Chaetodontoplus ballinae

[billybloo]

Hey People,

I doubt many of you have ever kept a Chaetodontoplus ballinae.... but does anyone know anything about them. I heard one recently sold (possibly on the black market) for upwards of $200,000 (us). I know they are only located in certain areas of Australia. It is also protected there.

 

[suta4242]

Just curious where did you see one getting sold?
Or could it have been a case of Chinese Whispers?

FWIW we don't allow any export of these and, to the best of my knowledge, even locals in NSW aren't allowed to keep them. But if theres any substance to this story then I guess people would be willing to go to extraordinary lengths to smuggle out this fish.

 

[billybloo]

heard it through the grapevines

 

[pacislandaqua]

Balls pyramid i think is where they are located, and is a closed area (from any type of fishing)

Not very likely one was caught and exported as AU has very strict export laws.. i doubt it would have slipped through the cracks... and very difficult to bring one on a plane internationally.

200,000 also sounds high, even for a real unobtainable fish.

 

[snorvich]

Well AU is very strict. But I have seen sea dragons make it to market. When I was diving in the area where they live, locals were very protective of the locations where they existed. Rightly so.

 

[copps]

Hey People,

I doubt many of you have ever kept a Chaetodontoplus ballinae.... but does anyone know anything about them. I heard one recently sold (possibly on the black market) for upwards of $200,000 (us). I know they are only located in certain areas of Australia. It is also protected there.

There has still never been a documented specimen of C. ballinae ever kept in captivity. It just does not make sense that one was recently sold... the documentation of this species was based on TWO specimens trawled off the Australian mainland in deep water, first in 1959 off Ballina, New South Wales. The second was taken in the 80s. That was it until the 1990s when this fish was discovered to exist in relatively shallow water at a ROCK less than 1000 feet long named Ball's Pyramid off Lord Howe Island, a few hundred miles off the coast of Australia. While there have been reports of this species off of the mainland, and undoubtedly there are populations in deep water, to this day this 600 foot long rock is the only place this species has been seen and photographed... and to this day a juvenile has never been documented!

Lord Howe is a UNESCO World Heritage Site... and so there is no collection of anything allowed. In addition to they are protected AS A SPECIES by the New South Wales government... double protection for this fish...

What makes it also highly unlikely that we'd ever see this fish are the logistics of it... even if you had an illegal collection expedition with unlimited funding it would be near impossible to pull off. For one, the currents at Ball's absolutely RIP! The couple of dive outfits based at Lord Howe offer dive trips there just two months out of the year (~January-February **usually**), and many people there during those months sit for a couple of weeks without an opportunity to get there... Ball's is also just 12 miles from populated and policed Lord Howe and is a small community that would be tough to avoid if you were collecting at Ball's... a logistical nightmare this would be for so many reasons! I think C. ballinae is safe for now...

Copps

 

[Yurivd]

Balls pyramid i think is where they are located, and is a closed area (from any type of fishing)

Not very likely one was caught and exported as AU has very strict export laws.. i doubt it would have slipped through the cracks... and very difficult to bring one on a plane internationally.

200,000 also sounds high, even for a real unobtainable fish.

I also think it is high if I was told $30000 then it sounds realistic

Here is all the legal stuff http://www.dpi.nsw.gov.au/__data/as...0/Ballina-angelfish-Primefact-163---final.pdf

From this it is a legal fish if collected in Queensland :fun4:

 

[copps]

From this it is a legal fish if collected in Queensland :fun4:

Yes Yuri... and if you find one in South Africa it would be legal too...:rollface: :frog:

 

[Yurivd]

Yes Yuri... and if you find one in South Africa it would be legal too...:rollface: :frog:

I am really positive

On a side note if the Australian government send a mated pair to frank . Thy an learn a lot about the fish and stop smuggling

 

[copps]

I'm sure they do exist in Queensland too, but has this been documented? How are you sure? It would be in the interest of whomever collects these to state that they got them in Queensland and it would be rather easy... but if paperwork were done properly I'm sure this would be investigated on a fish like this... reminds me of the supposed "seamount off Brazil" where Centropyge resplendens were found and collected...

 

[Yurivd]

I'm sure they do exist in Queensland too, but has this been documented? How are you sure? It would be in the interest of whomever collects these to state that they got them in Queensland and it would be rather easy... but if paperwork were done properly I'm sure this would be investigated on a fish like this... reminds me of the supposed "seamount off Brazil" where Centropyge resplendens were found and collected...

Lol yes the brazil resplendens is a good story

 

[copps]

Yes... and the kingi from Mozambique story... oh wait that's true! Anything can happen really... the rumors of Brazilian Centrropyge aurantonota off the coast of West Africa turned out to be true too!

Exporting a ballinae out of Queensland would cause problems, unless you could slip it by and perhaps call it a white and brown meredithi!

 

[Yurivd]

Yes... and the kingi from Mozambique story... oh wait that's true! Anything can happen really... the rumors of Brazilian Centrropyge aurantonota off the coast of West Africa turned out to be true too!

Exporting a ballinae out of Queensland would cause problems, unless you could slip it by and perhaps call it a white and brown meredithi!

LoL
If you want I know of two spots where you can see kingis in mozambique at ponta do ouro reef

 

[Mark]

Yurivd, which dive site? I was at ponta do ouro in 2008 and looked aimlessly for them. I dove Creche, Doodles, Pinnacles, Steps, and Kev's Ledge. No luck. The gemmatums were everywhere though.

 

[copps]

LoL
If you want I know of two spots where you can see kingis in mozambique at ponta do ouro reef

Get me to speak at IMACSA and you could show me!:fun4:

Yurivd, which dive site? I was at ponta do ouro in 2008 and looked aimlessly for them. I dove Creche, Doodles, Pinnacles, Steps, and Kev's Ledge. No luck. The gemmatums were everywhere though.

Mark, what population density did you see of gemmatum? "Everywhere" is relative and I don't believe you mean it like flavescens in Kona!

 

[Mark]

John, I didn't see any shoals, but would see singles and occasionally trios. No kingi's though, not even in Aliwal Shoals down in Durban. Bummer for me.