrade to a g3 pro if I can find a good deal!
Slowly making my way up to the elite level. Haha
Send me one of those torpedo light-speed photon blasters while you're at it! I'll pm you my address. Lmao
Good question, SereneAquatic.
I don't really have any real plans for the next tank. It's more like day dreams really. But if I were, I'd start with dirt, sand, live sand and live rock. Then detrivores, snails and plants. Pretty much the same advice I gave to you.
I wouldn't worry too much about not following my recommendations. We all come into this hobby from different angles, and any of them can be successful. Right now, I'd say prepare for your algae invasion. Everybody gets one. It's how you handle this ordeal that will set the tone. Best of luck! Let me know if I can help.
I don't really have any real plans for the next tank. It's more like day dreams really. But if I were, I'd start with dirt, sand, live sand and live rock. Then detrivores, snails and plants. Pretty much the same advice I gave to you.
I wouldn't worry too much about not following my recommendations. We all come into this hobby from different angles, and any of them can be successful. Right now, I'd say prepare for your algae invasion. Everybody gets one. It's how you handle this ordeal that will set the tone. Best of luck! Let me know if I can help.
JZ, those SB reef lights are very impressive. Reading their info, they really seem to know their stuff, matching up spectrums to different needs. Even their fresh water plant fixtures look killer. I'm so stoked to learn of so many options I never heard of.
One thing I've noticed, is that some have gone through several cheaper options. In my experience, that road often ends up to be more expensive. Dat ain't me…
One thing I've noticed, is that some have gone through several cheaper options. In my experience, that road often ends up to be more expensive. Dat ain't me…
McPuff
New member
Thanks Sam for your thoughts. Certainly alot to consider. Like I said, it gets confusing fast, dealing with all of the variety of fixture setups and price differences. My only experience is: the cheap stuff (e.g. current usa marine orbit) that I discarded within a year and the decent low end stuff (running two marsaqua and two unbranded blackboxes of which one channel died). Looking for something that'll actually last the 50,000 or so hour lifetime of the diodes, while being affordable, is harder than it ought to be.
Might just pony up for the sb reef photon torpedo
https://sbreeflights.com/photon-torpedo/53-photon-torpedo-commercial-led-light.html
I suppose I could run 3 of the 500W torpedos over my 300gal. :0) Might have to run them at about 20% or less. Should get good lifespan with that intensity. :0)
JZinCO
New member
hahaha
Micheal, you may be interested in this.
I debated, considered radions xr15w pro, hydras 26, or Euroquatics Angel. All are roughly comparable and all would work. But I'm going to go with rapid led. They have one sleek fixture, the Corona (which replaced the Onyx). It'd cost around the same ($1200/3 units) and I like it but they partnered with a company for their controller and this company has not satisfied it's kickstarter backers. Considering that there are no physical controls on the unit and user-settings are stored on the cloud, the risk of a company going under and losing light control is unacceptable. Instead, I'm going with their DIY kit for 3 units in series and a 6-channel controller that doesn't require WiFi/WPS, all for under $1000. Based on your previous experiences with different bulbs and their unique spectra, I think you'd get a kick out of multi-channel control. It ought to do the trick. And for giggles, one can plug in lat/long to recreate seasonal sun cycles, as well as moon cycles. A Caribbean tank, just plug in Key Largo, FL. Even neater, their $200 controller plugs uses WiFi to plug in and replicate the real-time weather of a location. Of course those things are secondary. And hopefully the experience of soldering the light together will give the intimate knowledge needed when a component fails.
Micheal, you may be interested in this.
I debated, considered radions xr15w pro, hydras 26, or Euroquatics Angel. All are roughly comparable and all would work. But I'm going to go with rapid led. They have one sleek fixture, the Corona (which replaced the Onyx). It'd cost around the same ($1200/3 units) and I like it but they partnered with a company for their controller and this company has not satisfied it's kickstarter backers. Considering that there are no physical controls on the unit and user-settings are stored on the cloud, the risk of a company going under and losing light control is unacceptable. Instead, I'm going with their DIY kit for 3 units in series and a 6-channel controller that doesn't require WiFi/WPS, all for under $1000. Based on your previous experiences with different bulbs and their unique spectra, I think you'd get a kick out of multi-channel control. It ought to do the trick. And for giggles, one can plug in lat/long to recreate seasonal sun cycles, as well as moon cycles. A Caribbean tank, just plug in Key Largo, FL. Even neater, their $200 controller plugs uses WiFi to plug in and replicate the real-time weather of a location. Of course those things are secondary. And hopefully the experience of soldering the light together will give the intimate knowledge needed when a component fails.
That's sounds way cool JZ! Getting high end stuff for cheaper by DIYing is the ultimate combo.
Yes, the multi channel control of LEDs is a big attraction for sure. Recreating specific sun and moon cycles sounds amazing! You know what else would be cool, and I think I've heard of this, would be to recreate the path of the sun (and moon) across the tank. Light and shadows would change throughout the day, just like in nature!
I'd very much like to follow your progress on the DIY kit. Can you share your experience?
Yes, the multi channel control of LEDs is a big attraction for sure. Recreating specific sun and moon cycles sounds amazing! You know what else would be cool, and I think I've heard of this, would be to recreate the path of the sun (and moon) across the tank. Light and shadows would change throughout the day, just like in nature!
I'd very much like to follow your progress on the DIY kit. Can you share your experience?
My new fish came yesterday! Just five minutes before they arrived, my wife tripped and fell, fracturing her arm. So, with no other alternative, I had to leave the box unopened, and drive her to the ER.
Several hours later we returned home, and I began acclimating twelve fish that had been in rather small bags for much longer than is ideal. Long story short, all but one is accounted for, and I haven't found it dead, so it may just be hiding out. I'm crossing my fingers.
Whew! That was insanely stressful! I now have six chalk bass in one QT and five (or six) royal grammas in another. Both tanks are setup with hypo salinity conditions. Today they look good and are eating. If all goes well, they should be ready for the big show in the third week of February. Woohoo!
Several hours later we returned home, and I began acclimating twelve fish that had been in rather small bags for much longer than is ideal. Long story short, all but one is accounted for, and I haven't found it dead, so it may just be hiding out. I'm crossing my fingers.
Whew! That was insanely stressful! I now have six chalk bass in one QT and five (or six) royal grammas in another. Both tanks are setup with hypo salinity conditions. Today they look good and are eating. If all goes well, they should be ready for the big show in the third week of February. Woohoo!
sam.basye
New member
Dang, hope the wife feels better! You don't think she did it on purpose do you?... :scratcheshead:
She knew more fish were coming and knows how obsessed you are with the fish! Seems like a stunt my wife might pull... haha
Can't wait to see the new fishies swimming around in the display!
She knew more fish were coming and knows how obsessed you are with the fish! Seems like a stunt my wife might pull... haha
Can't wait to see the new fishies swimming around in the display!
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