Clams and phosphate remover

[Keoki18]

This may be a worn out topic, but I am having an interesting problem. Recently set up a reactor containing continuum's captive phos w. I washed the media real well and added it to the system. The water became ever so slightly clouded, but that was to be expected with all the media I needed to use. This was all done in hopes of lowering my phosphate levels... which it did!

Now comes the interesting part. I have three clams in the system now. 2 crocea and 1 gigas (big boy). Over the weekend the two crocea are no longer extending their mantles, and are slightly closed. They are located far away from each other with different lighting, so the water quality is the only thing to blame. The gigas on the other hand is open and healthy. All the other corals are looking great.

Water parameters are stable:
Calc: 460 ppm
Alk: 172 ppm
Phos: 0.14 ppm
Sal: 34 ppt
Temp: 78-79 F
Am: 0 ppm
Nitrite: 0 ppm
Nitrate: 0.18 ppm

Thoughts?

 

[Sounds Fishy]

I am using Sea Chem,Phosguard beads shape product.On the label it warns that....some corals are sensitive to the dust the product may create,and so it really needs a good rinsing.I am assuming maybe your bi valves are reacting to the dust,if your using something similar?Just a guess....Have you a reading for Mg. ?

 

[Keoki18]

I would think that it would affect all the clams and not species specific, but again, I could be wrong.

Mg - 1350 ppm

 

[Sounds Fishy]

Anyway I hope they open up again for you...If the dust has been the issue they should be okay after you've filtered it all out.

 

[slief]

Sounds like the clouding was phosphate precipitate. Very similar to using Lanthanum Chloride. The results of which can be harmful to fish and clams as the precipitate causes issues in the fish gills as well as other filter feeding creatures like clams and anemones.

I don't think you should have had any clouding of the water if you used the stuff properly. Did you rinse the continuum's captive Po4 media in RODI per the instructions? Did you have the reactors effluent go out through a filter sock or some other sort of filter medium to capture the precipitate?

 

[Arthur1]

To add to others comments on rinsing the media, I use ferric oxide in some reactors and Phosguard in others. Regardless of which media is being utilized for phosphate absorbtion, it is rinsed with water and then a gallon or two of aquarium water is ran through it into a bucket and then that water is disposed of. Whatever it takes to reduce stress to our beloved inhabitants!

 

[tmz]

Sounds like the clouding was phosphate precipitate. Very similar to using Lanthanum Chloride. The results of which can be harmful to fish and clams as the precipitate causes issues in the fish gills as well as other filter feeding creatures like clams and anemones.

That sounds about right to me. Of course we don't know what's in it from the manufacturer's specs but I'd be wary of free lanthanum or another floculant moving into the water and fine particulates stressing filter feeders and fish. Rapid elimination of PO4 can also stress calms in particualr.

 

[Keoki18]

Hmmm.. You believe it to be precipitate? I have never heard of an absorbent media precipitating in the water column, but then again that doesn't mean your not right.

I slowed the flow down over the media and the water has cleared up. Clams were removed and put into a different system. All are open and healthy. The gigas still remains in good health. I did wash with ROdi, then ran with system water for 50 gallons (its a big system). I really believe that it was my ignorance in flow requirements for this media. I think is was just too fast that it was falling apart (not to bash this product in anyway). the dust most likely irritated the little clams, but not the big guy.

 

[tmz]

I don't know whether it's absorbent media based on alumina or iron or something else or some form of phosphate precipitant agent like lanthanum chloride. The fact that it generates heat when mixed with salt water per the manufacturer indicates a chemical reaction of some sort . The reaction of your clams is similar to those reported by folks who have issues with lantanum chloride dosing.

 

[Icefire]

It's the same as phosguard, Aluminium oxide.

It need to be really rinsed good.

 

[tmz]

Ok; if it is an alumina product , then dust/fines could be an issue in terms of the aluminum irritating the clams or acting like localized adsorbent sites.. A rapid decrease in PO4 can also hurt them. Sometimes improved water clarity occurs when using PO4 removers which results in increased light intensity .

 

[e048]

I've used phosguard and my clam seems to be fine I didn't really rinse it too well either

 

[techdef]

I've lost clams to that stuff before too. Won't use it again.

 

[karimwassef]

Maybe the gigas could cope better because of the enlarged intake, gills, etc... Might not choke on the fine dust as much as the little clams. Gigas also settle in sand because of their size, so maybe hardier with particulates than their gentle rock burrowing crocea cousins?

 

[Keoki18]

This is a bit late, but thank you for all your responses. The phosphate remover was.. removed. I lost one of the smaller crocea. Upon necropsy we found.. drum roll please..

Foreign fine particulate in the gills!

Looks like TMZ and karimwassef are the winners.

Turns out that even after washing the media very well, the media breaks down in higher flow. The absorbent substrate is bound by clay like materials that disintegrate if passed through too high. In short, this media works well in bags ran in slow flow, but not in reactors.

Whether it was the particulate itself that killed the clam, or the presence of aluminum so close to the gill that killed the clam, the media is definitely to blame.

 

[tmz]

Thanks for the follow up.

 

[azcrazy]

Had the same problem running pohosguard, but I alway thought it my reactor was faulty.

Now I know and it was removed the same day good think i didnt have any animals in the tank when that happen

 

[gus6464]

You have to try hard to kill a big Gigas. Remember the larger the clam the hardier they are.